newtv
New Member
how long has this luney tune been out of jail..and sure gives the innocence project a black eye imo..
WI - Teresa Marie Halbach, 25, Manitowoc, 31 Oct 2005
- Thread starter RPPaolin
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Here you go new....newtv said:
http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32135
http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32094
Thanks Chico...that talks about possible accomplices...but does it mention that bones/human remains were found in some of the cars that were searched....I was sure I read that!!!chicoliving said:
newtv
New Member
OHH- all i know is something about the dna matching another man-which made him innocent-now ya have to wonder what the hell really happened-its not as if u start out at this level-I wonder if all the years being locked up made it even worse-(not as in an excuse)..but pent up hate for women or the need for such a release)joanofarc said:Hi New:
For some reason I don't think it was DNA from semen....something about a pubic hair that was taken from the victim and material gathered from underneath her fingernails.
Let me go check
This guy is a primo sicko imo..and should never have seen the light of day-i hope barry scheck thinks about this case for the rest of his life.
Maybe I am being an here but it makes me think twice about letting anyone out of jail who has a wrap sheet like his- he burned animals didnt he.
Must have laffed all the way home after getting off-not only off but fully exonerated-described as innocent.
How can u be innocent and kill, maim, torture so soon after your release.
thx alot for finding out-its kind of u-sorry to trouble u..
Its good to have a case to follow- I have been in withdrawal since the black out on PH's murder.
The website that I posted was appropriate for this thread, but I meant to post that link and comment at another thread. Sorry if I confused anyone....
Missing WI adults
http://www.wafmp.org/missingpersons.cfm
Missing WI adults
http://www.wafmp.org/missingpersons.cfm
chicoliving
Former Member
I think you did read it cause I did too, just have no idea now where. I'll stumble across it eventually.....:blushing:joanofarc said:
newtv
New Member
JOA- u r so kind) u make my day to be so gracious..
I may be bashing the innocence project falsely but this type of case makes me want to be mad at someone cuz it only hurts the reputation of those who are truly innocent-which I hunch there are a few but not thousands ..
You know something interesting was discussed on some political show regarding the supreme justices upholding the death penalty-
anyhow its relevance here is that there has never been a ruling that it is unconstitutional to incarcerate an innocent person..
(based of course on the notion that we let guilty people walk before letting an innocent person get the DP..and I kinda think they are onto something)
I mean we go overboard to be sure the guilty are guilty so noone is paying for a crime that they did not do-but how many innocent victims (usually women), end up tortured-killed-dismembered etc in favor of not incarcerating one innocent person (usually a man).
) u make my day to be so gracious..I may be bashing the innocence project falsely but this type of case makes me want to be mad at someone cuz it only hurts the reputation of those who are truly innocent-which I hunch there are a few but not thousands ..
You know something interesting was discussed on some political show regarding the supreme justices upholding the death penalty-
anyhow its relevance here is that there has never been a ruling that it is unconstitutional to incarcerate an innocent person..
(based of course on the notion that we let guilty people walk before letting an innocent person get the DP..and I kinda think they are onto something)
I mean we go overboard to be sure the guilty are guilty so noone is paying for a crime that they did not do-but how many innocent victims (usually women), end up tortured-killed-dismembered etc in favor of not incarcerating one innocent person (usually a man).
No problem...here this should help younewtv said:
http://www.truthinjustice.org/avery.htm
Averys conviction was affirmed by the Wisconsin Court of Appeals, and the Wisconsin Supreme Court denied discretionary review. Ten years later, in 1995, Avery sought DNA testing on fingernail scrapings taken from the victim immediately after the crime. Those tests revealed genetic markers consistent with both the victim and Avery, so that the laboratory could neither conclusively exclude Avery (on the off-chance that he and the victim shared those markers), nor identify him as the perpetrator. Those tests, however, also revealed DNA from another, unknown person, which could not have come from Avery. Despite this evidence of a third-party, the Wisconsin courts denied relief, holding that the DNA evidence was not sufficient to warrant a new trial.
In April 2002 the Wisconsin Innocence Project of the University of Wisconsin Law School obtained a court order, over the states objection, under Wisconsins postconviction DNA testing statute for new testing under newer, more powerful DNA technology. The Wisconsin Crime Laboratory succeeded in developing a PCR/STR profile from a pubic hair retrieved immediately after the assault from the victims pubic hair combings. On September 10, 2003, the lab results were released, proving that Avery and his witnesses were telling the truth, that he was not at that beach on July 29, 1985, that he had nothing to do with the crime, and that the eyewitness was simply mistaken, as eyewitnesses often are. The DNA test conclusively excluded Avery as the source of the pubic hair, and also identified the true perpetrator of this crime, a man named Gregory Allen, who is currently serving a 60-year sentence in prison for sexual assaults committed after this one. Allen was matched to the DNA profile in this case through a search of the state and national DNA databases.
Ah, thanks new :blushing: .newtv said:JOA- u r so kind
I really wonder now if these two guys knew each other...Steve Avery and Gregory Allen....definately two peas in a pod...IMO
newtv
New Member
very interestingjoanofarc said:No problem...here this should help you
http://www.truthinjustice.org/avery.htm
Averys conviction was affirmed by the Wisconsin Court of Appeals, and the Wisconsin Supreme Court denied discretionary review. Ten years later, in 1995, Avery sought DNA testing on fingernail scrapings taken from the victim immediately after the crime. Those tests revealed genetic markers consistent with both the victim and Avery, so that the laboratory could neither conclusively exclude Avery (on the off-chance that he and the victim shared those markers), nor identify him as the perpetrator. Those tests, however, also revealed DNA from another, unknown person, which could not have come from Avery. Despite this evidence of a third-party, the Wisconsin courts denied relief, holding that the DNA evidence was not sufficient to warrant a new trial.
