WV - Sodder Family - 5 children, Christmas eve 1945 - #1

[shadowangel]

I have yet to get any kind of a response from the governor's office, but of course I won't let that slow me down. I'm determined to see some type of memorial, if only some type of plaque or sign, erected in the area and I think the state government owes it to the Sodder family.

I can't wrap my mind around any scenario in which the children remained in the home, and no definitive remains being recovered. We may never know the answer....But the children and this unimaginable tragedy deserve to be remembered.

 

[Susan Shock]

I saw a program on the controversy surrounding the body that was supposed to be Jesse James. It was some years ago, the late 90s I think. They used mitochondrial dna to prove that the body in the grave was Jesse James.

 

[mysteriew]

I have lived in West Virginia all my life first in the Oak Hill area and for the last 4 years in Fayetteville area (Gatewood Road) I've grew up surronded by this story all my life my grandfather who used to be a mine foreman at several different mines knew of the story quite well,we would go on drives and everytime we passed that sign he would always tell us that there was much more than ever would come out about that night.He would not talk about what he knew but I could always tell he knew more than he was willing to talk about.I took care of him until he passed away and in his last days he did talk some .I do believe the children were never killed in that fire .The things that he told me makes me believe other things.I think that a memorial for the missing should be built to show the people that had their dirty hands in the cover up (even if they are dead I'm sure there are living members of there families who know the truth) that people have not forgotten and never will!May God bless each and every one and may there come a time when this will be solved!

Welcome to WS!
You have dropped some interesting hints. Could you share what your gf said in his later years? He must have said enough to make you feel that the children were still alive. Did he ever hint at what happened, or who was involved? Did he give any clues as to what may have happened to the children, or why? Please talk to us.

 

[LButler]

bowlerbabe67 ... good to have you here. I'm excited, but not surprised, to hear of someone who heard something ... I've always felt that bits and pieces of this story would come to light as people (such as your grandfather) aged and started to tell things they had heard, seen. I am in no way suggesting that your grandfather was guilty of anything - I just think that someone somewhere talked about what happened to these kids and someone else heard.

I don't know about how others here feel, but my fascination with this mystery has never been to see someone prosecuted - I just want to know what happened to these kids, who started the fire, what was the motivation of it all... Too much time has passed to hope for hard justice for the guilty parties and I honestly feel that they have already felt justice being served on them in other ways.

PS I'm in Summersville, so we're kinda neighbors!!

 

[LButler]

fox1950 ... which Fayette County History Book do you have? I know there is one that is next to impossible to get and a newer one, but don't know pub dates for either. I started looking for a good one when I got back into this story, but have been unable to locate one. Any ideas?

 

[Shadow205]

There is one for sale on EBAY I found it last night when I was researching Janutolo. He is mentioned in the book.

The item # is 4601066472

fox1950 ... which Fayette County History Book do you have? I know there is one that is next to impossible to get and a newer one, but don't know pub dates for either. I started looking for a good one when I got back into this story, but have been unable to locate one. Any ideas?

 

[Shadow205]

On August 19, 1949, George Sodder engaged the services of a pathologist Oscar B. Hunter Jr., from Washington,DC. Dr. Hunter came to the scene of the fire and observed an excavation of the area in search of bones or other evidence of the children. The search was a thorough one. So thorough that several very small articles were found including damaged coins. Also found was a partly burned dictionary, which had been kept in an upstairs closet of the room where the children had slept. But the only human remains found was a small section of vertebrae. The pathologist doubted that the fire could have been intense enough to burn all traces of the bodies, while leaving a flammable book only partly consumed. He told the Sodders that there should have been a large amount of bones in the debris. The vertebrae bones were examined by Dr. Hunter and then sent to the Smithsonian Institute in Washington,DC where they were given an intense examination by Dr. Marshall T. Newman. In Dr. Newmans report <snip> "The human bones consist of four lumbar vertebrae belonging to one individual. Since the transverse recesses are fused, the age of this individual at death should have been 16 or 17 years. The top limit age should be about 22 since the centra, which normally fuse at 23 are still unfused. On this basis, the bones show greater skeletal maturation than one would expect for a 14 year old boy(the eldest of the Sodder children missing). It is however possible, although not probable for a boy 14 1/2 years old to show 16-17 maturation.
The vertebrae show no evidence that they have been exposed to fire. In view of this it is very strange that no other bones were found in the allegedly carefully excavation of the basement of the house. Since the house was stated to have burned only for half an hour or so, one would expect to find the full skeletons of five children, rather than only four vertebrae. It is however impossible for me to make a conclusive judgement of this point since I was not present during the excavation."

