Was Joe involved?

[Maryann123]

Haleigh went missing 2/9, not 2/16...

Also, I would be shocked if the "word" of Tommy and Misty have any weight with LE concerning Joe, without evidence that puts Joe there and a weapon of some sort in his hand. A LD, if there is one that was passed by someone, is not evidence and their verbal testimony cannot be believed by an stretch of the imagination, especially if it implicates Joe and relieves them from blame. If this were true, there would have been no reason to wait 15 months to tell this version. Joe is no more/less of a threat to them now than any other time, if that is their so-called reason. I just think Hope's sentence has them all scrambling to get something figured out and to try to get on the books as being the innocent bystander as they are finally recognizing they aren't going anywhere until LE gets what they want, the truth about Haleigh. I also think Tommy is motivated to try to make Lindsy believe he had little or no involvement and is a victim and will even let her think her kids are in danger to try to achieve this.

BBM
And the bold part is what makes me sick! Why do you think LE isn't offering Tommy a deal? In my opinion, it's because what he is saying is worthless. Maybe they don't want Werter to know that they don't believe a word Tommy's saying. Hopefully, LE knows who really did it, and they are not wanting to tip their hat.

 

[Quiche]

In the interview with his lawyer, Joe indicated LE seized the car he was traveling in, the clothes he was wearing, and all of his stuff. I don't believe there was any forensic evidence linking him to Haleigh.

He admitted too, that he hadn't met Haleigh, but was around her in a group of other kids. mo

 

[Trident]

I'm thinking JO was involved.
I'm thinking JO may have been the drug dealer RC supposedly ripped off
I'm thinking JO may have delivered the drugs from Tennessee and was supposed to be paid off with a gun.
I'm thinking said gun was not where it should have been when promised.
I'm thinking all hell may have broke loose after that, and no one could afford to open their mouths as to the whys and wherefores.

My opinion only

 

[Zoe Bogart]

How many people in Satsuma have declared their fear of Cousin Joe? Three, Five, Ten? Dozens upon dozens? Yet Joe lives 600+ miles away, without a vehicle, and they're afraid of him? "He's had dealings with gangs." Really? Have the "gangs" visited Satsuma on his behalf? There's something very wrong with this story.

Even if Joe were the biggest, meanest, drug-influenced man, I'd still have trouble believing everyone in the Cummings-Croslin mix is afraid of him. He hasn't been there in 15 months. He hasn't caused any problems for them. No shooting up the town, no toilet-papering their trees, no egging their mobile homes and houses. Nothing. Does he write threatening letters, make scary phone calls? It just doesn't work for me that he's such a threat - from two states away.

I'm having trouble picturing him doing the things they said he did that night. Sure, he could have gone in looking for a gun, he could have threatened them to not say anything. How in the world was he able to kill Haleigh with Tommy & Misty right there? How could he have forced them, or just Tommy, to help dispose of the body? How many weapons did he have? Why steal Ron's gun if he was already toting one? Remember, Tommy says he was threatened by a weapon. Was the weapon a knife? If it was just Joe doing the killing, the threatening, why couldn't one of them call for help on their cell phone - Misty, for instance, if she was left behind with Butterbean?

I just can't picture ONE guy being that forceful with TWO people if he had only a knife, or only a gun, while he was killing Haleigh, threatening them, and dragging all the paraphernalia down to the river - with Tommy being forced at knifepoint or gunpoint! Did Misty stay behind pretending to be asleep?

If Joe raped Misty and/or Haleigh, as Misty has claimed, was Tommy just standing by watching because Joe was threatening him with a weapon? Joe must be one heck of a guy if he could do all that with one hand holding that weapon on Tommy and/or Misty. :shakehead:

 

[oceanblueeyes]

In the interview with his lawyer, Joe indicated LE seized the car he was traveling in, the clothes he was wearing, and all of his stuff. I don't believe there was any forensic evidence linking him to Haleigh.

