What do the profilers say?

[aussiesheila]

You know what? It really would have been wonderful.
And if only the BPD would have accepted their offer of help.

For what it's worth IrishMist, IMO they were never going to do that, because IMO they had been directed to "not investigate this apparent kidnapping" too closely.

IMO this directive came from the head detective who was acting under instructions from a wealthy and influential member of Boulder society who had a personal interest in deflecting the investigation away from the true perpetrators and had contacted the head detective on his personal phone quite some time before Patsy's 5.55 am 911 call.

Why did it take so long for detectives to arrive after the 911 call?

Detective Arndt didn't arrive until 8.20 am. Prior to that there were only patrol officers there. How well trained are they in the US? They weren't ever going to be particularly adept at detective work, as was subsequently shown to be the case. Even Detective Arndt's training was in an unrelated field. And she was left alone for 4 hours!!! In spite of repeated calls for assistance!!!

Either SOMEONE back at headquarters was being very slack or was deliberately witholding assistance so that the crime scene was messed up IMO.

All very suspicious IMO.

 

[Camper]

I'll answer your questions the best I can:

The wood fragments, the broken paintbrush that belonged to the house, and the missing cord roll suggest the garrote was made earlier that day, while nobody was home.

B had nothing to do with JBR's murder. He was sleeping at the time.

Why would PR's God get a confession? The perp's not religious there were no religious expressions in the RN. There were criminal, military, and nationalistic expressions though.

----------->>>Comment on your first thoughts:

The wood fragments, the broken paintbrush that belonged to the house, and the missing cord roll suggest the garrote was made earlier that day, while nobody was home.

WE do not know what time of day or which day the cord thingie was made. erroneous argument.

--------

Your second comment:
B had nothing to do with JBR's murder. He was sleeping at the time.

Even the Ramseys finally admitted years later that B was NOT sleeping that morning.

--------

Your third thought:

Why would PR's God get a confession? The perp's not religious there were no religious expressions in the RN. There were criminal, military, and nationalistic expressions though.

You have mis read and mis thought my comment about PR and confession to God. Surely WE do not have reference anywhere ABOUT WHAT PR prays about privately. IF you HOTYH had done a rage action that caused the death of 'any' person, wouldn't you pray to YOUR GOD and ask forgiveness?

My thoughts fit for MY THEORY.

Additionally about the military comments JR was stationed at a military base and to think that their lives did not interplay with military who talked of such military things, surely you would remember them.

This of course is only MY opinion.

As Joe Pechi sp? said, in 'My Cousin Vinny' said to one of the witnesses, 'Your comments don't hold water'.


.

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[Holdontoyourhat]

----------->>>Comment on your first thoughts:

The wood fragments, the broken paintbrush that belonged to the house, and the missing cord roll suggest the garrote was made earlier that day, while nobody was home.

WE do not know what time of day or which day the cord thingie was made. erroneous argument.

--------

Your second comment:
B had nothing to do with JBR's murder. He was sleeping at the time.

Even the Ramseys finally admitted years later that B was NOT sleeping that morning.

--------

Your third thought:

Why would PR's God get a confession? The perp's not religious there were no religious expressions in the RN. There were criminal, military, and nationalistic expressions though.

You have mis read and mis thought my comment about PR and confession to God. Surely WE do not have reference anywhere ABOUT WHAT PR prays about privately. IF you HOTYH had done a rage action that caused the death of 'any' person, wouldn't you pray to YOUR GOD and ask forgiveness?

My thoughts fit for MY THEORY.

Additionally about the military comments JR was stationed at a military base and to think that their lives did not interplay with military who talked of such military things, surely you would remember them.

This of course is only MY opinion.

As Joe Pechi sp? said, in 'My Cousin Vinny' said to one of the witnesses, 'Your comments don't hold water'.


.

.

The cord mischaracterized as a 'thingie toy' was a brutal murder weapon, and in my view was constructed while the intruder perp lay in wait in the house. The perp also wrote the RN during this time. Hours and hours in the house, uninterrupted by family, provided the perp with the required opportunity to access all the house supplies he used to write the note and make the garrote.

This 'erroneous argument' is more realistic than writing this note and making the cord to stage a fake murder after a rage assault on PR's own daughter. The evidence contradicts this theory.

 

[Camper]

The cord mischaracterized as a 'thingie toy' was a brutal murder weapon, and in my view was constructed while the intruder perp lay in wait in the house. The perp also wrote the RN during this time. Hours and hours in the house, uninterrupted by family, provided the perp with the required opportunity to access all the house supplies he used to write the note and make the garrote.

This 'erroneous argument' is more realistic than writing this note and making the cord to stage a fake murder after a rage assault on PR's own daughter. The evidence contradicts this theory.