The above information is from the book WV Unsolved Murders by George & Melody Bragg

 

[JBandy]

Hello eveyone. Thank you for your attention to this story. It has been a long dream of mine to bring this to the public's attention in my town. I am John's grandson. This topic was very sensitive to him and he did not like to speak about it too often. I however interviewed my grandpa for a high school project and a lot of the questions that I have in my head, if I remember correctly, are answered in the transcript I have from interviewing him.

To clear a few things up....the idea that my grandfather woke up the children is incorrect. He only yelled at George (Ted) to get up. The other children were in a different room. That is something that he said was incorrect in the Unsolved Mysteries book. Nonetheless, the book is the closest depiction to what really happened. There are a few more side stories that I have knowledge of...and will share when the time is right.

I am currently in Boston finishing up my Master's and will be moving south soon. The next project I have on my plate is to write a longer version of the story and donate ALL proceeds to the Amber Alert system in WV. I have done a lot of research on this system and I believe that it can help parents from ever going through such an atrocity like my family has had to experience. I have spoke with Mr. Bragg and he will be helping with this endeavor. If anyone would like to help with this...I would appreciate it. I want their memory to be worth something. I know he did not blame himself for whatever happened to them. He did not want to pursue anything becasue he did not want to know if they were killed in the fire or murdered. He just wanted to believe that they were still out there. He was also a little scared to look into it. He did not want to put his family in any possible danger (which I believe he was too skeptic).

I would also like to thank Stacy for everything. Stacy..I am looking forward to taking with you again.

I was Youth Governor of WV when I was in high school and have a few good contacts that could help in establishing a memorial. I think that is a wonderful idea and I would like to help with that.

Again, thank you all for everything. I finally was allowed to become a member after months of reading your posts. I will be going through all the posts (from the beginning) in the next few weeks and will post replies as necessary after I talk with my grandmother, mother, uncle, and my great aunt Silvia.

 

[Shadow205]

Welcome to WS's Jonathan. I look forward to your posts.

 

[JBandy]

Welcome to WS's Jonathan. I look forward to your posts.

Thanks. Glad to finally be here!

 

[fox1950]

I looked at the one on ebay. It is not the one I have. It looked like an earlier edition than the one I have. My book was publised by the Chamber of Commerce, 310 Oyler Avenue, Oak Hill, WV 25901 and Printed by Hertiage House publishing, 1600 North Missouri, Marceline, MO 64658. I am sure that (on Ebay)edition is as informative as mine-maybe more so. I can not remember where I got it-just remember it was hard to find. I have written in the front-Nov 1993.

Also, of interest to you, Butler or anyone else in the area-I checked out some books at the Fayetteville Library one time on Fayette County History. You may want to check that out.

Jonathan, so glad you posted! I will try to not bother you with all the questions I have-I'm a deep thinker and can be boring at times. I hope as you can you will answer some of our questions. If we can be of any service to you let us know. I think it is a wonderful idea about the amber alert and wish you could find the time to write a whole book. I don't think you would have a hard time selling it!

 

[shadowangel]

Jonathan-

Welcome! Shadow205 and I have started working up some ideas about the memorial. I'm sending you a PM with my contact info so we can discuss this. If anyone else would like to participate in the discussion, PM me.

We cannot allow the children to slip from the public's memory again.

