weekend discussion: discuss the trial here #154

[kscornfed]

You are correct. We know this by what she said to Detective Flores. She was crying, for everything she was going to miss out of in life, for everything Travis was going to miss out on, her brothers and sisters....she went on to say, I know Travis is fine, he is in a good place, but what about his brothers and sisters and his friends, I know IT IS ONLY TEMPORARY, but it is just so much right now. I remember just being in shock hearing that she thought the pain of having their beloved brother brutally murdered would be somehow temporary. They are forever changed. They will miss Travis every minute, of every day, forever.

She, however, was done with him. Moving on. Temporary. For that I would have no trouble voting for the death penalty.:furious::furious:

i need to go back and see how much of her interrogation the jury saw. i don't think they know she said that. there is SO MUCH in this case they haven't been allowed to see.

 

[LambChop]

Jodi is the one responsible that is for sure, but I agree that labelling just doesn't help. I don't think that in order to have compassion for Travis and to see that he is a complete victim means you have to turn off your ability to have compassion for Jodi too, and try and see things from her side. Clearly she has not helped, she's calling him a pedophile and an abuser in open court FGS which is just, well, I mean it makes me wild because its just such slander!

Someone did try and contact her mother, I have a feeling it was Travis or one of his friends, her mother said 'he' when describing the person who called, and really it was a family problem, but Jodi made it very difficult for her family to get involved too. She really is her own worst enemy in so many ways .. because she is so severely disturbed IMO.

But yes, I want to go beyond the negative feelings I have towards her and try and have an understanding of her side of the experience. She is disturbed and damaged, was friendless and untreated. I don't believe that anyone on this planet is pure evil or pure goodness .. that is just not my experience of human nature.

There are times I see Jodi in court sitting there and she looks pathetic. Not often, but it has happened. I then remember in 62 seconds she stabbed him 29 times, cut his throat and shot him in the exact same spot where a gunman had held a gun at his head during a robbery. The probability of Travis being shot in the head in the exact same place where previously someone had held a gun to his head is no accident by any stretch of the imagination. Then I think is this someone who you would want to see released back into the main stream so she could start a family. The answer is no. jmo

 

[Mrs G Norris]

Yes, I think if Travis took the time to contact and or visit JA's Mom, the real story might have become apparent and this waste of life diverted. I believe as sharp as Travis was, the truth would have been understood.

I tend to think her mom was completely out of her depth when it came to dealing with Jodi too .. actually I think most psychologists would have been. There's a period during the police interviews where she just stares at the female detective in a very strange way with her head cocked to the side and her hair falling across one side of her face so you only see one of her eyes. It is one of the scariest expressions I have ever seen on another human being.

Jodi leaving home at a young age was a contributing factor to how sick she became IMO. This was the time in her life where an intervention by mental health professions may have been able to stop her from becoming a murderess.

By the time she met Travis she may have been only barely masking her deep disturbance, and when he rejected her that ability to mask it started to crumble and she was free falling from then on.

Some of the things that happened after that didn't help IMO.

 

[FrayedKnot]

I totally understand what you're saying. But how could they have known what they were dealing with? It's not like she had a mental illness, she is personality disordered. Big difference. I think they were as blindsided by what she is as Travis was. Nobody knew how dangerous she was. They just knew she was "off", and that they wanted her to go away.

Her own parents didn't even know what they were dealing with. These people were virtual strangers until she came into Travis' life. I don't see how they could have changed the outcome of what happened.

But I do see your point :seeya:.

And I in turn (rudely inserting myself) see your point.

But I do find it slightly beyond friendly concern the measures they took to rid Travis of Jodi. FGS, he was a grown man. I don't think they had concern for Travis' safety at that point, they just thought she was unsuitable.

I dated a man when I was in my mid-twenties. He was hilarious: we shared a weird sense of humor, loved the same books, sports and hobbies. We really had a blast hanging out and just genuinely LIKED each other. Which is so important.

He was also 20 years older than me and an attorney. He was the only divorced guy in his social circle, and I was completely frozen out of that circle by the wives of his friends. I did not dress or act inappropriately, or behave standoffishly. I tried to be friendly and polite but the more parties and gatherings we attended together, the clearer it became that, as a 25-year-old professional student (lol) and waitress, I was not going to be acceptable as a girlfriend for their friend.

I didn't put him in an awkward position, I just broke things off saying I really had to focus on school and work more.

I think even well-meaning friends can sometimes overstep their boundaries and attempt to pressure another friend into doing something "or their own good".

Thankfully, I haven't got friends like those.

