AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot to death, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #8

[photographer4]

I've been turning this over in my head trying to come up with a scenario that fits what little verified info we have. Someone is fixated on Jayme and has been observing long enough to know that there ware 2 cars in the family and who drives which one. He sees that the Dad's car is missing and assumes the Mom and Jayme are home alone. He brings a gun for intimidation only and has no real intention of using it. It's been said that many don't lock their doors in rural areas so he's able to walk in unimpeded and locks the door behind him. Jayme is in her room. Maybe she's drinking a cold soda. Mom is in the living room watching tv/reading with her cell phone on a table. Perp walks in and points the gun at Mom and says just cooperate and you won't get hurt. Jayme hears the commotion and comes out. He forces them in to the bathroom and secures mom to a chair. While he's doing this the Dad pulls up in the driveway and goes to the front door but it's locked. Mom and Jayme start yelling to him and he kicks in the door. Now the perp, who I think is young, starts to panic and immediately shoots the Dad. The impact of the shot spins him around so it later appears that he was *inside* the door when shot. Mom and Jayme start screaming and he turns his attention to the Mom. Jayme is able to grab her mom's cell phone and dials 911. Mom is screaming at the perp, who has the gun pointed at her "You don't have to do this." Jayme is screaming "we need help." The perps sees Jayme with the phone and knocks it out of her hand and proceeds to shoot the Mom. What was heard on the phone by 911 was "you don't have to do this" followed by "we need help" causing them to think someone was attempting suicide. The perp grabs Jayme and drags her through the woods to a car which he had parked there earlier. He forces her in the trunk and drives to a remote cabin he'd prepared beforehand.

That's the best I can come up with using known facts. I'd be interested in exploring this with all of you.

Further, police probably knew with a glance which way the bullet was fired - based on where the majority of the blood from the injury or injuries was. EG: if it sprayed towards the door towards OUTSIDE, that may indicate dad was on his way IN to the home. If it sprayed IN toward the INSIDE of the house, it would indicate someone from OUTSIDE shot him....

 

[NervousNellie]

Further to the google street view showing the wrong house...
Could this have simply been a case of wrong house and drug related?

On Wednesday the sheriff said the arrest they made that day was unrelated to this case, but I see one of the neighbors was the person arrested, for drug possession.
It could explain the door being kicked in, and after the killer realized they weren’t at the right address, panicked and took JC out of confusion.
http://barronsheriff.org/bcsheriff/weekly-bookings/

Is that recently arrested neighbor's house the same house that Google streetview directs to?

 

[MsBetsy]

Thank you for helping me to recall the timing on the dog being off to relatives. I wonder then what state was the doggo in when police found it?

Most likely trembling in fear.

 

[Gardener1850]

Ok taking a step back here to reprocess...

Do we have any idea of the family’s whereabouts from the time that mom and daughter left family event?
No.
What time was that even? Unknown.
Did they go straight home? We don't know.
Without knowing for certain where the father was (possibly work or whatever has been stated by LE) do we know what time he came home for the night? Still also unknown, although lot sof people have speculated different times.

Do we have any estimate on how long anyone was home before what is the earliest report of activity (two gunshots at 12:31)?
Not known at this time.

Seems to me that there was a good amount of time for the family- or 2 of the 3- to be there for awhile...Nothing just starts with 2 gunshots going off. You have to believe that the perp(s) was instead or shortly thereafter...meaning....if the neighbors timing is accurate, there was nearly at least 30 minutes worth of commotion happening in that house.

We don’t know what the scene at the door means yet, and I think we’re getting too caught up in that detail -the door- being some kind of breach or method of entry. (Perhaps there was a struggle getting jayme out the door or a physical altercation at some point that led to the door’s condition).

What I mean and probably not communicating well is I think there is a lot of time to account for and without knowing all the moving parts or players inside. What can we deduct from what we DO know to piece together that family’s movements from the last time all three were see alive?
We do know that Jayme was last seen at the birthday party with mom Denise. The sheriff specifically said in a presser this was when Jayme was last seen-- at a family gathering on Sunday. Many of us are assuming James was last seen at work but we have not heard anything from his coworkers who last saw him nor anything from the sheriff on that. Just as we don't know when Denise and Jayme left the party, if they stopped anywhere or when they got home, we also don't know when James got off work or if he had any errands to run before going home. His day on Sunday is mostly a blank except I think we can safely say he was working somewhere as stated by a relative (JMO).
Maybe I’m overlooking something that’s already been verified, but do we know that dad arrived home later than mom and daughter for certain?
No. Their exact schedules are unknown to us (but probably known to LE)

It’s so easier to get caught up in trying to figure where that little girl could be and if she’s safe. I can hear how mentally and emotionally exhausting this case has been for many of us especially without any new info.

My brain is mashed potatoes.

My answers in pink above

Lots of things we don't know.

 

[gitana1]

I think it would be interesting/helpful to have a list of these similar crimes and note who the perps were:

How old were they? How far did they live from the home? Did they have a criminal history? What was their motive(s)? Were they known to the family? Did they have previous contact with the family? Was this single, dual or multiple perps? Did the perp use drugs? Were the victims kept alive and if so for how long? What MO/disposal method did they use? Etc, etc.

I started with Hannah Anderson’s case last night. Perp was 40, known to the family well, had contact with them the day before, lived an hour away. I’m not sure about criminal history as I just begun a cursory study.

I would like to take 10 comparable cases for this data comparison/study. Please feel free to contribute to this any input. Thanks in advance.

