AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #19

[MassGuy]

I tut-tutted these comments in the early threads but now I have to say it: I can't believe it's been this long with nothing.

I'm afraid it's going to end up being some predator unknown as of now to both the public and LE, who we'll all be talking about in 20 years when he's finally caught.

I hope I'm wrong.

I completely agree. If this was something that occurred “close to home” or was some sort of online predator, we’d have an arrest by now.

I’m now leaning towards something random, and we know how those cases tend to go.

There’s still hope, but an ugly reality lurking.

 

[Wrenny]

Googling various things about Challengers, it seems they are a car of choice for crimes, either for committing crimes or for stealing them. A 2012 Challenger was reported stolen in Galesburg IL, a couple days after Jayme went missing. Color is not mentioned. Galesburg police investigate report of stolen car Unknown year or color reported stolen in Niles IL (Chicago suburb) Oct 15. 30-35 cars including Challengers (unspecified year/color) were stolen from a dealership in Atlanta in May.

 

[KLM6]

I completely agree. If this was something that occurred “close to home” or was some sort of online predator, we’d have an arrest by now.

I’m now leaning towards something random, and we know how those cases tend to go.

There’s still hope, but an ugly reality lurking.

Im starting to think most of the theories I still believe are out of wishful thinking. I hate being anything less than optimistic about this little girls life, but its getting more difficult each day. I do still kind of wonder if its possible someone is scared to come forward with any info due to the nature of this scene? This was brutal, and I feel like somebody somewhere has to at least suspect something.

 

[MassGuy]

Im starting to think most of the theories I still believe are out of wishful thinking. I hate being anything less than optimistic about this little girls life, but its getting more difficult each day. I do still kind of wonder if its possible someone is scared to come forward with any info due to the nature of this scene? This was brutal, and I feel like somebody somewhere has to at least suspect something.

That’s a problem most people have, we want to hope for the best, even in the face of information that paints a grim picture.

No one wants to believe that this innocent girl, has met a grizzly fate.

The odds are that she has, no matter what we want to believe.

I just hope that the family gets answers, and justice.

 

[human]

I was talking to my husband about this situation.

He said that the Challenger is an expensive car. He said that LE can check all states for Challenger car registration

I wonder if they run each car to see if the owner has some kind of criminal record.

Breaking into Jayme’s house Sunday night if she was the target was a good plan. She would be home rather than at a sleepover party.

If they had tried another night, someone may see them or come home unexpectedly. It is a good choice. Late Sunday night

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Breaking into Jayme’s house Sunday night if she was the target was a good plan. She would be home rather than at a sleepover party.

If they had tried another night, someone may see them or come home unexpectedly. It is a good choice. Late Sunday night

bbm
Perhaps Jayme even had a second home with her auntie since she had changed school, a home for Monday - Friday because of her working parents and her many activities after school. Perhaps Jayme spent only the weekends at her parents' home? She could have met her parents or one of them at any time anyway in her free time. Both had a car for being mobile.
We wouldn't have learned that from the aunt/the Sheriff, I think, because of the ongoing investigation. Only my thoughts of course.

 

[margarita25]

I completely agree. If this was something that occurred “close to home” or was some sort of online predator, we’d have an arrest by now.

I’m now leaning towards something random, and we know how those cases tend to go.

There’s still hope, but an ugly reality lurking.

I totally hear what you’re saying, but for argument’s sake (in a good way of course ), imo, just because they haven’t found the perp(s), it doesn’t necessarily mean that he is still not close or that an online predator was not at play. It just could mean they are getting away with it, whether lucky or covering their tracks well or both. We have seen couuuntless cases where the killer was “right there”—-yes, I know it’s a small town, etc..and the investigation has been very thorough.
Additionally, if the perp was using the Dark Web or anonymous stuff, etc he could have somehow groomed her with an anonymous phone in her possession, etc..maybe like Nicole Lovell...just so many scenarios.

I do however strongly lean towards an escalated home invasion as a strong possibility and I still think anything is still on the table at this point for me. Random, known, close, far...if LE doesn’t know then I sure as heck don’t know. But I do recall in Jessica Ridgeway’s case that LE stated they thought the perp was possibly local. In this case LE has not said otherwise so it makes me wonder. In Abby’s and Libby’s case they clearly expanded nationally with billboards...have they done that here?

There’s probably soooo much we don’t know, that LE has thoroughly investigated, all the people who may have crossed roads with then Closs’...
So, I guess your logic really does make good sense, maybe they are nowhere near and random.