Now, if Travis' friends thought he was in danger, then that's another thing entirely. But my understanding is that they just found her to sexual and inappropriate . They had no idea of the murderous crazy at that point.

 

[deedee21]

i don't even think it's deep down. she knows what she did.

She knows what she did and what she is. Did she bring in a ME for the defense to say she shot Travis first. She would not be able to find one that can make that claim.

 

[QueenD]

Anyone needing a good laugh.


http://twitter.com/IamBill46/status/325718291870003201/photo/1


I would have posted the picture, but dang can't figure all the iPad tricks out.

 

[SyraKelly]

When is JA going to give a statement? During victim Impact, and where did you hear that?
Tia
:seeya:

I don't know about the manifesto,but she does get to speak just before the judge sentences her..If she wants to!!!

 

[chijojo]

You are correct. We know this by what she said to Detective Flores. She was crying, for everything she was going to miss out of in life, for everything Travis was going to miss out on, her brothers and sisters....she went on to say, I know Travis is fine, he is in a good place, but what about his brothers and sisters and his friends, I know IT IS ONLY TEMPORARY, but it is just so much right now. I remember just being in shock hearing that she thought the pain of having their beloved brother brutally murdered would be somehow temporary. They are forever changed. They will miss Travis every minute, of every day, forever.

She, however, was done with him. Moving on. Temporary. For that I would have no trouble voting for the death penalty.:furious::furious:

I was so pizzed when I heard her say that, yeah, he's happy, he's doing great, he's in a great place. Really? if he's in such a great place, why don't you take yourself there also? Six ft. under you crazy biotch, is NOT a great place. She was only crying for herself when she said that.

 

[AZWatcher]

Hey all... Hope you're all having a great weekend! Is there Court Monday? heard a rumor. :drumroll:

 

[DeAnnaMisrahi]

I'm not sure anyone really knew the extent of Jodi's capabilities. I mean... a lot of people have a friend with a crazy ex-boyfriend/girlfriend. I don't think it's a common thought that the crazy ex will actually become violent. I think we usually see this as a bad influence or factor in our friend's life, but wouldn't mentally jump to the concept that their life was in danger.

As for Travis.... especially because of his religious circle that was unaware of his sexual activities, he probably kept falling back to Jodi for sex and as someone else pointed out, thinking with the wrong head. I do find myself leaning towards the idea that Travis really didn't agree to have Jodi come to his house on June 4 and she snuck in at 4:00 am and once she was there and offering the goods, he didn't turn it down. It seems like things were really escalating between the two of them at the end of May and he really was done with her. Even his blog posts convey a resolve to focus on dating the "right" woman and a potential spouse. It is hard to say though and the only one who knows for sure is no longer with us.

I just think it's highly likely that even though Travis and his friends thought Jodi was "crazy", the idea that she was capable of murder was not something they considered seriously or they all would have been more careful and proactive. I don't think it is unusual to not jump to that conclusion.

I have heard so many stories from people (who survive their attacks) where they say that they "knew something was wrong" or that "something seemed off" but they didn't want to "be rude" and turn the person away or down. They put themselves in the situation with them, even though their instincts are screaming that something is wrong. If we buy that JA got there at 4am, as she said, and she didn't kill him until 13 hours later, at that point his guard would have been down, so even if he initially was like "woah, what's this?" when she arrived, she would have put him at ease in all that time.

But, yea, you are right we'll never really know the truth about that, so it all ends up being speculation.

 

[Mrs G Norris]

There are times I see Jodi in court sitting there and she looks pathetic. Not often, but it has happened. I then remember in 62 seconds she stabbed him 29 times, cut his throat and shot him in the exact same spot where a gunman had held a gun at his head during a robbery. The probability of Travis being shot in the head in the exact same place where previously someone had held a gun to his head is no accident by any stretch of the imagination. Then I think is this someone who you would want to see released back into the main stream so she could start a family. The answer is no. jmo

No matter what NEVER she can never be released, I don't even like the idea of her mixing with other prisoners just quietly. She will continue to hurt people in many ways from here on in. She remains and will always remain extremely dangerous and will need to be watched very closely IMO.

I expect more violence from her in prison once the trail is over. I hope she will be on death row, if only to minimise her ability to maim.

 

[katiecoolady]

Why on earth would anyone think calling someone on rudeness is racist?



I don't think it is an intrusion at all. I also don't think it's voyeurism.

I can't speak for anyone else here but for me, everyone is sympathetic and hovering in the beginning when there is a tragedy. But then their own lives call and they move to the next thing while we remain "stuck."

People think you should stop "dwelling" on it because "these things happen and there's no reason" and they don't want to talk about it anymore and they really don't want YOU to talk about it anymore. They've moved on and they think you should, too.