---------->>> Mistake was a misquote attributed to me, what I said was this, IN RED:


WE do not know what time of day or which day the cord thingie was made. erroneous argument.

WE still don't know how old this instrument was or who made it.

WE don't know when the ransom note was written either or what day it was written.


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[sissi]

Statements of Material Facts:

Dark animal hairs were also found on JonBenet's hands that have not been matched to anything in defendants' home. (SMF 184)

fibers consistent with those of the cord used to make the slip knots and garrote were found on JonBenet's bed. (SMF 168)

Defendants do not own any "HI-TEC" brand shoes and none of their shoes match the shoeprint marks. (SMF 153; PSMF 153.) Likewise, another similar partial shoeprint was found near where JonBenet's body was found. (SMF 155; PSMF 155. ) The owner of the "HI-TEC" shoe that made the footprints at the murder scene has never been identified. (SMF 154, 155; PSMF 154, 155. ) In addition, on the wine-cellar door, there is a palmprint that does not match either of defendants' palmprints. (SMF 156; PSMF 156.) The individual to whom it belongs has never been identified. (SMF 156; PSMF 156.)



The fact that the cord fibers were found in Jonbenet's room, fibers from the contents of the bag containing rope were found in there as well as in her body bag, point away from a Ramsey as killer. WHY?

Is someone planning on arguing that in 2003( the timing of the Carnes motion) Burke owned those hi-tech? NO! again...NO!

How do we explain the animal fibers in her hands? Something shedded? If anyone says..patsy's beaver boots..well.....Patsy did not own Beaver boots, as demonstrated by the vacuuming of the closets..NO beaver fur was found.

 

[little1]

Some of you may know that as far as Im concerned. Profilers are stealing money.

JR is not from the south. Born in Nebraska and educated in Michigan.

This profiler has just cleared PR.

I think they were talking about Patsy Ramsey, not John.

 

[BlueCrab]

Defendants do not own any "HI-TEC" brand shoes and none of their shoes match the shoeprint marks.

sissi,

Burke Ramsey owned Hi-Tec brand hiking boots. He admitted this to the grand jurors during his five hours of testimony. Fleet White III also testified in front of the grand jurors that Burke owned Hi-Tec hiking boots.

The boots were bought for him by Patsy during a trip to Atlanta and they had a compass tied into the shoestrings.

BlueCrab

 

[tipper]

sissi,

Burke Ramsey owned Hi-Tec brand hiking boots. He admitted this to the grand jurors during his five hours of testimony. Fleet White III also testified in front of the grand jurors that Burke owned Hi-Tec hiking boots.

The boots were bought for him by Patsy during a trip to Atlanta and they had a compass tied into the shoestrings.

BlueCrab

Are you talking about the 1991 Hi-Tecs?

 

[Camper]

I concur that the 10 year old son had Hi Tec shoes.

Fact: Ten year old B lived in the murder house.
Fact: Ten year old B walked around in his own home.
Fact: Ten year old b frequented the basement, as did other members of the Ramsey family, it was their home.


Hi Tec footprints in the basement could never be 'dated' as to the moment in time when the person with their feet in the Hi Tec shoes made the footprints.

Question: Why would anyone think the Hi Tec shoes indicated that a Ramsey had been involved in the crime?

Well, since the Ramseys denied owning any Hi Tec shoes, when in fact THEY DID, the R's were trying to distance themselves particularly B, from the crime or crime scene. Blue Crab, did the police EVER find B's Hi Tec shoes, er where were they?

BC said that B admitted he owned the shoes, did the inquisitor ask him where they were at the time of the inquir y?


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[Camper]

Are you talking about the 1991 Hi-Tecs?

---->>>WE posted about the same time. I will be interested in the DATE that B had Hi Tec shoes. Fleet White surely made a big point of it, per PMPT. One would think that FW would have more current info on Hi Tec shoes, nearer the time of the murder.

IF there were some back in 1991, then surely B would have outgrown those.



.

 

[sandraladeda]

I have never heard anyone comment on the shoe size associated with that hi tec boot print found near JBR's body. If they have a print, they should have a shoe size, and I would assume that hi tec boots come in a broad range of sizes. Is the size of the print consistent with that of a child's shoe size? Is it consistent with the shoe size of an adult?

 

[sissi]

Sandra, given the BPD made a door to door plea, and questioned their own ranks concerning this print, we should be able to safely "assume" it was an adult size. The interviews suggesting Burke owned hi-tec was underhanded crap, an effort to incite John Ramsey. If I ask our nine year old if his back pack is hi-tec, he will say "yes". Ask any child that age about any equipment he has that has "bells and whistles" and see what answer you get.

Edit to add, If, just "IF" Burkes shoes at age 7 or 8 were hi-tec..wouldn't they be child sized? Would the BPD have asked their own officers if they wore these shoes into the house?

