Why This Case Will Soon Go Cold Again...

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Just a warning that you may find this post upsetting if you are a friend or family member of one of the identified Gilgo victims (or if you are simply someone who feels passionate about obtaining justice & closure for the victims).

I know it bothers us when we hear it pointed out that the LISK is a killer of prostitutes (or when the media or government addresses the victims with phrases such as "missing prostitute Shannan Gilbert").

No matter what we say or do, we aren't going to be able to change the views of the media, the government or the public. So I am just going to say what the reality is;

The LISK investigation is going to go cold because his victims were all sex workers from out of town.

It's cold and harsh to hear. Yet that is the truth. It already happened with this investigation many years ago when all of those bodies started appearing in the Pine Barrens around Manorville. Once one of the victims (Jessica Taylor) was identified as a prostitute from her prior arrests (and once all of the residents found comfort in the fact that the victims were not locals) the case went cold.

Heck, out of all of the Manorville bodies that were found (and according to the locals, there have been DOZENS over the years) we are only hearing about Jessica Taylor and the Jane Doe victim because some of their remains were found at Gilgo.

There is no mention of the two Hispanic men also found in Manorville near their remains...

No mention of the severed man's head found in the lake with a bullet hole...

No mention of any of the other victims (like the dead guy with the healed bullet wounds in his chest) other than what we hear from interviews with locals with firsthand knowledge.

Information about the majority of the remains found in the Pine Barrens around Manorville barely received any media coverage (and news about most of the bodies that were discovered out there did not make it to the internet when everything went digital).

The case went cold then and now that SG's remains have been found it will soon go cold again.

[These are not my views... I am just giving everyone the heads-up on what is coming next]

Yes, now that SG has been found, everyone here should be prepared to see this case go on the cold case pile. I know that this sounds highly unlikely (and very frustrating/sad) but it's just the way things work in Suburbia America.

Any department (police or FBI) empowered with investgating a killer who is regarded as a killer exclusively of prostitutes simply does not receive indefinite resources to solve the case in this Country (and probably in most other countries too). This is especially true on Long Island. For reasons I will not get into, the homicide units of both Suffolk & Nassau counties have some of the lowest ratios of taxes collected vs. funds being directed to their respective homicide departments (including crime labs) in the entire Country. Part of it has to do with the relatively low crime rates (compared to other areas in the Country with similar size population density). The rest of it is a political nightmare too complicated to explain in one post.

The bottom line is that in any suburban community, there reaches a point in these investigations where money does indeed become a factor. You are probably going to be angry when you hear this (so please don't be mad at me for passing it along) but due to the intense frustration among Long Island taxpayers & public officials empowered with allocating the funds collected from taxpayers, there reaches a point when both the taxpayers and the public officials put there foot down and say "enough is enough". In other words, the police department will not have an open checkbook to fund this LISK investigation indefinitely.

Now that SG has been found, here are some of the questions that are already being asked by taxpayers & public officials at public meetings;

-How much has the department already spent on this investigation?

-What percentage of the homicide unit's resources are being allocated towards this investigation?

-Have the closure/solve rates of other homicide cases suffered as a result of the tremendous amount of resources being reallocated to this case?

-How much more money does the department plan to allocate towards this case?

-What will be the annual net cost per household for this investigation?


Now on the surface you are probably thinking to yourself, can this be for real?

You are surely thinking that a serial killer investigation should indeed have a do-whatever-it-takes-no-matter-what-it-costs priority.

Sorry to say, that is not reality.

The truth... the reality is... that this case can easily be viewed by many residents and public officials as a waste of the taxpayer’s hard-earned money.

I know this is tough to understand.

Truth is, (and this is not how I feel) this case is no longer about protecting the public from a possible serial killer. Truth-be-told, the general view among taxpayers & public officials (whether they admit it publically or not) is that the majority of the local residents do not feel threatened knowing that the LISK is on the loose because his identified victims were all women from out of town who travelled to Long Island to commit a crime (prostitution). The only victim who actually resided on Long Island was AC. However, she can easily be viewed as heroin addict from the Carolinas who jumped on a train to stay with a friend to use his home to turn tricks (I mean no disrespect for AC, just stating the way the public, media & government have mostly portrayed her). So basically, the LISK is not being viewed as a threat to anyone except independent prostitutes from out of town.

