Woman Gives Birth To Octuplets In California

[justthinkin]

I'm probably going to get clobbered, but GA has had it in for NS, and I think it was her intent for AIW to go there & find fault with NS. Probably even more so since GA was at the home the evening the first two babies were brought home. NS found out she was there, had one of the nannies call the cops on her to make her wait outside. GA wasn't allowed in.

OTOH, AIW got ousted because one of their nurses was stupid with a capital S in filling a report so soon before AIW collected enough solid goods on NS so CFS would have no choice but to remove the children from the home.

Yes, there were reporters there when NS brought home the first babies. NS needs the money to help pay to support the babies. I can't fault her for that, but letting too many children and adults get in the babies faces and touch them, yup definite fault on NS's part.

As for the GM not wanting anything to do with the new babies, I can understand that. I'm sure she thinks they will ultimately be taken from NS.

Back to NS. She does things to make everyone else suffer because that's what narcissists do. She's been making her parents suffer for years. I think she picked out a 2 story house so that those having to care for the children would be having to climb stairs a zillion times a day. She got one with a too small yard so the children would have no real place to play. She insists on exposing the premies to all kinds of germs by having 8-10 kids from the neighborhood in the house playing in addition to her own. That would drive everyone else nuts.

Gotta keep in mind that a narcissist isn't emotionally invested so the things that would drive a sane person nuts, doesn't bother her.

Sure Dr. Phil is going to try to smooth things over between NS and AIW. He's backed NS, but for reasons of protecting her children. Without AIW in the home, anything can happen, and we'll all hear about it when it's too late.
That's scary. These children have to have an advocate who can track what's going on.

He may be buying time though for CFS to get their ducks in a row. I think that's a possibility.

 

[RhythmicSun]

I'm probably going to get clobbered, but GA has had it in for NS, and I think it was her intent for AIW to go there & find fault with NS. Probably even more so since GA was at the home the evening the first two babies were brought home. NS found out she was there, had one of the nannies call the cops on her to make her wait outside. GA wasn't allowed in.

OTOH, AIW got ousted because one of their nurses was stupid with a capital S in filling a report so soon before AIW collected enough solid goods on NS so CFS would have no choice but to remove the children from the home.

Yes, there were reporters there when NS brought home the first babies. NS needs the money to help pay to support the babies. I can't fault her for that, but letting too many children and adults get in the babies faces and touch them, yup definite fault on NS's part.

As for the GM not wanting anything to do with the new babies, I can understand that. I'm sure she thinks they will ultimately be taken from NS.

Back to NS. She does things to make everyone else suffer because that's what narcissists do. She's been making her parents suffer for years. I think she picked out a 2 story house so that those having to care for the children would be having to climb stairs a zillion times a day. She got one with a too small yard so the children would have no real place to play. She insists on exposing the premies to all kinds of germs by having 8-10 kids from the neighborhood in the house playing in addition to her own. That would drive everyone else nuts.

Gotta keep in mind that a narcissist isn't emotionally invested so the things that would drive a sane person nuts, doesn't bother her.

Sure Dr. Phil is going to try to smooth things over between NS and AIW. He's backed NS, but for reasons of protecting her children. Without AIW in the home, anything can happen, and we'll all hear about it when it's too late.
That's scary. These children have to have an advocate who can track what's going on.

He may be buying time though for CFS to get their ducks in a row. I think that's a possibility.

I really appreciate some of your comments but I'm having trouble seeing the reasoning behind one of them. Gloria Allred (GA) is an advocate for the children, and it appears she has worked in conjunction with others to give Nadya just enough rope to hang herself. Then and only then can CPS step in and do what they do - which is protect the children. Hopefully. It is not easy to find foster homes for children, especially preemies and special needs children. (That was a statement by a representative from CPS, who sat in the audience at the Dr. Phil show. She spoke at the end.)

Nadya wanted a nice modern house. She didn't think beyond that. She's not stupid, but she is disturbed and therefore behaves foolishly. In fact, Nadya is an intelligent woman with a disorder. She needs help immediately. The children need protection immediately.

Edited to add:
Gloria Allred and others should not have had to go to the lengths they have, and wait the amount of time they have waited, but they had to follow procedure and California law. It is clear to even lay people just how disturbed Nadya is, and how much danger the children are potentially in. That is why so many people are frustrated nothing has happened yet to truly protect the children on a long-term basis. The State of California has to show that they made an attempt to allow the mother to support her children without burdening taxpayers. However, did any of us really believe that the burden would not eventually become a reality?

 

[KR2tonenow]

I completey agree with your post above!

