AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #24

[tiffkinsadder]

The timing of the shots isn't a clear fact.

LE has never said anything about those shots. I definitely believe they heard shots, but I'm doubtful that the neighbors are correct about the time.

I wonder if LE could use the time of the video recording of the car((s) and link that with the shots heard?

 

[bellyup]

So the 911 dispatch got the call at 12:58am. LE was there by 1:03 or 1:04 (I don’t have the log handy so humor me pls) but that’s more like a 6 minute time frame. From when the call was disconnected to when the cops arrived. That’s a lot of time to grab Jayme and escape.

I'm going by police statement that it was 4 minutes.
Like I said, possible ... just not the most likely scenario in my mind. Not with the neighbors reports of hearing shots.

 

[SandyQLS]

Just my opinion but I don't think the initial dispatch should be dismissed as "it was an error" or "it was a shocked reaction of first responders" (it wasn't).

Obviously we know it wasn't a suicide. But WHAT made the 911 dispatcher think it was?

Officer #329

WI - WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron,Media, Maps and Timelines *NO DISCUSSION*

1:03 329 ADVISED OF A POSSIBLE SUICIDE ATTEMPT. REQUESTED ASSISTANCE FROM BARRON PD.

It is Officer #329 who advised and requested in the above, not the dispatcher.

The actual logs are available as a 14-page pdf.

 

[andreww]

We know there was a struggle. A 47 second 911 call. It's pretty likely that Denise or Jayme tried to fight or hide.

You're now down to 193 seconds (3.2 minutes) to kill two people and grab another and get away without a trace. It's a tight time frame that I am struggling with seeing as the most likely scenario.

MOO it's much more realistic to believe the neighbors reports 22 minutes before were the gunshots that likely killed Denise and James.

I don't think that is improbable at all. The neighbour heard two shots very quickly. Thats where the clock starts. At this point James is dead and Denise is likely mortally wounded. In that small house the perp has just less than 4 minutes to locate Jayme and force her out the front door. I'm almost thinking thats too much time. My guess is he forced he to put on some clothes, then left.

 

[tiffkinsadder]

I could buy into this being the case but you, yourself stated it was 1:03 on the neighbors clock. So it seems less likely that she misconstrued the time.

I thought the neighbor said it was 12:30. Which doesn’t really fit into what I believe happened. I do believe shots were heard and had something to do with the crime. IMO

 

[bizzle2]

Just to clear this up...

The 911 call came in at 12:53am
Someone on the other end of the call hung up, and the 911 operator tried calling the phone back as well as the landline at the house. No one answered those calls.
Police were dispatched at 12:56am
Police arrived on scene at 1:00am

Here is the call log: http://media.graytvinc.com/documents/barron+county+call+log.pdf

It makes a heck of a lot of sense to me that the shots were actually at 12:51am (which would be 12:58 by the neighbors clock) and that James was killed at that time. The perp then rushes into the home to find the other occupants. There may be a struggle of some kind, or Denise/Jayme may be hiding. One of them manages to make the 911 call at 12:53am after finding a hiding place or briefly getting away from the killer. The perp then finds them and hangs up the phone. Kills Denise. (Perp may have already wounded her when she was trying to get away.) Perp puts a gun to Jayme's head and forces her out to the car to drive away at some point before the officers arrive at 1:00am.

 

[Curiousobserver]

So how do you catch a random person who left behind nothing (almost) but now has a 13 yr old girl he didn't have before? Never mind what happened inside- it doesn't appear to point to anybody.

Voice might be recognizable to someone on the 911 call.
Shell casings might tell you about the gun but its probably not unique
gun has blood on it
shoes might have blood on them, clothes
He may have left DNA behind and can be traced via familial relationships
He might have acted strangely the next day(s) but they would be on him by now
Would need a place to hide her if she is alive or a place to dispose of her if she isn't'- might live alone or have lots of property
Had to know Jayme would be there, not totally unfamiliar to the area- I assume she was the target
Tire tracks as you sped out of the gravel driveway
Cameras caught your car at 1am nearby
Blood etc.. in your car- noticed by someone or cleaned
dropped something along the way
ever made a comment about or got caught checking out young girls, or jayme specifically

 

[andreww]

I thought the neighbor said it was 12:30. Which doesn’t really fit into what I believe happened. I do believe shots were heard and had something to do with the crime. IMO

The neighbour stated shots were heard at 12:38 on their clock, 12:31 actual time.

 

[SandyQLS]

I would guess that they would have a very hard time getting a complete dump of all the data. Phone companies have no problem helping out pinpointing the whereabouts of a specific bad guy, however I doubt very much that they would want to turn over private information of thousands of innocent people to track a bad guy down.

In the Missy Bevers case, they did exactly that. There are search warrants in her media thread for local tower dumps. Her murder was in the wee AM about 5:30 iirc and also in a rural area. Maybe they had a reason to believe that the murderer fled the towers area, moved on to other towers, and could be tracked. Not sure if that would help in this case.

 

[tiffkinsadder]

Officer #329

WI - WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron,Media, Maps and Timelines *NO DISCUSSION*

1:03 329 ADVISED OF A POSSIBLE SUICIDE ATTEMPT. REQUESTED ASSISTANCE FROM BARRON PD.

It is Officer #329 who advised and requested in the above, not the dispatcher.

The actual logs are available as a 14-page pdf.

Yes.

 

[andreww]

Just to clear this up...