In April 2002 the Wisconsin Innocence Project of the University of Wisconsin Law School obtained a court order, over the states objection, under Wisconsins postconviction DNA testing statute for new testing under newer, more powerful DNA technology. The Wisconsin Crime Laboratory succeeded in developing a PCR/STR profile from a pubic hair retrieved immediately after the assault from the victims pubic hair combings. On September 10, 2003, the lab results were released, proving that Avery and his witnesses were telling the truth, that he was not at that beach on July 29, 1985, that he had nothing to do with the crime, and that the eyewitness was simply mistaken, as eyewitnesses often are. The DNA test conclusively excluded Avery as the source of the pubic hair, and also identified the true perpetrator of this crime, a man named Gregory Allen, who is currently serving a 60-year sentence in prison for sexual assaults committed after this one. Allen was matched to the DNA profile in this case through a search of the state and national DNA databases.
i wonder how the finger nail scrapings ended up counting for nothing-if there was a chance they were his then??
I better read up on it- likley i have it wrong-but if his dna was found under her nails how does that make him innocent..(I mean they could not rule him in or out before-so why did they use the hair to rule him out when the question of the potentially matching cells under the nails was not resolved)
newtv
New Member
Ten years later, in 1995, Avery sought DNA testing on fingernail scrapings taken from the victim immediately after the crime. Those tests revealed genetic markers consistent with both the victim and Avery, so that the laboratory could neither conclusively exclude Avery (on the off-chance that he and the victim shared those markers), nor identify him as the perpetrator. Those tests, however, also revealed DNA from another, unknown person, which could not have come from Avery.mssheila said:
(I pply have misunderstood-but to me he was not ruled out?) How do u read it?
Later it appears the judge said he was innocent not just exonerated..and I dont see how thats possible-what are the chances of him having the same dna as this victim had)..I can see reasonable doubt but not 100 percent innocence.
By the pubic hair combings taken from the victim right after the crime. Gregory Allen's DNA was matched to a pubic hair that was found on the victim....this was done later after the appeals court denied Steve when the fingernail DNA was in question.....mssheila said:
newtv
New Member
I know but he was not ruled out by the DNA other than the pubic hair-so it seems to me there was a chance he was there-since his DNA did not exclude him or include him conclusively..joanofarc said:
just seems fishy to me that he is released from prison only to comit a more heinous crime within 2 years and who knows if this is his first victim.
To me they cant say he is 100 percent innocent if the scrapings/dna markers from under her nails are possibly his? (They matched his and the victims-now how would his dna and her dna be the same-what are the odds of this?)
They can say reasonable doubt-but apparently the judge went on and on about him being innocent.
The thing is with the victim...she didn't say anyone else was involved. The cops set their sites on Avery right away and put him in a police line-up where she identified him...twice I think. Problem was he was the shortest-blondest guy there and the victim said Avery looks very much like Allen..newtv said:
concernedperson
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joanofarc said:
Somewhere on this thread there are photographs of the two and I saw several similarities between them.
New....
This is the rape victim that was Steve's accuser....now that I read it again it says she lost consciousness...so how does she know if there wasn't more than one attacker.....:waitasec:
http://www.theforgivenessproject.com/stories/penny-beernsten
It happened in a beautiful place. I was out jogging when a man grabbed me from behind and pushed me into a wooded area. When I screamed, he choked my windpipe; when I fought back as he tried to rape me, he began beating and strangling me. Finally I lost consciousness. My last thoughts were: I wish I'd kissed my son goodbye this morning and my daughters last vision of me will be of my dead, beaten body.
Two good Samaritans found me, bleeding and naked in the sand dunes. In the emergency room in the hospital I gave a description of my rapist to the police. I asked the sheriff if he had a suspect in mind and he said, Yes. I found out later that this was Steven Avery, who was out on bail for sticking a rifle in the face of a deputy sheriff's wife.
Later they put nine photos by my bedside. I presumed the suspect was among them. Steves photo was in there and I selected it. That night he was arrested and held without bail.
At the live line-up I looked at eight men and again picked out Steve Avery. I had selected his photo, and his image had become enmeshed with my memory of the real assailant. In my mind, Steve was the only person in those photos and in that line-up. As it turned out, my actual assailant was in neither.
This is the rape victim that was Steve's accuser....now that I read it again it says she lost consciousness...so how does she know if there wasn't more than one attacker.....:waitasec:
http://www.theforgivenessproject.com/stories/penny-beernsten
It happened in a beautiful place. I was out jogging when a man grabbed me from behind and pushed me into a wooded area. When I screamed, he choked my windpipe; when I fought back as he tried to rape me, he began beating and strangling me. Finally I lost consciousness. My last thoughts were: I wish I'd kissed my son goodbye this morning and my daughters last vision of me will be of my dead, beaten body.
Two good Samaritans found me, bleeding and naked in the sand dunes. In the emergency room in the hospital I gave a description of my rapist to the police. I asked the sheriff if he had a suspect in mind and he said, Yes. I found out later that this was Steven Avery, who was out on bail for sticking a rifle in the face of a deputy sheriff's wife.
Later they put nine photos by my bedside. I presumed the suspect was among them. Steves photo was in there and I selected it. That night he was arrested and held without bail.
At the live line-up I looked at eight men and again picked out Steve Avery. I had selected his photo, and his image had become enmeshed with my memory of the real assailant. In my mind, Steve was the only person in those photos and in that line-up. As it turned out, my actual assailant was in neither.
Hi CP...you are right somewhere back a few pages....LOL. I am really starting to wonder if these two guys were a team....would be interesting to see what circles they travelled in back then....PIGS, both of them....IMOconcernedperson said:
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