Personally, as long as the LISK is out there, I fear for the residents of all of the East Coast (and that is why for Christmas Santa is installing a high tech security system on my home complete with dozens of infrared night vision motion-activated video cameras. Also invested in a cooperative plan with all of my neighbors to hire a private security guard to patrol the neighborhood and even watch the local children as they walk to school). But for the average resident of the East Coast (especially those who still live on Long Island), this type of sense of urgency (or acknowledgement that a real threat to the public from the LISK exists) simply is not present.

So here is the true reality-

You have millions of households paying tens of thousands of dollars each in taxes (between property taxes, income taxes, sales taxes, government fees, etc...) and they (and their elected officials) are watching millions of those dollars being spent on an investigation to attempt to solve the murders of a handful of Jane Does and five (possibly six if we count SG) women from out of town who travelled to Long Island for the sole purpose of committing crimes. This is happening before everyone's eyes while the economy is in the pits, unemployment rates are sky high and living expenses are through the roof. School districts are laying off teachers because they can't afford to pay their salaries because there is not enough tax dollars to go around yet millions and millions of dollars are being spent to find the killers of victims who (for argument's sake) more than likely never contributed a dime in taxes themselves.

I know this sounds harsh (because it is, but they are not my views!). And I know on the surface this doesn't say much about the Long Island community. However, dig a little deeper and you can start to appreciate that it's not the community & the elected officials looking to be cruel towards the victims. This same scenario is played out in suburban communities everywhere (so don't be upset with Long Islanders).

In a perfect world, everyone surely would want the LISK off of the streets and behind bars. But the simple fact remains that in our world... our reality is all about MONEY. There is only so much that can be allocated towards an investigation before you have to either

1) Raise taxes to continue to sustain the investigation.

2) Attempt to secure State or Federal aid/assistance with the investigation.

3) Put the investigation on a budget (or on the cold case pile).

Obviously, the morally correct course of action is to respect the victims for who they were (beautiful, loving human beings) and not classify them based upon their occupation, their unfortunate addictions, or where they came from. Usually in the public eye (and on paper), local governments/police departments usually go out of their way to make it appear that they treat all victims (including prostitutes, drug addicts, & convicted felons) with equal respect and protection (justice is supposed to be blind right?) Whether or not the police department indeed made themselves appear this way in this case is subject to debate. Regardless of appearances, we all know the truth of how gang members, prostitutes, junkies, etc... Simply do not receive the same sense of urgency from law enforcement when a crime is committed against them as would a member of the mainstream public.

And then the sad truth is that eventually most of these cases hit a brick wall.

The leads stop rolling in...

There are no longer any known victims that are missing from the area...

Time passes by without any more remains being found...

Nobody ever steps forward to identify the Jane & John Does...

At about the same time that these cases hit those brick walls, the money to investigate them almost completely runs out. New cases (many much easier to solve) take the spotlight and demand the department investigate them. And since most of the residents and their families never actually felt threatened by a "killer of prostitutes", nobody will seem to care much about this case (just as most people stopped caring about the Butcher of Manorville for such a long period of time).

I know this makes you angry because it makes me angry (and rightfully so).

The problem is that this isn't a perfect world.

Crimes need to be solved.

Murderers need to be put behind bars.

A very large percentage of successful police work is based upon timing and taking advantage of windows of opportunity at the time when they present themselves for the taking. In a perfect world there would be unlimited resources with unlimited manpower using the most expensive state-of-the-art technology. In that perfect world, almost every crime can be solved and almost every murderer could be put behind bars. But in our world, this simply is not the case.

So when decision time comes it is nearly impossible ignore other crimes that can be solved because their windows of opportunity are ripe in exchange for beating down a case that's hit a brick wall (and one that the investigators can't even be certain if there is one murderer responsible or three or more).

When decision time comes (and it's coming soon) we will see this investigation shift from proactive back to reactive. And when that happens, all we will be left with will be listening to the heartless rumors, hopeful (yet worrisome) speculation every time a local murder, missing persons case or an arrest of a psycho hits the news, and a really bad case of wondering what the police should've, could've or would've done differently throughout the entire case.

most serial killers succeed by preying on the most vulnerable. It's front page news at the moment because it's gruesome and too close to reality TV. I have lived my adult life looking for my sister Judy - who was a prostitute. You cannot imagine the rat holes I've been down trying to find her, find out who hurt her before she strayed.