I think its standard procedure for the AIW to report, and Nadya knew that. That is why she refused the first time.

The house is very inappropriate. IMO, the 6 kids should go to Grandma to her house and Grandma should get temporary custody. I imagine the school changes and camera in their face 24/7 will be a terrible disruption. What are the nieghbors even doing in there??

I agree that a full Psych Evaluation needs to be done on Nadya and a child advocate and bi-weekly CPS visits are in order here.

I think when AIW report is filed changes will take place. She will double up on babies in another 2 weeks.<good grief!>

 

[Macara]

Octuplet Mom Offered *advertiser censored* Star Nannies
Letter To Octuplet Mom Obtained By TMZ

http://www.clickorlando.com/entertainment/19000375/detail.html

POSTED: Tuesday, March 24, 2009
UPDATED: 11:58 am EDT March 24, 2009

OMG!!!! :furious:

 

[JMO8778]

I believe it's her parents fault in the sense that they completely enabled her by taking her in with her 6 kids, ruining their marriage (parents stated the stress of these kids did ruin the marriage) and so forth.

IF they never gave her a roof over her head and forced her to financially take care of herself very early on, there's no way Nadya would have ever been able to have 6 kids let alone 8 more.

Enabling, parents have some responsibility in this definitely. It would be a different story if the parents were never supporting her, never giving her monies, never raising her kids for her.:twocents:

And what can Dr Phil possibly do now? After only 1 week, Nadya is the one to blame completely here. He's dealing with a con artist / sociopath so how can he possibly think ANY arrangement will work with this woman? It's all about the money to her and nothing more. NONE of those videos endear me to her as a mother or a woman. She's vile & heartless. It's a lost cause Dr Phil, give it a rest & let the powers that be take those kids!

for sure,I wonder what she would have done had she been forced to live in public housing (that would have been a good start!),buy her kids' clothes,WORK,take care of the kids herself..etc.I know it's hard to turn your back on your gkids,but Nadya's parents certainly didn't help any.

Nadya kept having kids because she KNEW her parents would take care of them! she was given no reason to ever rethink her decisions...no reason to ever change..so she kept right on doing what she was doing.

 

[DollyPardonMe]

Is the pool fenced in?

I thought she was looking at a house with a built in pool but that she didn't buy that one.

Maybe the lack of a back yard is why we usually see the children out playing in or by the street.

The house does not have a pool. According to the listing, it has enough room to build one..Here is the listing..

http://www.prudentialcaliforniarealty.com/Listings/0/39388/CA/La-Habra/2051-Madonna-Ln.aspx

 

[Mr. E]

Okay, what the heck??? *advertiser censored* star nannies??? I imagine the deal ($1 million, plus a bus, plus free health insurance) sounds pretty good to Nadya right now, considering she's fired all those nurses.

I wonder what will be the straw to break the camel's back for California? The straw for me was her firing the nurses.

 

[RhythmicSun]

I think its standard procedure for the AIW to report, and Nadya knew that. That is why she refused the first time.

I agree that a full Psych Evaluation needs to be done on Nadya and a child advocate and bi-weekly CPS visits are in order here.

<snipped>

General questions to anyone who might know the answers:

Is the State of California required to publicly disclose whether there has already been a child advocate assigned to this case? (Actually, a team is needed.) Could that be connected with the complaints Dr. Lieberman filed? Is the public ever going to hear from a representative from the State of California about this? If so, when?

 

[justthinkin]

Certainly AIW was there to make sure the babies were taken care of properly, but to file on NS because of the chaos when the first two children came home is going overboard. It's not like CFS couldn't see for themselves what was happening since it was all over You Tube or Radar Online.

So for one of AIW to file a report on Nadya was dumb and a waste since the hospital went ahead and released 2 more babies to NS despite the video.

All I'm saying is AIW blew it by going overboard with something that really is quite negligible. What they need to see to get the children removed is something happening of a more lasting nature, not something that happened in just a brief moment in time.

I will be watching Dr. Phil today to see if he can pull off getting AIW back in the home.

 

[RhythmicSun]

Do you really believe that the incident was negligible? Do you really believe that everything evaluated together since the octuplets were born (and even before that) is not going to show that Nadya is incapable of handling this situation and that she has been and will continue to make poor choices?

 

[justthinkin]

KR2tonenow--"I agree that a full Psych Evaluation needs to be done on Nadya and a child advocate and bi-weekly CPS visits are in order here."

You and me both! I can't understand why this isn't being done except maybe lack of manpower.

