AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #31

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It’s hard for me to imagine anyone having a grudge this big over anything that happens in a workplace. The type of person that does something like this, most likely has never earned tenure before anyway...

I agree that it would seem like the reason for doing something so horrific would need to be significant but then I think of all the people that kill their spouse instead of getting a divorce, and I am reminded of the dark places people can go to mentally when they perceive a situation different than maybe it really is.
 
Canada is not out of the question but in my thought most perps do not do that. First you have the chance at being looked at at the ...........and that was the intent, my best guess is he has a home or a property. If not, I would think he probably would have been caught by now. Someone somehow at some point has to have a money source/job unless independently wealthy...

BBM, yes yes yes, ilovechili,

Thank you.
The perp did not take the wallet, keys, etc. on the table at the Closs home. Because, as you say, 'he has a home or a property' and a 'money source/job".

Money was not the primary target. Jayme was.
This was not a violent robbery gone bad by a youngster, with no means.

IMO: The perp was closer to the ages of James/Denise than to Jayme's age.
And the perp had means.

(JMHO)
 
The reason I would lean toward hunting cabin is because they tend to be more remote and hidden. Some require an ATV or hike to get to. Not so much the case with a business or rental.

Great hideouts but it would be a certain type of person probably then unless he leaves her there and comes and goes. There are some nice ones but unless he owns it, he would have to break in. And many, maybe even most are wood heat with outhouses. So I picture a wood chopping, deer shooting (dinner) redneck type? Just saying...
 
Who in the world would be at a child's birthday party that could inflict such horror? Are you thinking a family member?

i'm not suggesting anyone in particular or that specifically. i'm just trying to form a profile from a scenario that makes sense to me. unfortunately, in this scenario you would have to include family, friends of family and known to friends of family. i don't think this is random at all. and i don't know enough about the family (or anything really) or know of anything to suggest the party was a precipitating factor.

this is thread #31, and i have read very little of this one or any of the other threads, i just pop in occasionally to see there is any discussion here that shows promise outside of the media coverage.
 
Great hideouts but it would be a certain type of person probably then unless he leaves her there and comes and goes. There are some nice ones but unless he owns it, he would have to break in. And many, maybe even most are wood heat with outhouses. So I picture a wood chopping, deer shooting (dinner) redneck type? Just saying...
My own thought for this scenario is that it would be owned by the perp or family. Seems really risky to squat in an unknown place without knowing when anyone may show up. And remember that a hunting cabin isn't always just for hunting. There's snowmobiling and ice fishing and stuff like that.
 
BBM, yes yes yes, ilovechili,

Thank you.
The perp did not take the wallet, keys, etc. on the table at the Closs home. Because, as you say, 'he has a home or a property' and a 'money source/job".

Money was not the primary target. Jayme was.
This was not a violent robbery gone bad by a youngster, with no means.

IMO: The perp was closer to the ages of James/Denise than to Jayme's age.
And the perp had means.

(JMHO)

I can see that as one possible scenario. I can see why he did not take keys though, a traceable vehicle a BOLO can be put out on quickly. The wallet, again, the sheriff mentioned it but it may have had no money in it or he may not have had time. If it was someone young, he has some help or someone knows. Someone older I still do not see killing the parents but if it was someone online or someone that got in a rage at something he saw or thought, maybe. But I agree that if indeed someone has her or is keeping her, he has a place is the most likely. Or even more than one, a home and a cabin, etc.

You know, the authorities said they had never been called to the home before. However, I wonder if the family ever had need to go talk to the authorities. If for instance, someone was stalking her, for instance. You don't necessarily call them out to your home, you go in and see them. Just a thought.... If something happened for instance at school you would go in and talk to the City authorities, not county, that would be the same for anything in town I would imagine. The plant, McDonald's, the park. Just a thought. Had she had any prior problems with a predator type...? Reported to either LE agency?
 
But the choice of wording used by Jaymes relatives in the interviews right after the murders, pleading directly to Jayme to come home instead of directing their words to a stranger that may have kidnapped Jayme still remains a mystery why it sounded as though they assumed Jayme had the free will to return on her own.

The perp may have told her it is all of her fault.