It's maddening. It's disgusting. The missing people in our country. And unclaimed bodies. This isn't unclaimed freight, it's PEOPLE. With families. And lives. And stories. And precincts around the country don't talk. They won't use NamUs.

My sister was a druggie and a prostitute. That doesn't mean she deserved to die - or to never be found - or for her killer to never be brought to justice.

She was a person. With family. And a future. That's probably extinguished.

Sorry for my rant. It's been a long time since Judy's been seen. And her birthday is coming up. she would have been 51 on 4/28. Miss you sis. I'm still looking.
 
sorry slug, the feds never let a case go cold. they will get their man.
:)
 
sorry slug, the feds never let a case go cold. they will get their man.
:)

I should have added that they also have no sympathy for people who are involved in the case, they will go after the perpetrators family, lawyer, friends, coworkers, and anyone else they can in order to get their man. There is no statute of limitations for murder and I am sure we will see charges for murders that were committed almost 20 years ago in this case.

Additionally, we should see the perpetrator charged with multiple hate crimes. The racially motivated statements made to the little sister in Buffalo is a perfect example of intimidation based upon prejudice as is the fact that he intentionally targets women.

"A person commits a hate crime when he or she commits a specified offense and either:
(a) intentionally selects the person against whom the offense is committed or intended to be committed in whole or in substantial part because of a belief or perception regarding the race, color, national origin, ancestry, gender.
"
 
Tomorrow will make it four months since I started this thread and the list of unanswered questions has grown larger since then.
 
Now that we know that SG's remains did not show any obvious links to the rest of this case, I have to ask, if we look at this case right now where it stands without anything to do with SG or anyone from Oak Beach (who many of you attempted to loosely associate with this case under the assumption that SG was a victim of the same killer), where does this case actually stand in terms of progress?

Was it the artist's sketches of the unidentified victims?

Other than the discovery of the bodies and the discovery of how DNA from some remains are linked to others, were the sketches the only other advances in this case?

Sure seems like this is a cold case that is never going to have any major breakthroughs.
 
Now that we know that SG's remains did not show any obvious links to the rest of this case, I have to ask, if we look at this case right now where it stands without anything to do with SG or anyone from Oak Beach (who many of you attempted to loosely associate with this case under the assumption that SG was a victim of the same killer), where does this case actually stand in terms of progress?

Was it the artist's sketches of the unidentified victims?

Other than the discovery of the bodies and the discovery of how DNA from some remains are linked to others, were the sketches the only other advances in this case?

Sure seems like this is a cold case that is never going to have any major breakthroughs.

You are correct, everybody's big hope was the SG autopsy would create a breakthrough, but it is another dead end.

If my hunch is right, LE will, whenever asked, will claim it is an open and ongoing case, but in reality nobody will be arrested, there will always be rumors and we sleuthers will always have theories.
 
You are correct, everybody's big hope was the SG autopsy would create a breakthrough, but it is another dead end.

If my hunch is right, LE will, whenever asked, will claim it is an open and ongoing case, but in reality nobody will be arrested, there will always be rumors and we sleuthers will always have theories.

I also agree. But I would suggest that we keep our eyes focused on missing persons reports over the summer months (until end of Sept.). This "seems" to be his time for killing. At least in the case of the GB4.
 
I also agree. But I would suggest that we keep our eyes focused on missing persons reports over the summer months (until end of Sept.). This "seems" to be his time for killing. At least in the case of the GB4.
Im glad you brought this up. Im surprised we havent found any more bodies recently.

It's almost like those 10 people were killed for a specific purpose.
 
Im glad you brought this up. Im surprised we havent found any more bodies recently.

It's almost like those 10 people were killed for a specific purpose.

It is not surprising that no more bodies are found; if the LISK is aware he is being watched by Sleuthers or LE he will probably either stop killing, or find another burial place.

Serial Killers do evolve and adapt to external situations and circumstances.

MOO
 
I also agree. But I would suggest that we keep our eyes focused on missing persons reports over the summer months (until end of Sept.). This "seems" to be his time for killing. At least in the case of the GB4.

Make sure to keep florida on your watch list, as well as any area frequented by prostitutes within a 30 mile range of I95 between florida and new york. He knows there are traps waiting for him on long island.
 
You are correct, everybody's big hope was the SG autopsy would create a breakthrough, but it is another dead end.

If my hunch is right, LE will, whenever asked, will claim it is an open and ongoing case, but in reality nobody will be arrested, there will always be rumors and we sleuthers will always have theories.