Last time Suleman was on Dr. Phil one of the audience members asked if she was receiving counseling. Nadya said something along the lines of "Oh yes, through my schooling. It's required of us."

Let slide was the fact she's not currently in school.

If she won't consent to counseling or evaluation, maybe they can lock her asz up for 24 hours in a psych ward & do it.

 

[Robyn623]

Thanks for posting the link to the house tour video. I hadn't seen that before...mainly because I try to avoid watching anything that this crazy lady puts out on the internet. After watching the vid though I am STUNNED at how small that house is! The bedrooms are tiny and would be cramped with 1-2 kids each. What the heck was she thinking?! (Yeah..I know...she WASN'T thinking) No one in their right mind would have turned down the help of AIW if they truly cared about getting the best care for the babies. Those poor kids! I hope someone steps in and stops this circus! This woman needs to be taken FAR away from the kids and taken somewhere where she cannot put herself in front of a camera.

 

[justthinkin]

Do you really believe that the incident was negligible? Do you really believe that everything evaluated together since the octuplets were born (and even before that) is not going to show that Nadya is incapable of handling this situation and that she has been and will continue to make poor choices?

Yes, I do believe it was negligible because and only because of its short duration. Is it something to add to the total of Nadya wrongs regarding the care of her children? Yes. But if that report hadn't been filed, then it's quite possible AIW would still be in the house and gaining more and more info with every day that passes which is what I'd like to see happen.

I want to see those children and babies placed in loving homes, and the mother court ordered to a psych ward which is where she belongs imo.

 

[RainbowsAndGumdrops]

The problem is that you can't take children from someone just because:
* there are so many kids
* The mom is manipulative
* the mom is single
* the mom is poor
* there are too many little kids
* the kids are exposed to germs from the other kids in the family
* the mom is on welfare, food stamps etc.
* the mom may snap at some point
* the mom is unemployed
* the mom makes money having TV crews follow her
* the mom has lewd nurses
* the mom is snappy
* the mom isn't loving
* the mom is a hoarder
* the mom only has kids because she is dysfunctional
* the mom is a manipulator
* the mom lives in a new modern house with stairs (i'd assume most people in the US have stairs)
* the mom is a liar
* the house is stressful

None of those are reasons to remove the children.

It seems that any mom with that many kids would come out and say "this is going to be hard. I don't have a clue how I am going to do this, but I am going to do my best. I really need some help. Noone can do this alone, especially when the children are so little. I appreciate all that everyone has done. I appreciate the opportunity to show my children to the world this past two months. It has given me the opportunity to buy a home so these children have more room than they did before."

Regardless of how she got into this situation, I think most of us would be supportive if she got a clue. If she were honest about the situation, not always manipulating, lying, hiding things, thinking she didn't need help, etc.

No matter how bad of a mom she is, there is no record that she has ever failed to feed the kids, give them clothes, shelter. There is no evidence that she has ever "harmed" any of them. She's a nutcase, but you can't take the kids for that. There are children in circumstances worse than any of us can ever imagine that CPS can't remove.

Thinking further, what happens if they are removed. How many foster kids are abused? How scarred would the kids be knowing that strangers ripped their family apart because they were unusual. I think a better solution is to have court ordered round the clock nanny help with her money she just earned. Stick it into an escrow account for nanny support. Take the burden off of grandma and grandpa and reduce that stress and friction in the house by not having the grandma as the caretaker.

 

[LCoastMom]

I agree. This silliness has gone on long enough. I think her firing the nursing staff is the last straw for me. Enough already.

This Nadya reminds me of those cult members that you see interviewed on television occasionally... just that weird, glazed over almost crazed look. She just doesn't get it, I think.

Game over... I predict that yes, the state is gonna have to intervene... like yesterday.

:banghead:

I'm sure they already have. That's why she didn't get to take the babies home as soon as they were ready. That's why the doctors chewed her a new one over her behavior the night #1 & #2 came home. Be patient grasshopper it takes time to cross all the T's and dot the I's.

Normally these are not choices a hospital gets to make.

Yesterday was it for me, though it had been building. I had been perfectly willing to give her a chance to prove that she could work with Angels In Waiting and the rest. Now, this is a full-blown crisis no matter how her camp spins in. And just exactly who is still in her camp except people making money off of her?

RADARONLINE.com will be right there to capture every second. They are in her camp. Prolly the first time ever they are turning a profit. They have every reason to want her to do well and to stay on her side.

Splayed fingers a sign of stress! Wow, Laney I didn't know that. But, I don't remember being a baby so how would I know.
That is a very frightening point. Imagine, they are what, a couple months old now, and already their lives are stressful. What's it going to be like when they reach a year? Does anyone know, our nurses here, can stress surpress their development?