So we've got:
1. Hannah Anderson.
2. Shasta and Dylan Groene.
3. The Ohio case involving a kidnapped 13 year old girl, her murdered brother and mother and family friend. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.da...y-raped-girl-13-bizarre-obsession-leaves.html

Any others?

We are looking for cases in which inhabitants of a home are murdered and a child missing.

 

[photographer4]

I forgot to mention the reason I said Jayme was drinking a cold soda was they said the cell phone plus evidence led them to know tha Jayme was there the whole time. I'm thinking the soda was in her room still cold.

Cold soda? 13yr old? At 1am? I'm now wondering how long soda stays cold for. I'm doubting a parent lets a 13yr old crack a soda past about 7:30/8pm... but maybe that is just me?

 

[margarita25]

I’m still interested in this Eau Claire place. Is there crimemapping or city-data? Note to pick up here.

 

[katydid23]

The more adventurous the theorizing, the less I take it seriously.

I understand what you mean.

Also, one of my favorite stories is about Gef the mongoose, from the Isle of Man.

 

[human]

Many theories on the table still for me.

I want to note that FTR imo the location seems like a perfect house for a home invasion by a random perp(s). But as noted by a local there are more fancy houses elsewhere.

Adding to the list of possible theories: thrill kill? I doubt this but just a thought.

Why do you see it as perfect?

 

[margarita25]

So we've got:
1. Hannah Anderson.
2. Shasta and Dylan Groene.
3. The Ohio case involving a kidnapped 13 year old girl, her murdered brother and mother and family friend. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.da...y-raped-girl-13-bizarre-obsession-leaves.html

Any others?

I believe @Cardinal47 had mentioned Samantha Blackwell was it?

Some other posters have responded as well upstream.

Thank you, gitana.

ETA: the Short case (unsolved so not of much value data wise)

 

[RoiPD86]

I was also thinking that if the perpetrator or perpetrators were at the residence for let’s say atleast 40 minutes, is it not highly doubtful that no assailant left without blood spatter or injury at all?

 

[EJB123456]

Pondering my own prior post... developed this theory:
- The parents: dad was done for when he approached the door. Its kicked in, he's gunned down. We don't know when this happens. Not given any timeline.
- Police locate mom elsewhere. We're not clear on how long she has been dead for either.
- Doesn't seem police attempt CPR on either parent, so to me, its unlikely either parent made the 911 call. In my mind, police noted parents unresponsive per the transcript - so did they feel for a pulse? Determine the bodies were somewhat cool? Perhaps rigor mortis had set in? Maybe blood stains already drying?
- What if Jayme found her mom's cell phone, and it was wrestled away from her but not before she got the 911 out? Maybe SHE was tied to the chair to prevent her from escaping and she was being shot at when the neighbours heard the gun shots? OR:
Maybe those shots were her FIRING at someone? Perhaps that necessitated her being tied to a... chair? Such as the one we saw LE carry out of the home?
- If Jayme was tied up, and parents were taken out - then what were perp(s) doing in the home between when parents killed and they vanished presumably with Jayme? Were they looking for something?
- If Jayme was targeted specifically, then maybe killing her parents coldly was in order to make her more compliant and less likely to resist at the time or ever?

Do we know if anything in the home is missing? Anything at all? Or if it appeared to have been ransacked?

Interesting point re: attempted CPR/911 call. If someone on the 911 audio was shot within the 4 minutes that it took for LE to get there, seems like life saving measures would have been attempted.

 

[DexterMorgan]

I don't believe anybody would take a 13 year old girl as an after thought or because they didn't know what to do with her.
Anybody that kills two people has no soul.
Jayme is some madman's victim and hopefully police find her before it's too late.

2 addicts plan a ransack for money. 1 addict decides to leave no witnesses while snatching the girl at the last minute.

The other submissive addict wants to say something but knows they will be charged with 2 capital murder charges regardless. Idk. Its just a possible.

 

[RoiPD86]

I’m still interested in this Eau Claire place. Is there crimemapping or city-data? Note to pick up here.

I live in EC area, how can I help you?

 

[gef the mongoose]

Good to know.

My stoatish brethern's response is heard and duly noted.

 

[kspoon45]

Still odd that there's been no update for over 24 hours. Anyone want to venture a guess as to why? I hope it's that they've got solid progress on a lead to being her home.

 

[Hte2w8]

An over stuffed suitcase? LE doesn't bring their own, equipment had cases, they don't collect evidence in a suitcase.

Possible it's Jaymes. Also possible that she planned on leaving with someone who turned out to be dangerous.

That would explain why they changed the verbiage from"abducted" to missing.

 

[Cardinal47]

I was just thinking along these same lines, Inthesetails, that with Jayme being so young unless this was random the perp would likely have to know her parents or her caretaker, or at least have had some contact with them, because where and when would Jayme would ever be alone? School and extracurricular events, but even then her parents and caretaker would likely be at least acquaintances.

Did Jayme ever attend sleepovers I wonder?

13 years old seems to be the age young girls and boys are given a bit of freedom in staying at home alone for short periods of time.

 

[Inthedetails]

I’m still interested in this Eau Claire place. Is there crimemapping or city-data? Note to pick up here.

College town

 

[MsBetsy]

Further, police probably knew with a glance which way the bullet was fired - based on where the majority of the blood from the injury or injuries was. EG: if it sprayed towards the door towards OUTSIDE, that may indicate dad was on his way IN to the home. If it sprayed IN toward the INSIDE of the house, it would indicate someone from OUTSIDE shot him....

Very good point!