While I am typing this message the case may have been already solved and the authorites are calling for a late afternnoon press conference. There really is no way to say for sure what is going to happen one minute from now. That is what makes police work so interesting. Life and career changes can happen in the blink of an eye.

Like I always said the biggest obstacle to the case is the detectives that are investigating the case. I am not pointing out SCPD as most departments have the same problems: GIANT EGOS. By definition and necessity a homicide detectiive must have an out=sized ego. If the detective doesn't have confidence in solving a case, who does?
 
Did the press conference end up taking place? I've kind of been out of the loop. I assume it was nothing big, or else this place would be buzzing.
 
It is not surprising that no more bodies are found; if the LISK is aware he is being watched by Sleuthers or LE he will probably either stop killing, or find another burial place.

Serial Killers do evolve and adapt to external situations and circumstances.

MOO

Hi Everyone, I haven't posted here in awhile, but I have been here reading most of the great posts!
As a part time resident of W Gilgo Beach, I, like many are anxious that the killer(s) will be brought to justice. I am very uncomfortable when I am out there.

I have wondered if the wildfires in Manorville, which were suspicious in nature, were not set by someone trying to cover up some of the evidence? I'm not sure if anyone has mentioned it, but it's worth a mention anyway.
 
Hi Everyone, I haven't posted here in awhile, but I have been here reading most of the great posts!
As a part time resident of W Gilgo Beach, I, like many are anxious that the killer(s) will be brought to justice. I am very uncomfortable when I am out there.

I have wondered if the wildfires in Manorville, which were suspicious in nature, were not set by someone trying to cover up some of the evidence? I'm not sure if anyone has mentioned it, but it's worth a mention anyway.

I think newsday said fires started someplace way far away from where the bodies were found? The fire actually migrated towards that area by wind. Unless the serial kiiler is also an evil wizard as well. Thats JMCSTM (Just my crappy short term memory).
 
Just a warning that you may fi

So here is the true reality-

You have millions of households paying tens of thousands of dollars each in taxes (between property taxes, income taxes, sales taxes, government fees, etc...) and they (and their elected officials) are watching millions of those dollars being spent on an investigation to attempt to solve the murders of a handful of Jane Does and five (possibly six if we count SG) women from out of town who travelled to Long Island for the sole purpose of committing crimes. This is happening before everyone's eyes while the economy is in the pits, unemployment rates are sky high and living expenses are through the roof. School districts are laying off teachers because they can't afford to pay their salaries because there is not enough tax dollars to go around yet millions and millions of dollars are being spent to find the killers of victims who (for argument's sake) more than likely never contributed a dime in taxes themselves.

I know this sounds harsh (because it is, but they are not my views!). And I know on the surface this doesn't say much about the Long Island community. However, dig a little deeper and you can start to appreciate that it's not the community & the elected officials looking to be cruel towards the victims. This same scenario is played out in suburban communities everywhere (so don't be upset with Long Islanders).

In a perfect world, everyone surely would want the LISK off of the streets and behind bars. But the simple fact remains that in our world... our reality is all about MONEY. There is only so much that can be allocated towards an investigation before you have to either


1) Raise taxes to continue to sustain the investigation.

2) Attempt to secure State or Federal aid/assistance with the investigation.

3) Put the investigation on a budget (or on the cold case pile).

Obviously, the morally correct course of action is to respect the victims for who they were (beautiful, loving human beings) and not classify them based upon their occupation, their unfortunate addictions, or where they came from. Usually in the public eye (and on paper), local governments/police departments usually go out of their way to make it appear that they treat all victims (including prostitutes, drug addicts, & convicted felons) with equal respect and protection (justice is supposed to be blind right?) Whether or not the police department indeed made themselves appear this way in this case is subject to debate. Regardless of appearances, we all know the truth of how gang members, prostitutes, junkies, etc... Simply do not receive the same sense of urgency from law enforcement when a crime is committed against them as would a member of the mainstream public.

And then the sad truth is that eventually most of these cases hit a brick wall.

The leads stop rolling in...

There are no longer any known victims that are missing from the area...

Time passes by without any more remains being found...

Nobody ever steps forward to identify the Jane & John Does...

At about the same time that these cases hit those brick walls, the money to investigate them almost completely runs out. New cases (many much easier to solve) take the spotlight and demand the department investigate them. And since most of the residents and their families never actually felt threatened by a "killer of prostitutes", nobody will seem to care much about this case (just as most people stopped caring about the Butcher of Manorville for such a long period of time).

