AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #31

[ilovechili]

In the Wetterling case there was a ton of info such as reports by neighbor kids that the perp ( unknown that he was the perp at the tine) had been stalking them.

He is a small guy and his footprints had to be small. They had the thread from a jacket that matched an earlier kidnapping with a thread in the perp’s car.

Nobody knew this. If it had been let out, maybe he would have been busted sooner. At least he did not kill any other kids.

It was so ridiculous in hindsight. Keeping the info.

Hopefully, things are different with Jayme

I think that is what is difficult for us average people to understand. If they know who did it and are building a case it is one thing. And to hold some information close to the vest is important for obvious reasons so you have something only the perp would know. However, if you don't have a clue like in Wetterling, maybe releasing a bit more may have helped as you say. I would guess they did not have much or did they? So they held what they had? Even in that case though we knew where the boys were headed, where the parents were, what the events were, etc. from day one. That they biked, didn't they to get a movie and were returning?

Do you mean with the thread that the Wetterling perp had kidnapped before? I am not real up on the details, I just know after years he was caught and know their regrets about the case. I think they even feel it snowballed too fast past looking locally harder...?

I hope things go differently here too for Jayme. And people in the Wetterling area lived for years never knowing who it might be or whether he would do it again...

 

[human]

Great hideouts but it would be a certain type of person probably then unless he leaves her there and comes and goes. There are some nice ones but unless he owns it, he would have to break in. And many, maybe even most are wood heat with outhouses. So I picture a wood chopping, deer shooting (dinner) redneck type? Just saying...

Hm. The cabins I know are very nice. They usually have a heat source because it gets cold at night in MN and Wisc at night. Forced hot air by propane. The water is turned off and the pipes have antifreeze so they do not burst.

But plenty of people in MN and WI live very isolated. And perps have lived with their vistims practically on top of others. Castro. Jaycee Dugard. They do not need to live isolated.

 

[ilovechili]

My own thought for this scenario is that it would be owned by the perp or family. Seems really risky to squat in an unknown place without knowing when anyone may show up. And remember that a hunting cabin isn't always just for hunting. There's snowmobiling and ice fishing and stuff like that.

Quite true, I was thinking more if they broke into one and stayed there. It has happened where someone wanted for a crime is found hiding out in one. And sometimes it is not until spring before anyone realizes, if they know of someone from say Chicago, that only comes back up say come April. Why so many of them are broken into I suppose too.

So going with your theory, that would make it probably someone local who owns a cabin for hunting, ATV rides, fishing and such, so he probably has some means/a job and is older? Just trying to come up with some new thoughts. Are you thinking they are both there or he is only there sometimes and has her restrained there while he leaves and goes to work elsewhere with another home? I too have seen some nice hunting cabins that have it all and are very off any beaten path and cannot be seen so it is a perfect hideout. If you share it with others, as many do, that could present problems... What I mean by that is like you said above, they are often a family cabin...

 

[human]

That, and here's the demographics for Barron County:

U.S. Census Bureau QuickFacts: Barron County, Wisconsin

Wow. Great data

 

[human]

I think that is what is difficult for us average people to understand. If they know who did it and are building a case it is one thing. And to hold some information close to the vest is important for obvious reasons so you have something only the perp would know. However, if you don't have a clue like in Wetterling, maybe releasing a bit more may have helped as you say. I would guess they did not have much or did they? So they held what they had? Even in that case though we knew where the boys were headed, where the parents were, what the events were, etc. from day one. That they biked, didn't they to get a movie and were returning?

Do you mean with the thread that the Wetterling perp had kidnapped before? I am not real up on the details, I just know after years he was caught and know their regrets about the case. I think they even feel it snowballed too fast past looking locally harder...?

I hope things go differently here too for Jayme. And people in the Wetterling area lived for years never knowing who it might be or whether he would do it again...

Yes. The perp had kidnapped before. The child did not give him a high score in the line up but they had matching textile data from the child’s clothing in the perp’s car.

The children in the neighborhood had reported that they were being stalked by someone, but that was never reported to the public nor was it looked at by LE.

He was also attacking boys in another town.

An arrested pervert said the perp should be looked at. He was looked at by LE and let go. The media checked him out. But no one put the pieces together.

There were no computers then.

I wonder if there is some kind of computer program that puts together data. The Wetterling case had 40,000 pages of documents.

There were boxes and boxes of info. How that could be kept straight along with people retiring and moving on to different jobs.

Although LE says they have no info, there must be all kinds of DNA, phone, car, etc info. What happens with it?

 

[photographer4]

I thought all their phones and computers were checked out!

Sure. The ones they found / know about. Who’s to say a parent didn’t have a burner phone of their own in an affair’s name or for whatever nefarious purpose?

 

[The Dude]

Quite true, I was thinking more if they broke into one and stayed there. It has happened where someone wanted for a crime is found hiding out in one. And sometimes it is not until spring before anyone realizes, if they know of someone from say Chicago, that only comes back up say come April. Why so many of them are broken into I suppose too.

So going with your theory, that would make it probably someone local who owns a cabin for hunting, ATV rides, fishing and such, so he probably has some means/a job and is older? Just trying to come up with some new thoughts. Are you thinking they are both there or he is only there sometimes and has her restrained there while he leaves and goes to work elsewhere with another home? I too have seen some nice hunting cabins that have it all and are very off any beaten path and cannot be seen so it is a perfect hideout. If you share it with others, as many do, that could present problems... What I mean by that is like you said above, they are often a family cabin...

I don't know that I think of this as a complete theory, but in pondering the idea and your questions...