I too believe the authorities should step in and do something for the sake of the childen's welfare and safety. However, the thought of them being taken from their home and sent to foster care, is a very sad thought especially for the older ones. A family broken apart because of a mother's greed and lack of sense is truly a tragedy.
Someone has to stop this crime.
jmo

Stressed new born are going to have more gastric upset. They will also be more likely to cry frequently, be fussier and have a weakened immune system. Of immediate concern is a condition called failure to thrive syndrome. The babies will not gain weight or be meeting their "milestones". A baby left in this condition can die, but if cared for quickly enough the baby will get back on course once proper care and feeding are established.

I'm sure this is something the doctors are watching for.

<snipped>

General questions to anyone who might know the answers:

Is the State of California required to publicly disclose whether there has already been a child advocate assigned to this case? (Actually, a team is needed.) Could that be connected with the complaints Dr. Lieberman filed? Is the public ever going to hear from a representative from the State of California about this? If so, when?

No, the state will claim privacy issues for everything because there are minors involved.

The state already said the report has to be filed from someone with first hand knowledge, not something gained via TV or other media. OK I'll buy that to a point but when they have all these multiple reports coming in from high profile professionals they are going to act. I'm sure there are already forces at work behind the scenes that they would deny if asked.

I'm sure there will be a comment at sometime in the near future that will say essentially nothing. The state needs an air tight case or a judge will return the kids and there will be sanctions brought. The state can't look like they walked in there on trumped up charges. The biggest problem the state is going to have is they have to follow guidelines and this case is extremely high profile.

The whole point of the state getting involved will be to protect those babies. They will first need to line up care for 8 medically fragile newborn. That type of care for one or two babies is hard to find, but they will need it for eight, they aren't helping the babies at all if they just dump them in foster care.

We all need to remember, regardless of our feeling for Nadya, this is still the United States. In the United States officials don't just walk into a home and take custody of someones babies because we don't like how they live, we don't agree with the choices they make. We don't find them to be good, loving parents. So far all Nadya has done is make a fool out of herself trying to use the system and the public. We don't have to like what she has done, we don't have to like the way she lives, as far as I can tell Nadya hasn't broken any laws. She has been feeding, changing and burping the babies she brought home. Her other kids all appear happy, well fed and clean. I don't like what I see her doing, but if the state goes in there on trumped up charges she'll win and in the future it will be even harder to get someone to take CPS seriously. Being stupid isn't against the law.

Let the bashing begin.

 

[RainyGirl]

There is so much wrong with this situation, it's hard tp say what the worse thing is, but something that stands out to me and speaks volumes is that with all the cameras running and all the pictures out there now, never have I seen 1 single time a "Mothers Love" shining through. A quick hug for a camera and then a brush off Yes! but never a true moment of this woman really focusing on even 1 of her children and feeling love and caring welling up inside. If I had just 1 baby, my heart would be bursting with what I felt for such a miracle. I've said it before and I'll say it again, Imo she's a hoarder and she doesn't see these children as true humans with all their needs, just ones to add to her collection and as a bonus they provide financial help. I hope they will be able to be rescued before something terrible happens!! Her Dr needs some serious charges brought against him!!

VB

bold is mine
I totally agree and I'm bumping this up for others to read!
Well said and completely on the mark.
God help these children.

 

[PattyCake]

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=78745&page=80

My previous comment! Remember this last week? Nadya admitted she was severely reprimanded by the hospital and if her antics are going to continue to happen, they won't release anymore babies. I believe this is yet another antic. No more babies are going home


http://www.mcafee.cc/Bin/sb.html
Definition of a sociopath:

Aside from the current A-sexual behaviour of Nadya, I believe this fits her completely. Why Dr Phil cannot read between the lines, he's dealing with a highly skilled and IMO very dangerous woman!

Glibness and Superficial Charm

Manipulative and Conning
They never recognize the rights of others and see their self-serving behaviors as permissible. They appear to be charming, yet are covertly hostile and domineering, seeing their victim as merely an instrument to be used. They may dominate and humiliate their victims.


Grandiose Sense of Self
Feels entitled to certain things as "their right."


Pathological Lying
Has no problem lying coolly and easily and it is almost impossible for them to be truthful on a consistent basis. Can create, and get caught up in, a complex belief about their own powers and abilities. Extremely convincing and even able to pass lie detector tests.


Lack of Remorse, Shame or Guilt
A deep seated rage, which is split off and repressed, is at their core. Does not see others around them as people, but only as targets and opportunities. Instead of friends, they have victims and accomplices who end up as victims. The end always justifies the means and they let nothing stand in their way.