The 911 call came in at 12:53am
Someone on the other end of the call hung up, and the 911 operator tried calling the phone back as well as the landline at the house. No one answered those calls.
Police were dispatched at 12:56am
Police arrived on scene at 1:00am

Here is the call log: http://media.graytvinc.com/documents/barron+county+call+log.pdf

It makes a heck of a lot of sense to me that the shots were actually at 12:51am (which would be 12:58 by the neighbors clock) and that James was killed at that time. The perp then rushes into the home to find the other occupants. There may be a struggle of some kind, or Denise/Jayme may be hiding. One of them manages to make the 911 call at 12:53am after finding a hiding place or briefly getting away from the killer. The perp then finds them and hangs up the phone. Kills Denise. (Perp may have already wounded her when she was trying to get away.) Perp puts a gun to Jayme's head and forces her out to the car to drive away at some point before the officers arrive at 1:00am.

I agree, however I think Denise was already shot, just after James (12:52). The perp, assuming she's dead heads to Jamies room and grabs her. When he comes out he see's Denise has called 911 and he kicks the phone out of her hand. Then he leaves with Jayme.

 

[tiffkinsadder]

I see a lot of reason to question that the perp gained entry, killed two people, kidnapped another one and vanished into the night with a teenager on LE's four minute time line.

I'm WAY more inclined to believe that James and Denise were killed when the neighbor reported the two shots. Which would mean that most likely Jayme then got ahold of her moms phone and made that 911 call.

I saw it reported somewhere that the officers felt the phone had been kicked based on where they found it. The commotion in the distance that LE has reported makes me believe Jayme was caught making the call. The perp grabbed her away from the phone, walked back, hit end and kicked the phone and left immediately with Jayme.

I agree.

 

[tiffkinsadder]

Did it ever say anywhere if the neighbors looked out their window or went outside after hearing shots so close to their house?

They didn’t unfortunately .

 

[SandyQLS]

I believe turning off the phone nor removing the battery does not affect the ability to track a phone. IMO

LOL. I think if you remove the battery, the phone is dead, and that is the only way to be sure it is not tracked.

You also are not required to have the GPS locator turned on unless you want it.

Also, some IP addresses are not unique. There are static IP addresses and there are rotating IP addresses. It depends.

 

[bellyup]

Just to clear this up...

The 911 call came in at 12:53am
Someone on the other end of the call hung up, and the 911 operator tried calling the phone back as well as the landline at the house. No one answered those calls.
Police were dispatched at 12:56am
Police arrived on scene at 1:00am

Here is the call log: http://media.graytvinc.com/documents/barron+county+call+log.pdf

It makes a heck of a lot of sense to me that the shots were actually at 12:51am (which would be 12:58 by the neighbors clock) and that James was killed at that time. The perp then rushes into the home to find the other occupants. There may be a struggle of some kind, or Denise/Jayme may be hiding. One of them manages to make the 911 call at 12:53am after finding a hiding place or briefly getting away from the killer. The perp then finds them and hangs up the phone. Kills Denise. (Perp may have already wounded her when she was trying to get away.) Perp puts a gun to Jayme's head and forces her out to the car to drive away at some point before the officers arrive at 1:00am.

I was mistaken on some details (ie; the dispatch vs the officer being the one to report suicide attempt). Thank you for the clarification. Your scenario also provides a couple more minutes which makes the tight time frame seem more doable.

 

[1987]

LOL. I think if you remove the battery, the phone is dead, and that is the only way to be sure it is not tracked.

You also are not required to have the GPS locator turned on unless you want it.

Also, some IP addresses are not unique. There are static IP addresses and there are rotating IP addresses. It depends.

mac address are unique and every device has one.

 

[andreww]

I see a lot of reason to question that the perp gained entry, killed two people, kidnapped another one and vanished into the night with a teenager on LE's four minute time line.

I'm WAY more inclined to believe that James and Denise were killed when the neighbor reported the two shots. Which would mean that most likely Jayme then got ahold of her moms phone and made that 911 call.

I saw it reported somewhere that the officers felt the phone had been kicked based on where they found it. The commotion in the distance that LE has reported makes me believe Jayme was caught making the call. The perp grabbed her away from the phone, walked back, hit end and kicked the phone and left immediately with Jayme.

Your theory has a few flaws. The shots were within seconds of each other. Jayme would have undoubtedly been in bed at close to 1:00, and likely fast asleep. So she would have to get up without the perp seeing her, find her way to her moms phone and make the call, without being noticed. Looking at that house I have very little doubt that the perp could see the entire layout from the front door. I just don't see room for covert movement.

 

[andreww]

mac address are unique and every device has one.

Exactly. The IP address that connects to your router is not the IP address that I'm talking out here.

 

[Maybelline]

I agree. So I have to wonder who wanted Jayme?
It's possible that this was some random predatory individual that had been watching her but I can't shake the feeling that this was more personal. Maybe Jayme had been a source of support to this person in their time of need? Maybe they had previously been friends and the kid got into trouble and as such they were kept apart?

I don't think it was a "boyfriend" per se. Rather a friend that was a boy. Someone Jayme cared about in some manner. By all accounts they were a giving family involved in church, volunteerism, etc. Jayme was reported as shy and quiet. I think it's possible that someone took advantage of Jayme's nature.

I really hope that LE is considering all boys / men that may have interacted with her through community service, church work, school etc. over a long period of time. My gut says this was a grudge for a perceived wrong doing.

If the criminal/criminals were looking to take someone that was shy and was a compliant type of teen, it sounds like Jayme would have fit those characteristics. I say looking for a.shy/compliant teen because it would be easier to dominate and scare that type of person I would think. Good luck to someone who would try to take my rebellious, at times grouchy and disagreeable teens.

 

[bellyup]

mac address are unique and every device has one.

IP addresses are not device specific. The external IP address is assigned by your ISP to your router which in turn assigns different internal IP addresses to all devices in the network.

Changing an IP isn't difficult.