I know this makes you angry because it makes me angry (and rightfully so).

The problem is that this isn't a perfect world.

Crimes need to be solved.

Murderers need to be put behind bars.

A very large percentage of successful police work is based upon timing and taking advantage of windows of opportunity at the time when they present themselves for the taking. In a perfect world there would be unlimited resources with unlimited manpower using the most expensive state-of-the-art technology. In that perfect world, almost every crime can be solved and almost every murderer could be put behind bars. But in our world, this simply is not the case.


Yet they can spend billions of tax dollars on a war against a harmless inanimate object that grows naturally from mother earth. Oh that's right a serial killer has nothing on that I guess. Prostitutes might not pay taxes but every-time you lock them up along with non violent drug offenders the local LE gets 50 grand of tax money from the state to pay for it. I take that back they do actually pay taxes. Cops steal their money and property most of time because there the law and they can. So incarcerating prostitutes and pot heads is helping to pay lazy LE salary; that are two stupid to catch a few killers. God did anyone see the male detective on the Gilbert Disappeared episode? He is so slow and lacking any intelligence; I wouldn't hire him as a crossing guard. How is this guy going to ever a chance to catch a killer? :floorlaugh:
 
Detective? I think you are referring to the former police commissioner. LOL
 
Yet they can spend billions of tax dollars on a war against a harmless inanimate object that grows naturally from mother earth.

harmless inanimate object growing from the earth?

.gov is waging a war against these homicidal photosynthesizers because the brambles killed SG, weren't you listening to the police, she ran right into the evil hands of the brambles & thicket and the plants killed her, removed her hyoid bone so the ME wouldn't know who did it, then buried her possessions behind the doctors house in an effort to frame him. The salt marsh is evil and the ground there is sour, it's a malicious place just like it's depraved cousin 'the deserted parking garage'... always kidnapping vulnerable women when they are alone and helpless.
 

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Supposedly when Adolf Hitler was proposing the 'final solution' he received objections from peers, who objected to the genocide plans based on the expected world criticism and condemnation.

Hitler's reply was........ who remembers the Armenians?

The point is in the grand scheme of things in the USA in the year 2012 the deaths of SG and the others is a very low priority. Nobody really cares.

Many of us sleuthers will lose interest, become occupied with other issues in our lives or just drift away.

So what is to be done?

1) Friends and Relatives of the deceased must never stop keeping the case in the forefront of the media and politicians.

2) Suffolk County Politicians must be constantly be reminded to call local LE to task on these crimes.

3) The media should assign a investigative reporter(s) and get to the bottom of this case.

4) LE must be active, not just wait for a tip. Investigate, lay charges, rattle some cages, make things happen.Somebody out there knows a lot more, LE has to fnd those people and get them to help.

5) We sleuthers have to come up with ideas and action plans to keep the cases going


Remember the deceased were human beings, just like you and I.

MOO
 
Who knows, maybe the sk is right under our noses. I just read a little piece about the serial killer Edmund Kemper. Apparently he used to hang out at the local bar, befriend the cops who frequented the joint and ask questions about the case. They never suspected him. Actually, according to the article, he turned himself in! Not sure if that is accurate.

Question for Mr. Brendt and anyone else who has researched serial killers and knows the answer: Is this more common than we might think? Were there many other serial killers that you know of who hung out with the cops and offered assistance in order to be involved in the investigation?
 
Who knows, maybe the sk is right under our noses. I just read a little piece about the serial killer Edmund Kemper. Apparently he used to hang out at the local bar, befriend the cops who frequented the joint and ask questions about the case. They never suspected him. Actually, according to the article, he turned himself in! Not sure if that is accurate.

Question for Mr. Brendt and anyone else who has researched serial killers and knows the answer: Is this more common than we might think? Were there many other serial killers that you know of who hung out with the cops and offered assistance in order to be involved in the investigation?

Definitely not the norm. Kemper "cured" himself by finally killing his mom who was the object of his rage. But unfortunately a slew of young coeds as well as his grandparents were killed in the mean time. I wonder where the weakness or tendency to transfer or displace in serials comes from. We all may have bad days at work and take it out on our kids etc but in serial killers it seems a real common flaw in their personality to be vulnerable to extreme transference. I wonder what studies have been done with that focus.
 

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