No idea who the perp is or how this is being funded, but I've also not ruled out the idea of an accomplice. I'm also not sure that every possible scenario requires Jayme to be restrained. All of this is, of course, based on the assumption that she's still alive. None of us knows that answer.

 

[Megnut]

I'd like help understanding something. In the 911 call log. 3:27am the morning of the crime. Two officers were dispatched to a secondary location. Previously identified here as a rental property. Why did LE go there? Was this a next-of-kin notification? Or something else?

 

[ilovechili]

Hm. The cabins I know are very nice. They usually have a heat source because it gets cold at night in MN and Wisc at night. Forced hot air by propane. The water is turned off and the pipes have antifreeze so they do not burst.

But plenty of people in MN and WI live very isolated. And perps have lived with their vistims practically on top of others. Castro. Jaycee Dugard. They do not need to live isolated.

I agree. I have seen some very nice ones. I guess I was thinking, since there have been a few cabin remarks, of one that you would have to hike into or get on a ATV to get to. I am not saying even those are not sometimes nice but not all are. I mean you have to have access to heat delivery, power entry to the cabin, etc. Otherwise one is talking a generator, running for a small propane tanks, chopping wood, etc. There also has to be a water source/well. There are all kinds of cabins from some they could almost call a second home to those that you may well call more of a shack... Just discussing to see where we can go with it or spur new thoughts... Not criticizing the idea at all...

 

[oceanstarryeyes]

Why is that person unknown ?

Labeled Unknown because we can’t name without proof.

 

[human]

Labeled Unknown because we can’t name without proof.

What I mean is how could the person be unknown if the person was at the birthday party?

 

[oceanstarryeyes]

What I mean is how could the person be unknown if the person was at the birthday party?

Not unknown to Jayme. Just not named in my post.

 

[ilovechili]

I don't know that I think of this as a complete theory, but in pondering the idea and your questions...

No idea who the perp is or how this is being funded, but I've also not ruled out the idea of an accomplice. I'm also not sure that every possible scenario requires Jayme to be restrained. All of this is, of course, based on the assumption that she's still alive. None of us knows that answer.

I hope you understand that I too am just asking questions to see where we can go with it. It is not to negate it, but to debate it and see where it takes us. I have no new theories at all so I am just going with other's ideas and asking for detail to see how it works out and where it can be taken. If she is alive, which is everyone's hope, she is somewhere. And if she is somewhere, it is likely not in plain sight or somewhere a lot of people pop in unannounced. In the alive scenario a cabin or remote location is probably right up there with number one as the likelihood.

 

[human]

I hope you understand that I too am just asking questions to see where we can go with it. It is not to negate it, but to debate it and see where it takes us. I have no new theories at all so I am just going with other's ideas and asking for detail to see how it works out and where it can be taken. If she is alive, which is everyone's hope, she is somewhere. And if she is somewhere, it is likely not in plain sight or somewhere a lot of people pop in unannounced. In the alive scenario a cabin or remote location is probably right up there with number one as the likelihood.

It really could be anywhere. John Wayne Gacy was right in a city.

 

[Megnut]

I has this eerie thought today. What if there IS a hideaway but it's not a FIXED hideaway? Not a house, bunker, cabin but a camper? Remember the dreadful abduction and murder of precious Danielle van Dam? Abducted from her bedroom in California. By a neighbor who left town, with her in his RV. It would be incredibly difficult to find a moving target, especially with what looks like minimal evidence in this case. As much as I hate to think of it, if Jayme were the target, the suspect may have been setting himself up for an 8-10+ hour head start. Minus the heroic 911 call, no one may have been alerted to the crime until mid-morning or later.... by then, he could be just about anywhere. Just as likely he didn't go far. JMO. Elizabeth Smart, brazen abduction, living off the grid nearby. Established dominance over Elizabeth, secured compliance through fear and terror. This is my latest theory. Again JMO.
Strength and peace and courage for Jayme's remaining family as they wait in agony --

 

[The Dude]

I hope you understand that I too am just asking questions to see where we can go with it. It is not to negate it, but to debate it and see where it takes us. I have no new theories at all so I am just going with other's ideas and asking for detail to see how it works out and where it can be taken. If she is alive, which is everyone's hope, she is somewhere. And if she is somewhere, it is likely not in plain sight or somewhere a lot of people pop in unannounced. In the alive scenario a cabin or remote location is probably right up there with number one as the likelihood.

Yep. Sometimes we kinda have to dance around with semantics and word salads in order to ponder certain scenarios. I'd actually thought of the cabin thing within a day or so after first hearing of the murders / disappearance. You can get outta Barron and to a gazillion areas where cabins are without ever passing a security camera.

 

[The Dude]

It really could be anywhere. John Wayne Gacy was right in a city.

I was a teen in Chicago's western suburbs when he was doing his evil clown stuff. *shudder*

Yes, it can be anywhere, but it seems reasonable to consider geographically local possibilities.

 

[human]

Do you think people have trail cameras? Cabins get broken into. Unless it really has nothing, I would think people take some precautions.

If it has nothing, getting in and out in winter as well as heating and water. Hm

 

[human]

I was a teen in Chicago's western suburbs when he was doing his evil clown stuff. *shudder*

Yes, it can be anywhere, but it seems reasonable to consider geographically local possibilities.

There are plenty of geographical places such as Minneapolis, Duluth, Eau Claire. My point it that it does not have to be isolated. It is not summer. Snow, cold. That means heat, snowplowing, water.

 

[margarita25]

Poll, Do you guys think Jayme is still alive or dead?