He admitted too, that he hadn't met Haleigh, but was around her in a group of other kids. mo

If LE didn't think he was there that night they would have no probable cause to get a search warrant to take his clothing and the vehicle he rode back in to TN. They would not have returned to interview him again if they felt he was not there. They would not have flown to TN recently to interview him again. He is involved up to his eyeballs imo.

If he threw away his clothing from the night Haleigh went missing what was there to find? He hitched a ride back with a friend in her vehicle.

IMO the last interview lasted a short 45 minutes even though LE had flown all that way. IMO, they just came out and told Joe it was just a matter of time before they would get him and his lawyer stopped the interview and stopped all communication between Joe and Florida investigators and now he is laying low waiting for the other shoe to drop, imo.

IMO

 

[Concerned Papa]

Tommy now claims Joe was there not to steal Ronald’s prized assault rifle, but to borrow it to go deer hunting at night, and when it wasn’t there, went wild and killed Haleigh, according to his lawyer, James Werter

http://www.artharris.com/2010/05/14/was-haleigh-cummings-killed-at-trailer/

Well allrighty now, I notice Tommy C has dramatically altered his previous “Joe Dun It” story. It seems the Ronald Cummings aided story of alligator feeding frenzies during Joe’s brief visit in late January and early February didn’t work out so well due to certain biological facts about dormancy in alligators during temperatures below 68 degrees F.

2010.04.30 All about alligators - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community


In the newest version, that outdoors loving Joe has traveled 639.48 miles (Mapquest) from Nashville, TN to Satsuma, FL to go DEER HUNTING!

AT NIGHT!

AFTER THE SEASON IN FLORIDA IS OVER!

AND DIDN’T EVEN BRING A GUN!

Being a hunter myself, I couldn’t help but be curious about why someone would leave the mountains of Tennessee, with legendary deer populations, and come to Florida for some hunting in a state that’s not typically featured on the cover of Outdoor Life for their deer hunting.

It struck me as being somewhat similar to someone from Florida going to Alaska to go to the beach.

Let’s put aside the fact that deer season in Florida closed on January 18, 2009 before he even left Tennessee. We’ll even put aside the fact that deer hunting is NEVER legal at night anywhere, anytime. We’ll set that aside because even though we have not a scintilla of anything other than the word of 2 proven liars who are in jail to the contrary, we do have a picture of an 19 year old kid on MySpace with what looks like it might be a gun! He just looks like the kind who doesn’t care about game laws!

(See Image Below For 2008-2009 Florida Hunting Season)

http://forums.tallahasseeoutdoors.com/Topic80-30-1.aspx

I went to a site called qdm.com (Quality Deer Management) to confirm or reject my perceptions about deer populations in the Nashville, TN area compared to the Satsuma, FL area. The site has a color coded map with this information for the entire United States.

According to the map’s legend, within 50 miles of Joe Overstreet’s home is some of the highest deer population in the country. For Putnam County and the surrounding area, there’s much less density to the deer population. I'm just not real sure why ANYONE who wanted to go deer hunting would leave Nashville and come to Satsuma, in season or out, daytime or night.

(See Images Below From QDM)

http://www.i-maps.com/Qdma/frame/de...=0&NID=0&cmd=map&TL=100000&GL=010100&MF=11000

Tommy would have been better off leaving the story at Joe trying to steal the gun as opposed to wanting to “borrow” it to go deer hunting at night. I might not be the only one with a problem believing this latest fairy tale from a jailbird. I can't help but notice who's in jail and who's not.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Give me something, anything that didn't come from a proven liar who's in jail about Joe Overstreet and I might just jump on the "Joe Dun It" bandwagon myself. Until then, I'm not buying it.

 

[Cowdaddy]

A LD, if there is one that was passed by someone, is not evidence and their verbal testimony cannot be believed by an stretch of the imagination, especially if it implicates Joe and relieves them from blame.

If Tommy and Misty suddenly tell a story that has never been told before, and if the details of that story match up, that would be compelling evidence that these natural born liars were telling the truth for once. And if they did tell new stories that matched up in the details, LE would probably get a warrant.