I’m just baffled around. Sorry my post isn’t really clear it’s 4am and fading fast.

The home invasion style, location, brutality, etc still makes me think we could possibly be looking at multiple perps, gang folks, moo, jmo.

—-
ETA: I ask again, where are James’ guns? I haven’t seen this answered yet but sorry if I missed it.

 

[margarita25]

So here’s a crazy theory that just popped in my head.

Say there is some kind of connection to the parents, that they were the target...What if Jayme was kidnapped before and held at another location while the perps went to the home and interrogated her parents, saying for instance “tell us this or that” or we are going to kill Jayme unless you “insert blank”...and say they really didn’t know the answer to whatever they wanted, or couldn't give them whatever they might have wanted, so everyone ended up getting killed (and/or maybe killing them all along was the plan wether or not they got what they wanted).

Just a thought, please feel free to poke holes (I know you guys will haha).

WTA: wait though doesn’t wouldn’t make sense becasue didnt LE say they think she was definitely in the home right? And what did they base this on again? If all they heard was “yelling”...

Please disregard this post if it’s a total brain fart.

 

[cluciano63]

At this point, I am starting to think of Abby/Libby, only because so many people thought that the perp must be a local, that someone must know something, etc...being such a small town and unspeakable, shocking event. Yet we are going on two years in that case, even with a video of the perp, which is almost unprecedented, imo.

The difference I see is that I doubt this was a random crime in the way this prior one was (imo.) The chances should be much greater in finding the perp(s) and it is still under a month since the murders. I am not convinced that anyone else knows, especially if there was just one perp, but still feel hopeful it can be solved. Just not sure LE has any real leads as yet...

 

[JnRyan]

So here’s a crazy theory that just popped in my head.

Say there is some kind of connection to the parents, that they were the target...What if Jayme was kidnapped before and held at another location while the perps went to the home and interrogated her parents, saying for instance “tell us this or that” or we are going to kill Jayme unless you “insert blank”...and say they really didn’t know the answer to whatever they wanted, or couldn't give them whatever they might have wanted, so everyone ended up getting killed (and/or maybe killing them all along was the plan wether or not they got what they wanted).

Just a thought, please feel free to poke holes (I know you guys will haha).

WTA: wait though doesn’t wouldn’t make sense becasue didnt LE say they think she was definitely in the home right? And what did they base this on again? If all they heard was “yelling”...

Please disregard this post if it’s a total brain fart.

If you had posted this 2 weeks ago, I would have laughed. Now the only theory that seems to be too far out there is she was taken by aliens.

 

[rosesfromangels]

If this was something that occurred “close to home” or was some sort of online predator, we’d have an arrest by now.

Respectfully snipped for focus.
I originally speculated that the Perp had taken Jayme and crossed in to the interior of Canada. Others have suggested a hunting cabin. The reality is she could be in a basement a block away from her home, and I am beginning to think this might be the strongest possibility. My reasoning is that if LE thinks they have narrowed down the Perp cars to two, but can't spot them on street cams outside of town....well either they switched cars, or are hunkered down locally.
I don't think we should rule out that the Perp is hiding in plain sight close by.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[Wrenny]

At this point, I am starting to think of Abby/Libby,

Have you noticed how much Jayme looks like Abby?

Now the only theory that seems to be too far out there is she was taken by aliens.

I wouldn't discount it.

 

[GordianKnot]

It has been hard keeping up with this case and usually by the time I'm caught up on a thread, it closes for the night.

My thought has been similar to what was discussed on the previous thread. What if someone had behaved inappropriately toward Jayme and her parents confronted the person? They would have removed Jayme from that environment, maybe even filed a complaint. If a complaint was made to the unsub's employer, he may have been fired, which would cause him to be angry at Jayme's parents for making him lose his job.

I'd also thought if the Closses had reported the unsub to LE, LE would already have a good suspect. But I thought the perp would have been identified by now if that was the case. Maybe not, though, because LE wouldn't want the perp to know they were onto him. They could have a suspect, but not be able to locate him, and he is the key to finding Jayme also. Maybe that's why LE are so interested now in the vehicles (Challenger and SUV).

JMO

BBM:
IndyA, I also think this scenario is highly plausible.
Jayme's parents transferred her to a different school.
Was this just because her"family caretaker" moved to a new area, or did her parents have other reasons for wanting her out of her prior school environment?

 

[Steelslady]

I completely agree. If this was something that occurred “close to home” or was some sort of online predator, we’d have an arrest by now.