The FBI has people who decide what words should be used
 
Canada is not out of the question but in my thought most perps do not do that. First you have the chance at being looked at at the border. Second if you have any felonies I believe you are not allowed in. Third if it is someone that is going to keep her, they are not going to easily get a job without ID, etc. and he needs a way to live and feed them unless he is going to "live off the land." And so forth. As for hunting cabins and even resort cabins and summer homes, lord there are so many that they could not all be searched here unless one looked at the perp and knew who and where he had ties to. If this is the type of perp that took her to keep her and that was the intent, my best guess is he has a home or a property. If not, I would think he probably would have been caught by now. I mean they can motel it but you have to move her and keep her quiet. If staying with someone they could tell LE. Someone somehow at some point has to have a money source/job unless independently wealthy...
These are very important things that you bring up. My take is that IF SHE IS ALIVE, perp is either going to work every day and no one has any clue she is locked up in his basement or they are like you said "living off the land" and are out in the woods somewhere. At some point money and food have got to come in to play.
 
Possible that she confided in an adult acquaintance

that matches my line of thought this morning and if the adult acquaintance was at the Birthday Party and what Jayme confided made that person so angry that they went to Jaymes house with a gun and then lost control (a crime of rage) killing both parents.
Jayme is taken away by the person and placed in a safe place and no one knows where that safe place is (that would solve the mystery of why Jaymes relatives interviews sounded as if Jayme had the power to return home on her own)
There was the birthday party the perfect opportunity for Jayme to confide in someone and that someone talk to other people that would be concerned about Jayme.

I hope this doesn’t get deleted because it possibly answers three mysteries in this case.

1. Why the relatives interviews talked directly to Jayme instead of a possible kidnapper

2 The fast brutal killing of both parents show a crime of rage.

3. The time being night (after the birthday party) the crime happened.

Why is that person unknown ?
 
i'm not suggesting anyone in particular or that specifically. i'm just trying to form a profile from a scenario that makes sense to me. unfortunately, in this scenario you would have to include family, friends of family and known to friends of family. i don't think this is random at all. and i don't know enough about the family (or anything really) or know of anything to suggest the party was a precipitating factor.

this is thread #31, and i have read very little of this one or any of the other threads, i just pop in occasionally to see there is any discussion here that shows promise outside of the media coverage.
Not denagrading your post at all. When there is no information we think out of the box and everywhere for a possible scenario. I just don't think Jayme was the target, but I do think it was someone known to all of them. Carry on. Good post!
 
I do believe the Jennie-O angle is quite important since James and Denise worked there for many years and most likely made many connections there over the years.
We have talked about every group on here including MS-13 , meth addicts, Mexican drug cartels , and American Indian groups. Spesking about the high percentage of foreign individuals that work at Jennie-O and live in the community shouldn’t be off limits .
As mentioned in The NY Times article written many weeks ago a local resident mentioned that kidnapping & murdering to obtain a child bride is very common among certain groups .Not saying this happened, but it shouldn’t be disregarded either . JMO . JMO.

I believe the child bride is a child of the culture
 
I've been thinking about all the things that we know we don't know. The things that LE has that we know zero about. The 911 recording. The 80 security vids, and who knows how many more when the cam search was extended. Every speck of dandruff in that house. Access to the family. Piles of interviews from Turkeyland to churches and schools. I could go on and on. Add to that having FBI resources at your disposal. And what are we told about all this?

'Well golly gee, we don't know anything at all about any of this.'

At some point fairly early on, it seems as if a decision was made to go into radio silence about everything. Now, I understand that there may be legitimate reasons for such a strategy, but I'm not sure what those would be. What sort of scenarios do you guys think would support this approach?

What has been the situation in other cases? In some that I can think of, they knew the perp but were building a case.

Perhaps that is why there is not that much from the family?
 
What has been the situation in other cases? In some that I can think of, they knew the perp but were building a case.

Perhaps that is why there is not that much from the family?
I believe this is one of the stronger possibilities. One thing that I've always found very interesting was Denise's brother and his response when asked if they had any idea who did this. I wish we knew what he meant, and we haven't heard from him since...
 
These are very important things that you bring up. My take is that IF SHE IS ALIVE, perp is either going to work every day and no one has any clue she is locked up in his basement or they are like you said "living off the land" and are out in the woods somewhere. At some point money and food have got to come in to play.