But people as damaged as Tommy and Misty, who are as committed to lying as they are--they would tell the truth only with major, major misgivings. They have lied and been lied to all their lives--lying is just a way of life to them. As deeply as many people believe that "Honesty is the best policy", Misty and Tommy believe that "Lying is the best policy." And probably especially in regards to any dealings with LE. The way many of us believe that LE are the good guys, and we're on the same side as LE--people from families like the Croslins truly believe that LE is like the Gestapo, and it's "us against them".

 

[Quiche]

I believe the MH was staged to suggest JO from the very beginning, they pointed at him and LE followed through by investigating then releasing JO to go back to Tennessee. mo

I need a refresher: didn't LE actually say JO was not involved? JO and the AC man are the only two I recall being dismissed.

 

[debs]

If LE didn't think he was there that night they would have no probable cause to get a search warrant to take his clothing and the vehicle he rode back in to TN. They would not have returned to interview him again if they felt he was not there. They would not have flown to TN recently to interview him again. He is involved up to his eyeballs imo.

If he threw away his clothing from the night Haleigh went missing what was there to find? He hitched a ride back with a friend in her vehicle.

IMO the last interview lasted a short 45 minutes even though LE had flown all that way. IMO, they just came out and told Joe it was just a matter of time before they would get him and his lawyer stopped the interview and stopped all communication between Joe and Florida investigators and now he is laying low waiting for the other shoe to drop, imo.

IMO

Well, this is news. I didn't realize they went WITH A WARRANT for the stuff. From what we've been told, they asked for, and received, all items from Joe.

 

[Amster]

About JO and the illegal deer hunting at night....wasn't one of Ronalds numerous arrests something to do with illegal hunting?

 

[debs]

About JO and the illegal deer hunting at night....wasn't one of Ronalds numerous arrests something to do with illegal hunting?

yes, yes it was. And let's not forget the "deer blood" in Lindsy's van.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Well, this is news. I didn't realize they went WITH A WARRANT for the stuff. From what we've been told, they asked for, and received, all items from Joe.

They would never do that. Even if someone gives them permission to search they will get a search warrant because if anything (evidence) is found it holds up much better in a court of law.

Joe's lawyer is never going to say they got the search with a warrant. It is his job to say that Joe gave them permission.

IMO

 

[debs]

They would never do that. Even if someone gives them permission to search they will get a search warrant because if anything (evidence) is found it holds up much better in a court of law.

IMO

There are cases every day where LE asks for, and is given, evidence freely. Regardless, I've seen nothing which indicates that LE went to Tenn. with a warrant to gather evidence from Joe. We only know they went up there to question him, which he voluntarily sat for, and requested these items. From that, I derive the result as Joe having volunteered any and all evidence requested by LE, which would then have been signed for by Joe to show his willingness to provide said evidence.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

There are cases every day where LE asks for, and is given, evidence freely. Regardless, I've seen nothing which indicates that LE went to Tenn. with a warrant to gather evidence from Joe. We only know they went up there to question him, which he voluntarily sat for, and requested these items. From that, I derive the result as Joe having volunteered any and all evidence requested by LE, which would then have been signed for by Joe to show his willingness to provide said evidence.

Maybe in a traffic incident or a suspicion of drugs in a vehicle but when it comes to a possible kidnapping and a missing child they do not. They certainly don't if they think there is the slightest chance the victim may have died.

Scott Peterson gave them permission to search his home. They did not take him up on it but returned with a search warrant signed by a Judge instead which alleviates the defense argument that the person really didn't give permission and the police did it anyway through an illegal search and seizure, which lawyers continuous make a big deal out of when it gets to court and makes a motion to have the evidence tossed.

IMO

 

[Amster]

yes, yes it was. And let's not forget the "deer blood" in Lindsy's van.

That's right! And scratches on the van....maybe because the vans headlights were used for the illegal night hunt. These people always weave a little truth in with the lies. Were they hunting that night? Were Misty and the kids with them? Who was hunting? ToC? JO? TiC? Blanket in the van....

 

[Wise Old Owl]

IF it was JO.

IF the speculation that JO was/did/or was planning to steal gun(s) - especially a "machine gun" or automatic rifle (possibly an AK47 or maybe even a uzi)...

IF JO is thought to have murdered Haleigh in cold blood while in a rage.......

IF JO threw Haleigh in the river (or held someone else at gun point / knife point to do it)

I truly believe that he would NOT be walking FREE today in TN. LE would have him in holding. The chances of him running, "going off the deep end" and either hurting himself or his family - even GMH, especially since she's been "dissin' " him all over national TV.

Nope, JO was interviewed by PCSO at FBI offices - so you know the FBI had people 'sitting in' on this interview (much less how many others watching behind that "special mirror", analyzing every movement, every word).

LE is NOT going to allow a loose cannon, rage filled, gun stealing, child murderer to be free "while they investigate".

So, JMHO Jo is definitely NOT the one that took Haleigh's life - as for the helping, maybe but I doubt that too.

 

[Maryann123]

If LE didn't think he was there that night they would have no probable cause to get a search warrant to take his clothing and the vehicle he rode back in to TN. They would not have returned to interview him again if they felt he was not there. They would not have flown to TN recently to interview him again. He is involved up to his eyeballs imo.

If he threw away his clothing from the night Haleigh went missing what was there to find? He hitched a ride back with a friend in her vehicle.

IMO the last interview lasted a short 45 minutes even though LE had flown all that way. IMO, they just came out and told Joe it was just a matter of time before they would get him and his lawyer stopped the interview and stopped all communication between Joe and Florida investigators and now he is laying low waiting for the other shoe to drop, imo.

I respectfully disagree, and for the following reasons. If, and that's a big IF this ever goes to court, any good lawyer worth his salt, would immediately point to the fact that LE did not follow up on leads that lead away from the person LE had in their sights. I think they call it "rush to judgment" if that rings a bell. Regardless of how ridiculous the claims, they have to investigate, or at least appear to investigate! Who in their right minds would believe anything that Misty or Tommy is peddling? They're both looking for a "get out of jail free card" and will say, or do anything to achieve that goal. I think I could beat the c*^9 out of Joe myself. I think from the tapes, Tommy is trying to get back to his 250 lb weight. What do you think JO weighs, 140? If Tommy is afraid of JO, that's just pitiful! I find it hard to believe Tommy is so worried about his kids that he kept this info to himself. Why wouldn't he warn Lindsy, that while he's in jail, please look out for the kids! Has he ever said anything close to this? No, Tommy is a punk, that is only looking out for Tommy. This story about JO is so far fetched, I can't believe Werter can repeat it with a straight face. LE has no interest in JO because there is nothing that points to him except two druggies, that want out of jail and can't pass a LDT.

 

[elle1919]

I don't know what to think anymore and I have had Joe labeled as public enemy #1 since the beginning. Now I have decided that I need to let go of all my biases and let the latest information sink in and just be along for this roller-coaster ride until justice for Haleigh can be served up!

Trust and believe no-one, suspect everyone....be prepared for shocking news because, well personally, I just think it's coming.

 

[Quiche]

I don't believe for one minute that LE stopped and waited for warrants when a child was freshly missing. They searched high and low through many many households that night. No warrants. No way. mo

LE searched JO before he returned to Tenn., right?

 

[Amster]

I'm thinking that JO was picked as the scapegoat early on. Grandma H has probably said what is closest to the truth. That Haleigh was given something that caused her to OD. Ron calls ToC to get over there and help Misty. Maybe ToC enlisted the help of JO....but, I don't think so. Supposedly, JO and Ronald were feuding over a stolen gun. The van was probably used for illegal hunting and got scratched before that night. Chelsea wants to protect Misty and Tommy. She would go along with the toss JO under the bus scam. LE needs to look no further than ToC, Misty and Ronald.