Shallow Emotions
When they show what seems to be warmth, joy, love and compassion it is more feigned than experienced and serves an ulterior motive. Outraged by insignificant matters, yet remaining unmoved and cold by what would upset a normal person. Since they are not genuine, neither are their promises.


Incapacity for Love


Need for Stimulation
Living on the edge. Verbal outbursts and physical punishments are normal. Promiscuity and gambling are common.


Callousness/Lack of Empathy
Unable to empathize with the pain of their victims, having only contempt for others' feelings of distress and readily taking advantage of them.


Poor Behavioral Controls/Impulsive Nature
Rage and abuse, alternating with small expressions of love and approval produce an addictive cycle for abuser and abused, as well as creating hopelessness in the victim. Believe they are all-powerful, all-knowing, entitled to every wish, no sense of personal boundaries, no concern for their impact on others.


Early Behavior Problems/Juvenile Delinquency
Usually has a history of behavioral and academic difficulties, yet "gets by" by conning others. Problems in making and keeping friends; aberrant behaviors such as cruelty to people or animals, stealing, etc.


Irresponsibility/Unreliability
Not concerned about wrecking others' lives and dreams. Oblivious or indifferent to the devastation they cause. Does not accept blame themselves, but blames others, even for acts they obviously committed.


Promiscuous Sexual Behavior/Infidelity
Promiscuity, child sexual abuse, rape and sexual acting out of all sorts.


Lack of Realistic Life Plan/Parasitic Lifestyle
Tends to move around a lot or makes all encompassing promises for the future, poor work ethic but exploits others effectively.


Criminal or Entrepreneurial Versatility
Changes their image as needed to avoid prosecution. Changes life story readily.

 

[RhythmicSun]

We all need to remember, regardless of our feeling for Nadya, this is still the United States. In the United States officials don't just walk into a home and take custody of someones babies because we don't like how they live, we don't agree with the choices they make. We don't find them to be good, loving parents. So far all Nadya has done is make a fool out of herself trying to use the system and the public. We don't have to like what she has done, we don't have to like the way she lives, as far as I can tell Nadya hasn't broken any laws. She has been feeding, changing and burping the babies she brought home. Her other kids all appear happy, well fed and clean. I don't like what I see her doing, but if the state goes in there on trumped up charges she'll win and in the future it will be even harder to get someone to take CPS seriously.

<snipped, bolding mine>

This isn't about me or anyone else not liking the choices she makes or the "way she lives." This is about SAFETY and WELL-BEING of the children. Anyone can see that what is going on contributes to neither safety nor well-being.

As for "trumped up charges", no one has to trump up anything. It's all there for the world to see, untrumped.

 

[Malini2001]

Yes, I do believe it was negligible because and only because of its short duration. Is it something to add to the total of Nadya wrongs regarding the care of her children? Yes. But if that report hadn't been filed, then it's quite possible AIW would still be in the house and gaining more and more info with every day that passes which is what I'd like to see happen.

I want to see those children and babies placed in loving homes, and the mother court ordered to a psych ward which is where she belongs imo.

I don't think it's negligible. I don't believe the report was filed regarding the home coming, which could be considered short duration. it was filed after the 2nd set of 2 babies came home and was more in reaction to the number of people inside the house, not the news media outside. They showed a sign on the door of the nursery saying something about no admittance, but yet the photographer and interviewer are in the nursery following Nadya around. This isn't just for the homecoming, it looks like Nadya has a crew spending the day with her. Besides the news crew there apparently were other children in the house along with her own children.

The house is too small for her own children, she shouldn't be allowing playmates inside this soon after the preemies arrive. Shouldn't she be spending time acclimating her 6 older children to the new home and their new siblings? Maybe the nurses even spoke to Nadya about it and she treated them the same way she treats her mother. We don't know. But I bet it looked like it was going to be an ongoing problem.

I really do wish they had been allowed to stay longer and observe Nadya for a longer period of time. I doubt if the nurse announced that she was filing a report - at least I hope not - but Nadya is probably defensive about everything they say to her.

She so obviously doesn't have a clue and doesn't want to be taught. I think it is just luck that something hasn't happened to the older 6. She doesn't keep track of them and several appear to be very active youngsters. Their guardian angels are working overtime.

 

[Boyz_Mum]

I don't know CA law, but doesn't Kaiser have the power to send CPS into the home on an ongoing basis to be sure that all the children are cared for?

I understand that Nadya can fire the AIW, they are private.