Wrongful Death Suit filed Nov. 13, 2013 in California

[LuckyLucy2]

This link really doesn't go to any specific article. I don't see any point if you are just coming here to say you believe everything SDSO said... although it's fine if that is what you believe, obviously many people, including experts do not really believe them.

If you scroll down, you will see the article, "Dr. Phil Ratings Stunt Dishonors Tragic Case".

 

[Serpico]

Jonah is also quite capable with nautical knots........he owns 2 boats docked about a 10 minute walk from Spreckels.

Yes, but Ann Rule's book [ page 194] says Ronald McDonald House security cameras basically confirmed Jonah's alibi.

 

[Mr Spock]

Yes, but Ann Rule's book [ page 194] says Ronald McDonald House security cameras basically confirmed Jonah's alibi.

Correct me if my wrong, but were the tapes from the Ronald McDonald House included on the list of items requested by the Zahaus legal team? I know The Zahau team has stated Jonah was seen on the hospital tapes. I was under the impression the Ronald McDonald tapes were still in question.

 

[Mr Spock]

If you scroll down, you will see the article, "Dr. Phil Ratings Stunt Dishonors Tragic Case".

Does this article imply the 2nd Dr Phil show Dina commissioned dishonored this tragic case as well? Personally I think neither show dishonored Max or Rebecca. Dr Phil simply raised serious questions regarding the Sheriff's conclusions more than anything. It was only after the second show on which Dina appeared I became interested in the case again. Both Max and Rebecca's bizarre deaths cry out for a spotlight and fresh perspective. IMO They really deserve much more. I hope the Zahaus are able to blow these cases wide open.

 

[cynic]

[Respectfully snipped]
...clearly a suicide, IMHO.

Clearly suicide?
The totality of the evidence points to the conclusion that Rebecca was murdered. I’ve included only very few of the reasons why I believe that to be true.
The SDSO contends that this was an impulsive suicide precipitated by receiving bad news.
The crime scene is far too complex to support that contention, and consider that if the SDSO is to be believed, it was all conceived and concluded within approximately two hours.
No woman has ever been found hanging outdoors, nude, gagged, with hands and feet bound in a suicide scenario and I still believe that to be true. The most unexplainable element being the fact the feet were bound, it serves no purpose, whatsoever, in a suicide hanging. A close second is the public nudity.
Note that the very first categorization of this incident given to the press, (and a cynic might add – before the “script” was written,) that this was a “very suspicious, violent death”
How else would such a scene be described? Adam notwithstanding, I believe it’s a safe assumption to say that no one who viewed the scene - EMS, LE, etc. would have described it as anything other than a “very suspicious, violent death”
The complexity of the knots and choosing to anchor from a bed rather than the railing also speaks strongly against the idea that this was a suicide. This fact becomes even more improbable given the complete absence of any research by RZ into knots through computer searches and the extreme improbably of anyone picking something that complex against the backdrop of much less complicated knots.
Rebecca’s center of gravity was below the top of the railing and considerable effort would have been required to squirm up and over the railing. Such effort would have left an area far larger than the three inch area that is seen to be wiped clean of dust.
There is unexplained trauma to top and lateral right side of RZ’s head.
Then we have unexplained fractures in the front of the neck BELOW the furrow line created by the noose.
There are many more reasons which have been outlined in many posts throughout this forum.

Police probe suspicious death at Coronado mansion
By The Associated Press4:38 p.m. July 13, 2011
CORONADO, Calif. — Police are investigating a suspicious death at a famous San Diego-area mansion.
Sheriff's Captain Tim Curran told The San Diego Union-Tribune that a woman died a `very suspicious, violent death' at Spreckels Mansion in Coronado on Wednesday morning.
http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2011/Jul/13/police-probe-suspicious-death-at-coronado-mansion/

 

[Inparadise]

Correct me if my wrong, but were the tapes from the Ronald McDonald House included on the list of items requested by the Zahaus legal team? I know The Zahau team has stated Jonah was seen on the hospital tapes. I was under the impression the Ronald McDonald tapes were still in question.

I do believe that there were certain times that Jonah was seen on the tapes, but it was never disclosed to the public the specific details, such as times. Please keep in mind that the security cameras at a facility such as the RMH are not covering every inch of the place........their focus is more geared towards people falling accidentally, etc.......not tracking ones movements within (or leaving) the facility. Their focus is on liability.

