AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #11

[carbuff]

Running to the bathroom could have been a way to protect Jayme. Mamma animals run in the opposite direction of their young when a predator is nearby. Perhaps Denise was reacting the same way - to get the perp to chase her, not find Jayme, and perhaps in the hope Jayme could run away.

Total speculation. jmo

I don't know what was in Denise's head, but in the same situation I would most likely have tried to hide and call 911, because that would be our best chance of surviving. I'm not a large person or a strong one. I'm not trained in martial arts or firearms. If there's a person with a gun attacking, I'm not going to tackle them one on one and take the gun away.

 

[cricket]

This case has been so frustrating because so little info has been released. LE has been incredibly disciplined in not leaking details.

Not sure why I think this, but my gut tells me that this crime started much earlier in the evening and that other gunshots and violence occurred before the neighbors got home that night. That the two shots we know about were not the only shots.

JMO

 

[Deleted member 158085]

I feel like I scooped their "exclusive reporting" with my post this morning.

They probably read it here first.

 

[DocBrew]

That kicked in door hurts that theory. Plus, that game was over a good hour before the gunshots were heard.

The game being over an hour before shots rang out doesn't matter too much, but the kicked in door is a problem with that theory for sure. Dang it. Just trying really hard to account for that 20 minute or so time discrepancy between neighbors story/911 call, as well as Jayme's leaving alive. I mean, if it was a friend or friends of mom or dad hanging out and things getting out of control late, I could see Jayme reasoning with them or - if they have known her for years - them taking her instead of hurting her.

JMO.

 

[cluciano63]

LE may not even know yet who the target was or the motive.

 

[MntnHiker]

A huge thank you to everyone who went out and helped with the search today! And here's hoping that one of the tips pans out with some much-needed info, either about the vehicle at the motel or the strange man at the gas station.

I could see Denise being the target, now that we are thinking of that idea and tossing around that possibility. All JMO of course, but it could even be someone she wasn't aware of or knew very well. Someone who got interested in her from somewhere in town, followed her, watched her, etc. The only thing I get stuck on is why wait until her husband is at home to attack. However, as pointed out before, we don't know for sure what time her husband got home from work that day. And we know she was at a family event with Jayme earlier. Perhaps there wasn't much time that she was home alone that evening and the perp wanted to wait until after dark when most people are asleep and there would be less traffic passing the house? Or it could just be an irrational, crazed person who didn't care either way who was there and was just going to barge in to get her regardless.

 

[LeafPeeper]

The simplest explanation is still that the perp (or perps?) was there to take Jayme and killed the parents because they got in the way. To me, that is the only one that doesn't have any major drawbacks. Any theory revolving around one (or both) of the parents being a target just doesn't hold much water when you consider the fact that she was taken.

I agree. But I am also not discounting the possibility that there may be multiple targets and a multiplicity of purposes. It doesn't have to be either/or. As others have pointed out - there are much simpler ways to get your hands on a 13 year old than busting into a house guns blazing (think Elizabeth Smart and any number of other examples). No, I think the purpose was ALSO to take out one or both parents. I still think it was personal. All JMO and speculation subject to change as/when more info becomes available.

 

[MassGuy]

The game being over an hour before shots rang out doesn't matter too much, but the kicked in door is a problem with that theory for sure. Dang it. Just trying really hard to account for that 20 minute or so time discrepancy between neighbors story/911 call, as well as Jayme's leaving alive. I mean, if it was a friend or friends of mom or dad hanging out and things getting out of control late, I could see Jayme reasoning with them or - if they have known her for years - them taking her instead of hurting her.

JMO.

We’re all having problems with that time discrepancy. There really hasn’t been a theory that I’ve heard, that I’m sold on.

If this crime was that close to home, and this was someone invited into their home, I would have expected a break by now.

So frustrating.

 

[RoiPD86]

I don't post very often here but I follow many of the cases here and have been following this one from the beginning. For me, every theory that I came up with or read was logical until I got to the final question: Why was Jayme taken? So, I have been thinking and thinking.....And I came up with this after reading Mark Fuhrman's comments. What if Denise was the target. And they fully intended to leave after killing James and Denise. Maybe Jayme was hiding? Then Jayme somehow finds a phone can calls 911. Makes a break for it and ends up outside just as the perps are making their escape. They almost have to grab her and make a run for it at that point. They scoop her up and ...well here is were I don't think it ends well for poor Jayme. This is just my opinion, of course!!!

Good thinking! It surely is possible and the killer erred on the side of caution and took Jayme, thinking she could layer hem him up.