 

[tipper]

Sandra, given the BPD made a door to door plea, and questioned their own ranks concerning this print, we should be able to safely "assume" it was an adult size. The interviews suggesting Burke owned hi-tec was underhanded crap, an effort to incite John Ramsey. If I ask our nine year old if his back pack is hi-tec, he will say "yes". Ask any child that age about any equipment he has that has "bells and whistles" and see what answer you get.

I'm willing to believe Kane since he was so cagy about revealing that Burke saying he owned Hi-Tecs with a compass on the laces came from the Grand Jury testimony. But Kane also revealed that this was some time prior to 1996. We also know that in 1991 Hi-Tec had a promo of boots with a compass on the laces. I don't think its too big a stretch to suggest that was when Burke owned Hi-Tecs with a compass on the laces.

I don't believe, even with a partial print, that the scale of an adult shoe and a child's shoe would be the same.

Added: BPD did ask their own people if they had Hi-Tecs. Thomas talks about the lack of response in his book.

Added 2nd:
http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=610106&highlight=1991+promo#post610106

This is from Footwear News, July 29, 1991:
Quote:
Hi-Tec Sports will launch hikers promo

MODESTO, Calif. - Hi-Tec Sports USA will step up the marketing of its new children's outdoor hiking boot with an incentive campaign centered around the 500th anniversary of Columbus' voyage to the New World.

The company plans to offer posters, stickers and other amenities as part of a Navigators' Club that children can join when they purchase an item in the new Navigators' series.

Hi-Tec unveiled an outdoor boot called the Columbus as part of the series. The shoe features a compass tied to the laces. It comes in mochaspruce and navy, priced to retail at $44.95.

Hi-Tec will coordinate the club membership in Modesto and will send promotional posters with new orders. Details of the promotion will be offered to children in product boxes.

David Pompel, marketing manager, said he expects the promotion to spur children's sales. He reported company-wide sales for Hi-Tec should grow by 60 percent this year.

"When the kids get something in the box, they get excited," he said. Pompel added that Hi-Tec's rugged outdoor look is growing more popular as children focus on the environment.

"We're getting into department stores where the athletic look is dying. We try to make ties to positive values like recycling and the environment."

 

[Jayelles]

Burke would have been about 4 years old in 1991. I seriously doubt that:-

a) He would have been "brand aware " at that age or

b) that he would recall what shoes he owned 5 years later

I also doubt a 4 year old would have interest in shoes with compasses on the laces.

 

[tipper]

Burke would have been about 4 years old in 1991. I seriously doubt that:-

a) He would have been "brand aware " at that age or

b) that he would recall what shoes he owned 5 years later

I also doubt a 4 year old would have interest in shoes with compasses on the laces.

We'd need to know when the Ramseys went to Atlanta in either the second half of 1991 or if it was in 1992. Burke would have been either four and a half or five. Since the promotion was tied to Columbus' 500th anniversary, it probably was winding down by late 1992.

Without a transcript we don't know whether Burke identified the brand of shoe himself. He could also simply have been shown a picture of the 'Columbus" with its compass attached and said "Yes, I had a pair of shoes like that."

 

[rashomon]

Statements of Material Facts:
Dark animal hairs were also found on JonBenet's hands that have not been matched to anything in defendants' home.

Hmm, maybe they should check Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer's alibi for that fatal night? I strongly suspect that he was Santa's accomplice. Now wouldn't that fit in with the tabloids placing an anonymous 'Street Santa' wandering around in the Ramsey home on that fatal night?

 

[sissi]

It sure would be interesting to know what the source of these dark animal hairs was. Since, some, not all, of the BPD think Patsy is "good for it", these hairs can't be that unusual.
It's a darn shame that undrtheradar sneaked out, I meant to ask him what kind of furry animal RW brought to the house.

 

[tipper]

It sure would be interesting to know what the source of these dark animal hairs was. Since, some, not all, of the BPD think Patsy is "good for it", these hairs can't be that unusual.
It's a darn shame that undrtheradar sneaked out, I meant to ask him what kind of furry animal RW brought to the house.

But apparently unusual for the Ramsey house since despite using sticky tape on the closet floors, no matching hairs turned up anywhere.

 

[capps]

I don't remember seeing animal hair on the inventory list of evidence taken.I'll admit I'm too tired to look it up right now,does anyone recall?
ETA: I looked it up under the "Inventory List" thread. Evidence taken from JonBenet's body;it just says hair/fibers,so maybe that included the animal hair.I would think they would have specified it as "animal hair".

 

[tipper]

I don't remember seeing animal hair on the inventory list of evidence taken.I'll admit I'm too tired to look it up right now,does anyone recall?

It's in ST's depo