The good thing about these scenarios are she is alive but not in pleasant circumstances so it is still heartbreaking. While I do not believe it was someone younger that she just did not realize would do this or take something this far, if it is and she knew him, it would be the best scenario as she may be held somewhat "willingly". Most other scenarios have no good endings imo. Someone younger would also have not near the resources to keep her or hide her on his own and someone else would almost have to know or be assisting with money, food, place. One would think.
 
One thing I thought of that I do not think has been discussed is if a perp gets too nervous or feels they are onto him, not only could Jayme be at risk or he will panic and not lead them to her (if being surveilled) but if he really feels heat or they question him too much, etc., he may retain counsel. We all know that once they are represented, all talk stops. There is then no chance to find her without something like a deal.

I also think they dislike the online gossip about it and feel it does not help most likely, nor does media intrusion but on the flip side what is so hard for the public to understand about their silence is this is not just a murder, it is active with a missing child and you need media and exposure to help find her. I think the silence is intentional and is probably what they would typically do but again, this is a different case. Unless you know she is okay, why would you go silent is what people want to understand, you would do the opposite and keep the name and her face in the news right? I think the Miami tip early on and even the latest supposed pics of her show a side of the internet that they are not keen on probably.

With the Wetterling case, the local agency expresses a lot of regrets and is open about them and advises what they wish had been done differently. The Barron sheriff has mentioned the Wetterling case a couple of times and oddly right in the beginning almost. The cases are not similar in most ways at all so I could not understand why unless he thought almost right away it would not be solved for years. Now I think it is maybe the fact it was a neighboring state and a nationally known case was his reason? If I have it correct, they looked at every scenario, nationally, trafficking, and even looked at psychic tips. Yet all along it was someone close to home. It took years however before that was known. The local agency in Wetterling maybe reached out to tell him what they would do differently?

While nothing should be excluded, on my most logical days (they are not everyday lol), things usually are not as complicated as they seem, meaning it is probably not a meth head turkey driving boat owner with her in canada but more likely someone closer to home as it turned out to be with Wetterling.

I don't know. Those are some of my thoughts. They also do not have cases like this, perhaps they should think about having someone in the dept to just keep this in the news and be seen by the public once in awhile. There is a missing child and a murderer loose so the public does have a reason to want to know at least what can be shared.

I am interested to hear other's thoughts. It is like a switch was flipped a few weeks in, you are right, everyone noticed it. The extra assistance went home and all went silent, it almost seemed like onto a back burner. I doubt it is on a back burner but it is almost like what it seems they want to portray. I have seen people on here though mention other cases they thought were cold and cops were not working on while all along they were working hard behind the scenes and bam, one day an arrest out of the blue. Hopefully that is what will happen here.

My worst fear probably matches that of many--is that they literally, truly have nothing. If that was the case, though, I would be sharing more details because what is there to lose...

Sorry so longwinded of a post...

In the Wetterling case there was a ton of info such as reports by neighbor kids that the perp ( unknown that he was the perp at the tine) had been stalking them.

He is a small guy and his footprints had to be small. They had the thread from a jacket that matched an earlier kidnapping with a thread in the perp’s car.

Nobody knew this. If it had been let out, maybe he would have been busted sooner. At least he did not kill any other kids.

It was so ridiculous in hindsight. Keeping the info.

Hopefully, things are different with Jayme
 
I believe this is one of the stronger possibilities. One thing that I've always found very interesting was Denise's brother and his response when asked if they had any idea who did this. I wish we knew what he meant, and we haven't heard from him since...

I find this very likely as well, that they are building a case but the part that does not fit (there is always one in every scenario) if you are, then where IS SHE IN THE MEANTIME?
 
The reason I would lean toward hunting cabin is because they tend to be more remote and hidden. Some require an ATV or hike to get to. Not so much the case with a business or rental.

It would really depend on what kind. An unoccupied rental or business would either have no heat or electric or if the do, the owner is going to notice an increase in his bill if he has everything off or set low. Even many cabins are winterized (utilities off) or 3 season. Just saying it would not be a very pleasant existence quite possibly. This is of course, if she is in the area, where it is winter. She could be in Florida.
If I’m right, the perp owns the property.
 
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