In a place like this, no one expects you to pack up your grief, swallow your sorrow and get on with things. No matter how long it's been. You don't even have to talk about it. You just know that if you did bring it up, no one is going to hush you or rush to change the subject.

Quiet solidarity, I call it and if you're here it means you get it and you won't thin your lips in disapproval or wonder why we're attached to cases like this.

My .25 cos I think it's worth more than .02.

Signing in from my pedicure whirlpool chair to tell you I love you for this post xo

 

[AZWatcher]

I was so pizzed when I heard her say that, yeah, he's happy, he's doing great, he's in a great place. Really? if he's in such a great place, why don't you take yourself there also? Six ft. under you crazy biotch, is NOT a great place. She was only crying for herself when she said that.

Gonna keep it short cuz I don't wanna get a PUI ... but ..:woohoo:

 

[cricket49]

Yes, I think if Travis took the time to contact and or visit JA's Mom, the real story might have become apparent and this waste of life diverted. I believe as sharp as Travis was, the truth would have been understood.

Well, somebody contacted Jodi's mom and said she needed help and was bi polar. During Flores interview with her mom, she said that is why the family talked Jodi into moving back to Yreka so she could get help and be near family.

Jodi was a grown woman who would not allow her family into her life. She would be very resistant for her family to help her. After all, she probably did not think anything was wrong with her.

 

[AZWatcher]

Signing in from my pedicure whirlpool chair to tell you I love you for this post xo

Signing in from the Salty Senorita patio bar to tell you ... I LOVE that you are relaxing and having a pedicure!
PS If you are anywhere near Old Town Scottsdale... come by and I will buy you a pitcher of margaritas!

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Hey all... Hope you're all having a great weekend! Is there Court Monday? heard a rumor. :drumroll:

Court is listed on the docket for monday.. I just checked..

 

[chijojo]

<snipped>
Originally Posted by sacrablue
The one issue that troubles me about this case is JA was understood by her lover Travis and her friends as being different. She did things that were not normal. Yet she was used as a three hole wonder.
Who is responsible here? Did Travis ever meet JA's parents? Was anyone ever contacted when JA's behavior became symptomatic? JA was a perfect storm ready to erupt having a relationship go terribly wrong.
To sit back after the fact and call her a monster and all the names I have heard doesn't solve this problem.

BBM
Are you suggesting the responsibility falls on Travis for getting himself murdered?

adding to that. Do believe if a woman gets raped, it might be because of the clothes she is wearing? ie: too tight, short skirt?

 

[wasnt_me]

We'll have to agree to disagree on it. I've watched him with my own eyes, including in person, and masterful is not a word I would ever choose to describe his presentation of the State's case. But that's jmo. I understand very clearly that many posters strongly disagree.

I'd love to see some of his other cases adjudicated. I wonder if there are any on youtube or somewhere or how you find them.

 

[G&AMom]

I will be eating popcorn with my brother at the movies tomorrow. With butter, rather nasty artificial flavored oil. I don't need it, it's stupid and I will be enjoying every bite except the ones I spill all over myself and the seat and floor, like usual.

How's your brother doing?

(I've been the patient and I've been the caregiver, and my sympathies are always strongest for the caregiver. Nobody knows till they've been there.)

 

[JRS_JD2L]

JRS_JD2L,

I commend you on your pursuit in the propsection side of law and I wish you well.
It bothers me that a defendant can lean on the Constitution when it's so obvious that he/she is guilty and with killing someone (in any way, except police officers, soldiers) deserves an advocate under any law. It's just discusting to me. You murder some one, you pay a price- you don't deserve to be considered as a citizen of any country, never mind the USA and use the Constitution for their own, screwed-up mind.


Anyway, sorry for the rant. Thank-you for answering my post. :blushing:

No worries at all, if everyone had the same opinion there would be no reason for great places like this to exchange ideas. :rocker:

Here's the thing for me. If we can set this particular case aside for the moment, because I think we can all agree there is no dispute as the the guilt of this particular killer, how can we ever be sure that someone is innocent unless we allow them to present a defense to the charges? Certainly, history is filled with prosecutorial mistakes, and some even more nefarious, that have led to identifying the wrong person and a subsequent conviction. Those things happen even with the benefit of presenting a defense.

So, how do we decide that these innocent people are truly innocent, or whether they are merely just making up some BS defense or excuse to game the system? If we don't allow JA to present a defense because it is obvious that she is guilty, where do we draw the line? And, who will decide who is obviously guilty?

And now I will apologize for my overindulgence on this topic! :blushing: