Watching Motions Hearing Live on Friday 10-10-08

[Muzikman]

JB sounds like he doesn't have a clue, very ill prepared and certainly underestimated the State and other agencies that have a well put together case against his client.
He has been drinking too much KC Koolaid and living in her fantacy world.
Snap out of it JB!

Think he was bad here? You all should have seen him during the first bond trial questioning people on the stand! I would have fired him immediately after that.

When he questioned Yuri, Yuri gave him looks like "what are these stupid things you are asking me that don't even make sense?"

I am actually REALLY REALLY GLAD that he is Casey's attorney. We should ALL be happy.

If you enjoyed today's show, you should go back and watch that first bond hearing. I think it's still up, CF News 13 broadcast the whole thing live. If not, I think I may have it here somewhere still...

 

[jinnimae]

I believe he filed the motions prior to the state wanting to present their evidence to the grand jury. And we all really don't know what her interest is in finding her child, we can only assume. Again, I believe that if there is anything that can be done to find Caylee alive, it should be done. JMO

Ya know, I'm gonna just keep hammering on this. Based on her behaviour, she DOESN'T have an interest in finding her child. If she truly had an interest in finding Caylee, she would have done it by now.

 

[karenc333]

what is not true but none of us know for sure
not true.
lie... no accident with nanny that led to a hospitalization
lie... she did not graduate from high school
lie...she did not attend college
lie...she did not work at universal this past year {at least}
lie... father never coming to fix car {when it was at amscot}
that is just a few of her lies so to say "what is NOT true none us us will ever know"...is not true.

That is true. I was referring to other things that she has said that have not been confirmed to be a lie.

 

[Chezhire]

Yes, No and Maybe ... :crazy: It is up to Casey to decide who will represent her. If JB has not met Florida's standards to be a DPQA (usually it is just a matter of applying for it ... and having adequate criminal trial experience ... good standing with the state Bar ... etc.) then he could certainly apply to be second or third chair counsel. She would need a certified DPQA for lead counsel though who also has privileges in the state of Florida.

that's just it though - someone else would have to represent her sitting as first chair as the DPQA.

 

[OcalaMom]

I guess that depends upon what the judge decides to do with the motion on Body Farm/DNA testing, which is the *best evidence* (not discounting the cadaver dogs whatsoever, btw!) we're aware of being conducted that would potentially shed light on the issue of alive or deceased. Other than that, I don't see how anything he "got" access to today (which he could have had way earlier had he asked properly) will tell him much. :waitasec:

Frankly, I think he knows she's deceased. He just wants to see how strong the case ag his client is.

I just wanted to say a huge THANK YOU to you, Themis and OHW (and any other legal eagles who've graced these 40+ pages) for providing us with the benefit of your expertise. I believe that we are all so much better informed because you've taken the time to share and explain.

:clap::clap::clap::clap:

 

[heartfortruth]

How do we know for sure what information she has given her counsel? I'm just saying that if there is anything that can be done to help find Caylee alive, it should be done. And if that means granting a motion that allows her to visit places of interest, it should be done. I'm not trying to debate on whether Caylee is alive or dead, I'm not wanting to bash LE, prsecution attorney, Casey, her lawyer, etc... I'm just stating my opinion in regards to the motion that would allow Casey to visit points of interest to assist with finding Caylee.

just going to throw this into the mix......A......she SAID she went out searching / investigating by herself in the beginning..."which was stupid" , she said....
was she LESS AFRAID by herself than she would have been with some help?

B. ..she said in the beginning that if she could get out of jail she would TALK about how to find Caylee.......so here comes LP to the rescue, fully believing that and gets her out and she does NOT TALK OR LOOK!......she has big , strong men sitting right outside her front door all the time who are NOT LE (whom she does "not trust") and who would take her anywhere at any time to look for Caylee and .........well.......you all know the rest of that story....

Oh, never mind.......I forgot about the "Script"........:bang:

 

[Themis]

OneHW - To restate, and not to step on Themis' toes, Themis said the state COULD LOSE the ability to have the evidence at trial, he didn't say the state would lose said ability, and I think the reason for the hypothesis is because Themis knows we don't have any bright-line ruling from the US Supreme Court. (Feel free to correct me for explaining what I think you meant, Themis.)

Do you think there is controlling case law that Judge S will have to follow? I haven't seen any, thus my question.

I missed on that point. Arizona v. Youngblood, US Supreme Court 1988 does set out the due process defense argument in favor of the prosecution as long as there isn't bad faith on the part of the prosecution. Still, to prove an absence of bad faith, if my office was prosecuting, I would give notice to defense if there was only a one-shot testing sample, or do something to document that there was only one shot and it was handled to the extent possible without bias against neutral testing.

 

[karenc333]

Karen, respectfully I ask if you could point to one thing that Casey did to find Caylee in that 31 days? Given what we know that she said, she told no one except 2 people (according to Casey) 1 that does not exist and 1 that says she was lying. I would LOVE for someone to tell me 1 thing that she has done. As to the last part of your post, I believe everything should be done to bring Caylee home, alive or deceased. If she has info, why would she be afraid to let LE investigate and not be afraid to let JB et al do it? Do you think that she believes Caylee would be safe if it was she, JB and the bailbond guy searching (or running them around in circles)?