 

[justwannahelp]

Is anyone familiar with the 2002 abduction of Jennifer Short? It is eerily similar! In 2002 a husband-wife and only daughter were living off a highway in South Carolina. The parents were each shot in the head and the 9-year-old was kidnapped and found 1 month later.

Here’s an article from Oct 1st, 2018 on the Jennifer Short case. If I’m understanding the article correctly, investigators have a new lead so are bringing trying to get it back out in the public. Just thought was interesting. I had never heard of this case. It’s VERY much like this Closs case. The family was last seen at Burger King
Around 11pm. They had no family disputes— and they couldn’t figure out why anyone would want to kill them. They were just a family of 3 in a sleepy little town
Jennifer is such a cute little 9 year old. You can see nothing but hope and the love of life in her sweet smile.

 

[SharonNeedles]

If we’re going to judge based on what motive fits the facts as we know them, the only motive that fits is that somebody wanted to unleash jaw-dropping terror in a Friday the 13th style attack. Maybe a thrill-kill, gang initiation, who knows. As much pain as possible. Any other motive has the perp doing something he doesn’t need or necessarily want to do.

 

[Inthedetails]

Great map. I like the feature of filtering the labels on the map. Cool.

Thank you!

@thesnowflakesparkles, can you add a label for the search along the 14-mile stretch to the west? There have been two public searches so far.

Thanks!

 

[Schmitz5100]

Did I read correctly somewhere that the parents were somewhat overprotective of Jayme?

 

[SuziQ]

Not the storm door. Their main door has a small window in it

I just remembered something. At the beginning of the case, there were pictures showing LE on the deck. They were gathered around something with great interest.

Thoughts?

I don't know where to begin to find and link the pictures

 

[BB71]

By his own logic, I disagree. If DC had been the target he would have shot her and left, not taken JC with him. He took the prize with him, JC. DC and JamesC were just obstacles that needed to be removed.
I'm inclined to think she's still alive. So much to go through to just grab a child and then kill her. After the AH case, I learned that when something like this happens the person who commits the crime has had perhaps years to plan it out so they're well prepared to carry out that plan.

So did he take her bec she was a witness, because she was valuable in some way, or

Is there a cell tower in the area they are searching today?

If she recharged her battery also I believe

Back to phones. The 911 initial report says that after the 911 call from the cell in the house was made and lost, the 911 operator tried calling back the number, no answer. 911 operator then called the landline, which had been "disconnected" What do you sleuths interpret that to mean? And thank you for the "welcome". Using my phone to type so sorry for format issues.

It means that people use cell phones, not landlines now. But could their phone have been cut off? Were the
lines even literally cut?? That seems pretty old school. While an old adage,
“Follow the money”, is a useful strategy in this case. If Mom owed a lot years back (previous poster cited court record), she may have needed to take a substantial loan for quick cash. Did these money lenders threaten her and her family if it wasn’t repaid w interest in a timely fashion?

 

[Deleted member 158085]

Consider the source here, but whoah!

Jayme Closs Case Break: Police Receive Chilling Tip Conversation With Strange Man

“You know I hate this area. [There are] just plant jobs. That’s all there is. What do you think about the Jacob Wetterling case? I think I know who did it,” the man continued. “Kids go missing and women go missing all the time. They get taken from their homes or vehicles and are never found. You never know how many bodies a person has. There could be 18 bodies buried across the country and no one would ever know.”

That's wackadoodle. If a man had actually said those things to me, I'd have notified LE at the time so he'd be on their radar.

 

[amomandherblog]

I know it was stupid, I didn't know her or her family, but I cried when the news came through that she was alive.

We drove to NH for the vigil when Abby first went missing. Her mom, who had no idea who we were, thanked us for coming. I cried when she came home, too.

 

[Inthedetails]

We’re all having problems with that time discrepancy. There really hasn’t been a theory that I’ve heard, that I’m sold on.

If this crime was that close to home, and this was someone invited into their home, I would have expected a break by now.

So frustrating.

The theories about the time that I'm leaning toward are either 1) the neighbor is mistaken about the time she heard them and/or 2) the neighbor didn't hear all the shots that were shot.

The more interviews the neighbor gives, the more I think she is unintentionally mistaken about the time.

jmo

 

[Schmitz5100]

I thought at first we were reading too much into the caretaker thing but I’m thinking about it a little differently now. Perhaps James and Denise has reason to believe that there was some kind of trouble waiting for them. Who knows what, it could be something they were keeping a secret even from family. This would explain the reason they needed to have such a close eye on Jayme with a caretaker...even going so far as following the caretaker when she moved and transferring schools. Just another theory to float out there.

 

[BB71]

Yep that's what I said. I think that's the reason there was a time gap.

Well, that is chilling.