 

[LuckyLucy2]

Clearly suicide?
The totality of the evidence points to the conclusion that Rebecca was murdered. I’ve included only very few of the reasons why I believe that to be true.

We will just have to agree to disagree. I haven't found any of the reasons I've read here to be anything other than circumstantial, while all the physical evidence says it was Rebecca. Just my opinion. I do wonder how many other "long time lurkers" that also agree it was suicide are scared to post since those that believe it was murder defend their opinion so, well, vigorously.

 

[MyBelle]

DeDee, LuckyLucy and MyBelle, I am wondering--what is your opinion about the Board game described by InParadise in Post #136:

"Mrs. Gore made a joke out of the whole thing and presented the Chief of Coronado PD a board game that she made, using the names, events of Maxie and Rebecca's deaths, at his retirement ceremony/party in front of 150+ people."

There was no link provided so I take it as rumor rather than fact.

 

[Mr Spock]

We will just have to agree to disagree. I haven't found any of the reasons I've read here to be anything other than circumstantial, while all the physical evidence says it was Rebecca. Just my opinion. I do wonder how many other "long time lurkers" that also agree it was suicide are scared to post since those that believe it was murder defend their opinion so, well, vigorously.

Hey I'm not a suicide or homicide advocate. Im on the fence. I'm open to any possibility, suicide or homicide and no one has attacked or flamed me on here for my opinions. I have repeatedly defended Jonah, Kimberly and the kids because it's obvious they all have behaved with class and dignity since the beginning of this tragic nightmare. It's only Dina /Nina who have publicly raged against the Zahaus along with their /friends followers online that in some cases have created in excess of 3000 posts under one handle. Many of their posts have be shockingly dehumanizing, rage and hate filled. Those frightening displays of behaviors coupled with their ever changing stories, clear lack of alibi, (along with an eyewitness seeing Dina at the house ) is what has created a sense of uncertainty and suspicion around them. I hope I'm proven wrong and Dina and Nina are completely innocent. Let me once again emphasize that I am happy to apologize if future depositions completely clear them and they have hid nothing. I'm sure they must be anxious to do so. I'd be!

 

[kittychi]

There was no link provided so I take it as rumor rather than fact.

Okay, then, just hypothetically, what would your opinion be if you knew that really happened?

TIA

 

[Serpico]

Correct me if my wrong, but were the tapes from the Ronald McDonald House included on the list of items requested by the Zahaus legal team? I know The Zahau team has stated Jonah was seen on the hospital tapes. I was under the impression the Ronald McDonald tapes were still in question.

Good question...this may be another Ann Rule factual error. I can only hope that someday Mary-Doug see the WISDOM in releasing all the information so the public can be fully informed. Lets say Jonah wasn't at Ronald MacDonald House.....whose car did he use to get back to Spreckels Mansion....he previously lent his car [9:00 pm] that Tuesday night to NINA.

 

[MaybeNotToday]

We will just have to agree to disagree. I haven't found any of the reasons I've read here to be anything other than circumstantial, while all the physical evidence says it was Rebecca. Just my opinion. I do wonder how many other "long time lurkers" that also agree it was suicide are scared to post since those that believe it was murder defend their opinion so, well, vigorously.

Wish I could thank this 500 times. Healthy debate is stifled if not smothered on this case. The irony is that lively discussions can only create more interest to the "cause".

 

[inthedark14]

In my experience at WS many people defend their opinions quite vigorously. On many of the WS threads there are vast differences of opinion and that certainly doesn't stop people from posting their opinions. I can't say I'm sure why that would stop them from posting their opinions on this particular thread.

As far as I have seen, most of the posters here have always wanted to see both cases reopened.

ALWAYS MOO

 

[time]

I don't know, I'll fess up. For me the time is past where I want to consider this a suicide and debate that.:gaah:

That doesn't mean I will discourage others, I'm just not responding to those posts anymore.

 

[MyBelle]

If your correct, then an investigation and depositions will certainly clear all three of them. Alibis and unanswered questions will be clarified. I can imagine they (Dina, Nina and Adam) must be very excited to clear their names this way. I've already expressed on here more than once I will gladly offer my sincerest condolences to Dina, Nina or Adam on here if it turns out they have hid nothing and are cleared of anything nefarious. If I was an innocent Dina and wanted to find out how my dead son "really" died, I'd be immensely grateful for this potential opportunity to blow these 2 cases wide open. Max and Rebecca deserve nothing less.