Respectfully taken. But none of us know for sure what she did during those 31 days 100% of the time. And maybe at that point, she wasn't searching. Who knows for sure? In regards to her fears, I'm just saying that IF, IF, IF, Caylee is alive, that has to be a reason Casey is lying. The only thing I can come up with is that she is afraid to tell LE the truth for whatever reason.

 

[Chezhire]

I don't think that you need a US Supreme Court ruling to find plenty of precedence. In fact, when lower courts consistently rule the same on any argument then it doesn't ever make it to the US Supreme Court. I do not think that Judge Strickland will throw out or not allow into evidence the States samples based on this argument ... the burden of proof is on the State. Instead, I think that violation of due process will be cited on appeal.

With all due respect, you miss(step) my point in your response, which is precisely that, without a bright'line US Sup Court ruling, the lower courts could go either way, which is why I asked about FL law and...for a FL lawyer to please step up and give us a hand with this!

 

[karenc333]

Time is very important when a child goes missing. To wait even a day could be crucial to that child being found safely. It has been almost 4 months!

I agree with you there....but it doesn't mean that a parent, out of fear, would make some mistakes in that regard.

 

[Chezhire]

I missed on that point. Arizona v. Youngblood, US Supreme Court 1988 does set out the due process defense argument in favor of the prosecution as long as there isn't bad faith on the part of the prosecution. Still, to prove an absence of bad faith, if my office was prosecuting, I would give notice to defense if there was only a one-shot testing sample, or do something to document that there was only one shot and it was handled to the extent possible without bias against neutral testing.

Sure. And OJ (read: Barry Scheck) followed suit... but it's not a forgone conclusion, IMHO.

 

[susiemc]

Maybe Casey just didn't have time to search for Caylee during the period before she was reported missing by her grandmother. Shopping, writing checks and partying take up a lot of time. There are only so many hours in a day.

 

[karenc333]

I realize this is your honest answer.
I believe, though, that by hesitating to immediately call LE to get help for a child, the parent only exponentially increases the very real threat that the child is in grave danger or worse.

I could never in a million years take such a risk.

That is a very rational answer. But sometimes people think irrationally in times of stress or fear.

 

[Chezhire]

Well... maybe to Buffalo Wild Wings. They ARE rather hard to resist.

hehehe - aint' that the truth!?!?!?

 

[OcalaMom]

Do you think the Judge gave him a few things today so when he doesn't give them Casey's "secret missions" on Monday they can't scream and yell?

I am hoping that (as I think Themis may have hinted) Judge Strickland may actually tighten up some of the conditions of KC's home confinement.

 

[coco puff]

I disagree. That doesn't necessarily mean that she had no interest in finding her daughter. That only means she did not contact police and she may have had her reasons for not doing so. JMO

LP offered to help her find her daughter and as he stated many times, he is NOT LE.

 

[sandcastles4me]

Respectfully taken. But none of us know for sure what she did during those 31 days 100% of the time. And maybe at that point, she wasn't searching. Who knows for sure? In regards to her fears, I'm just saying that IF, IF, IF, Caylee is alive, that has to be a reason Casey is lying. The only thing I can come up with is that she is afraid to tell LE the truth for whatever reason.

Look at her phone records and text messages. She was on the phone almost every moment. Just by her text messages you can pretty much tell where her mind was and it was not on Caylee. I know that is hard to except that a mother could be so uncaring as she was, but the facts and her actions show she did not care at all about Caylee.

 

[Chezhire]

There you go. Arizona v. Youngblood is a US Supreme Court Case in 1988. Without bad faith on the part of LE, there is no due process violation under the 14th Amendment.

D'ya think if we post the law here it might show up in the prosecution briefs or judge's opinions? No reason why WS can't help them out. :clap::clap::clap:

I can't imagine why not?!?!?! Several WSers, Incl'g myself and Miracles Happen, have posted about JB coming here to get legal advice. ..

 

[karenc333]

Karen
"Allowing his client to wear items purchased with stolen checks and hiring that PR firm who has no grasp of the english language makes me question his judgement.

I agree that it is not a good thing for Casey to be wearing things that she purchased with stolen checks...if they were indeed stolen. For all we know Amy gave her permission to use them. I don't know. Maybe she is making a statement about that. Regardless if she actually stole them or not, in the publics eye, it is not a good idea that she wear things purchased with those checks."

We have seen a sworn statement from AH that KC indeed stole her checks, we have canceled checks from Target that show KC's signature on AH's acct. We have photos of KC at Target with the goods on the check out stand.

She has not been found guilty in court but I think those check charges are a slam dunk. IMHO

I think you are right here, but I also think her defense will be that Amy allowed her to use those checks.

 

[TURBOTHINK]

As for the air in the trunk - JB is allowed to "inspect" the car - but not take or test anything concerning the car - however an air sample is not really "taking" anything so that was granted.

What is he going to do get U.T. to do it again? They are the only place in the nation who has the equipment except for the inventor at ORNL. Geeshhhhh