I’m now leaning towards something random, and we know how those cases tend to go.

There’s still hope, but an ugly reality lurking.

It took over 9 months for Nathaniel Kibby to be arrested, and it was several days after he dropped his victim off alive at the end of her street!

He was a local........had a job in town.

 

[Cryptic]

I was talking to my husband about this situation.

He said that the Challenger is an expensive car. He said that LE can check all states for Challenger car registration

A Challenger is also a 1970s retro muscle car throw back. It combines a throbbing high horse power / gas guzzling engine with very little in the way of back seats. None of this is very practical.

This totality makes the Challenger more like to be an "image" purchase where the buyer specifically seeks out the car specifically and likes the car and the impression it conveys. Image purchases can also become part of the buyer's well..... self image.

Thus, I think that a Challenger owner is more likely to self identify with the car. This means that they drive it frequently, wash it regularly, polish the chrome etc. They are also less likely to sell the car on impulse.

So.... maybe look for a situation where a once enchanted owner suddenly sold their car. Or a situation where it is now permanently garaged, or suddenly permanently loaned to a friend or family member etc. ?

 

[Trino]

Respectfully snipped for focus.
I originally speculated that the Perp had taken Jayme and crossed in to the interior of Canada. Others have suggested a hunting cabin. The reality is she could be in a basement a block away from her home, and I am beginning to think this might be the strongest possibility. My reasoning is that if LE thinks they have narrowed down the Perp cars to two, but can't spot them on street cams outside of town....well either they switched cars, or are hunkered down locally.
I don't think we should rule out that the Perp is hiding in plain sight close by.

Amateur opinion and speculation

Good thoughts except the entire community appears to be involved in trying to find Jayme. I just cannot wrap around the thought this is local. No ID of vehicles. The sheriff has been to every gas station/convenience store for miles - nothing. No one locally appears to be on the radar for LE.

 

[Trino]

I think there's a prior involvement somewhere somehow, something we are missing.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I woke up this morning thinking about Denise.

After reading she made sure to buy gifts for everyone I felt such a heart felt connection with her.

During birthdays or Christmases always held at our home for our large family and friends I always make sure no one is ever left out.

It is common for our children to call and ask us if it's okay if our grandchildren bring along playmates and of course the answer is always 'sure...of course its fine' and then I make sure I have a gift or gifts for them too.

I have never been able to stand the thought of anyone being leftout. I do this for adults as well if they decide to join us at the last minute. Everyone who enters our home at times of gift giving aren't ever overlooked even if they expected no gifts.

I have no doubt Denise will be so sadly missed for her kind and endearing inclusiveness for all.

It makes me wish I had personally known her before the monster came to their front door and destroyed all of the goodness there and replaced it with unbelievable evil.

God bless them all.

 

[VeryVeritas]

Respectfully snipped for focus.
I originally speculated that the Perp had taken Jayme and crossed in to the interior of Canada. Others have suggested a hunting cabin. The reality is she could be in a basement a block away from her home, and I am beginning to think this might be the strongest possibility. My reasoning is that if LE thinks they have narrowed down the Perp cars to two, but can't spot them on street cams outside of town....well either they switched cars, or are hunkered down locally.
I don't think we should rule out that the Perp is hiding in plain sight close by.

Amateur opinion and speculation

1) Canada, MSP, Mexico, or walking distance are all possible.
2) MO = experienced criminal or killer (military, hunter, ex cop, etc)
3) Motive. This is where my mind is focused. It would be extremely unusual that if Jayme were the motive, that a sudden forced home entry and double murder would occur. Clearly perp(s) were well prepared. To me there is something else going on here. It is possible that this was an execution. But for what? Its possible there is a psycho (BTK type) right under the nose of LE who did this just on impulse, yet they knew how to do this with skill. There is no doubt in my mind the perp(s) have killed before.
If someone wanted to abduct Jayme, there are far less brazen ways to try. If this was purely about Jayme, this scene is incredibly rare. So, I have to think there is another motivation. Money, Revenge, Drugs, Organized crime, Psycho all seem highly possible to me. It also seems that they know the area pretty well... lots of study = pro, or someone that is local or frequents the area.

 

[SeattleStew]

Missing Person Case

Somewhere in the last thread Jayme's case was referenced in Namus. It says

"Jayme was last seen in Barron, WI on 10/15/2018 at 12:58am."

But wasn't the 911 call at 12:56am? Deputies arrived at 1:00am per call log.

What do they mean? Last seen at 12:58am?