I don't see a Judge allowing this case progress to the point of depositions. It's unfortunate that the medical examiner ruled RZ's death a suicide. If he had said it was inconclusive, I think they would at least have a chance to get at the truth but he pretty much closed the door for both families. I agree, Max and Rebecca deserve the truth and so do their families.

JMO

 

[DeDee]

DeDee, LuckyLucy and MyBelle, I am wondering--what is your opinion about the Board game described by InParadise in Post #136:

"Mrs. Gore made a joke out of the whole thing and presented the Chief of Coronado PD a board game that she made, using the names, events of Maxie and Rebecca's deaths, at his retirement ceremony/party in front of 150+ people."

Whether it is true or not, I find it to be in very poor taste. Why is the info on the game of Clue just now being revealed given the chief's retirement party was celebrated in mid-May?

I left the RZ threads, after diligent research, once I became convinced, that Max did not suffer an accidental death and RZ committed suicide. My position has not changed.

However, admittedly, there is a matter that has bothered me somewhat. It is depicted in cynic's post #111 in the Autopsy thread that show RZs back. I speculated that the abrasions on her back came from when RZ cut [from Ann Rule's book] down the chandelier and/or from swinging into the shrubbery under the balcony. However, most of the abrasions are not described as healing so they must of occurred at or near TOD. I realize the AR states there are many abrasions on her back, so cynic's markings are a guesstimate at the number. It is the description of the abrasions as "some seem to be paired and separated" that I cannot reconcile.

FWIW, IMHO, the tape residue was from wearing bandaids.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?148933-Rebecca-s-Autopsy&p=7355458#post7355458

moo omho mho and all that jazz

 

[Mr Spock]

I don't see a Judge allowing this case progress to the point of depositions. It's unfortunate that the medical examiner ruled RZ's death a suicide. If he had said it was inconclusive, I think they would at least have a chance to get at the truth but he pretty much closed the door for both families. I agree, Max and Rebecca deserve the truth and so do their families.

JMO

I think there is a great chance of depositions proceeding. Judges are inclined to give plaintiffs latitude for doing their own discovery. I imagine those depositions could be very illuminating. Many a murder has been staged as a suicide. In this case we have a POI with a documented history of aggression, as well as a documented history of embellishment and discrepancies about their past. Let the depositions begin!

 

[Inparadise]

Good question...this may be another Ann Rule factual error. I can only hope that someday Mary-Doug see the WISDOM in releasing all the information so the public can be fully informed. Lets say Jonah wasn't at Ronald MacDonald House.....whose car did he use to get back to Spreckels Mansion....he previously lent his car [9:00 pm] that Tuesday night to NINA.

Since it has not been verified that Howard Luber did get on an airplane to return to Phoenix that Tuesday evening after being dropped off at the airport, it would have been very easy for him to jump on a rental car bus at the airport and pick up a car and return to Rady Children's Hospital and pick up Jonah. IMO.

 

[Mr Spock]

Since it has not been verified that Howard Luber did get on an airplane to return to Phoenix that Tuesday evening after being dropped off at the airport, it would have been very easy for him to jump on a rental car bus at the airport and pick up a car and return to Rady Children's Hospital and pick up Jonah. IMO.

Was Howard Lubers work schedule for that next day (Wednesday?) ever verified? He must have had patients scheduled. Did he keep those apps? This could be easily verified through patient insurance billing records for that specific day. If there weren't any, then it's possible he did not fly out Tuesday night as we were told. IMO

 

[Inparadise]

Was Howard Lubers work schedule for that next day (Wednesday?) ever verified? He must have had patients scheduled. Did he keep those apps? This could be easily verified through patient insurance billing records for that specific day. If there weren't any, then it's possible he did not fly out Tuesday night as we were told. IMO

Even if he didn't get on a plane, and did get a gar and pick up Jonah and drop him off in Coronado, he could have easily driven to Phoenix to be in the office. It would have been easy to verify with both the airlines (USAirways or Southwest are the only 2 that provide direct service in that market) if he was onboard.