 

[fox1950]

Also, there was one more Janutolo with ties to Fayetteville. He came to Fayette County in the 1890's from Piedicavello. He built coke ovens for several mining companies, built three stone buildings in Fayetteville, the Fayette Co. National Bank, the 20th century building and the Janutotolo building. He retired and returned to Italy in the late 1920's and died around 1931.

Three children were born of the first marriage, FG, Angline and Erita, which are all deceased. Two daughters by a second marriage live in Columbus O (whatever that means). History of Fayette County, 1993.

 

[mysteriew]

Three children were born of the first marriage, FG, Angline and Erita, which are all deceased. Two daughters by a second marriage live in Columbus O (whatever that means). History of Fayette County, 1993.

Columbus O would be Columbus, Ohio. Is that what you meant?

Do you know the dau.'s names?

 

[LButler]

Jonathon (hope I spelled that correctly) ... good to see you got registered. I put up a post the other day informing the admins that there were several folks who couldn't get registered - maybe the others can as well.

I live in Summersville and although I wasn't around any time near to this incident (I'm 36), I would like to help you with anything you would like to write (not for financial gain, just to see it done).

I'm anxious to hear what you have to post in the future.

To clear up one item I posted earlier that brought some folks to the defense of John, I apologize if I made him sound guilty of anything at the time they were exiting the house during the fire. However, I have always felt that the kids possibly knew more about what happened that night than anyone else. Once again, no guilt implied. If any of the kids had been threatened or approached by someone prior to the fire, they would probably share that info with an older sibling instead of parents. Just my thoughts and I don't want to cast any shadows on any family members that certainly had enough to deal with in their lifetime.

 

[fox1950]

Butler, I was not defending John because of something you said. I think you are a wise young owl and have very good sense when it comes to the mystery. I was trying to just make a point that if in fact John did say this, there were probably good reasons behind this and nothing more. I think Jonathan has clarified that John never said it in the first place and I don't understand why it was in a report. I can't understand why a lot of things were in those reports.
I just meant when they said he said it and usually the first thing people say to the authorities is true, that 7-8 hours lapsed between the fire and he talked to them. I, too, believe the older children came into contact with those they thought committed the crimes. So, please forgive me if I made you feel that way. I got a little angry that this was even in the reports.
Antonia's two other daughters were Ennes Janes and Alba Coletta.

 

[shadowangel]

What do you folks think of starting a new thread for this case, listing:

1. Known facts
2. "Most likely" reports
3. Proven false reports
4. Likely theories
5. Outright wrong theories

Everyone can post their thoughts for each category, and we can then discuss the validity of each. I really think we need to get a handle on what is known, what is believed, and what is strictly legend.

Also...I have seen it mentioned more than once that the vertebrae reportedly recovered in 1949 were sent to the Smithsonian...Does anyone think there is a chance that the remains are still there? I have no problem looking into it if anyone considers it worthwhile.

Shadow205 and I have begun sounding ideas for media involvement...Anyone with thoughts on the matter should feel free to post.

 

[Susan Shock]

I'm surprised an entire book hasn't been written on this case. It is such a compelling story. I think it needs to be told in greater detail.

 

[drema]

I wonder why Mrs. Sodder's brother had not discussed it with her before his testimony two years later that he had seen something while going through the ashes. By then, she had burned bones in her kitchen stove and had all kinds of doubts about the children. Out of more than 12 people digging only four say they seen something. Two were a priest and Mrs. Sodder's brother. The Sodders searching through the ashes seen nothing.

The world was a more native place in 1945. I am sure then, you would not have disputed the words of a priest. However, now, 60 years later, we know that priests, just like the rest of us are human. I wonder what the priest's connection was with the prominent man who was the chief suspect.
I think a discussion would be great, although the fire reports are biased in my opinion and most of the eye witnesses to seeing remains only talked about it
two years after the fire.

 

[Shadow205]

I have seen a couple of posts refer to the Priest & Mrs. Sodder's brother saying that they found something in the ashes. What is the source of that information?