Found Deceased WY - Gabrielle ‘Gabby’ Petito, 22, Grand Teton National Park, 25 Aug 2021 #38

[Deleted member 222031]

I don't think you are wrong about the explosion of "van lifers". It's always been a thing but it has exploded. I do disagree with it being some kind of movement or in any way comparable to the "hippy movements" of days gone by. For a lot of millennials (note; the eldest are in their 40s) it's become necessity to seek out other forms or alternative forms of shelter.

We have a serious housing shortage in this country. Housing costs are through the roof and wages have been stagnant for decades. I'm in my 40's and A LOT of my friends are turning to community living, RV or van living, tiny houses, etc. as the only livable solution. I see friends daily sharing information on real estate or property purchases with multiple families, alternatives to housing in general and minimizing.

It isn't a "movement" it's become either "live at home" (which 52% of 18-29 year olds are right now) OR find another way to live on your own that isn't the traditional "purchase the house with white picket fence". You might view the vans as "expensive" but they're a heck of a lot cheaper than housing in this country is. And IME the majority of people out there aren't you tubers, influencers or in their 20's. Sure, there are some but mostly it's people trying to get by within the current conditions of this country. Average millennial salary = $46,000 typical home price $287k. You can't even come close to getting a loan with that discrepancy if housing WAS available.

Truth spoken here! The wage/cost of housing gap is a national crisis. Everything built or renovated is "luxury" living. Not looking for luxury? Nobody from the builders to the politicians really cares. They say they do but then the "affordable" housing offered means cutting the budget somewhere, meaning you better be near a good bus system. This is why housing on wheels appeals though it has many cons along with the pros.

It's a modern form of the Grapes of Wrath and it's not viable for the long-term, especially with sanitation being a major drawback of van living. That was why I pulled the plug on the idea as a viable personal alternative. Climate control is another big issue....hot when it's hot and cold when it's cold can be more than unpleasant. It can be unhealthy.

It has been good to discuss van life here. Awareness of what's driving cultural trends is important. People are struggling and we need more open discussion about it IMO.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[Balthazar]

I am catching up from a busy work morning so please ignore me if this has been repeated.

Thank you for sharing this, I think it is interesting.

MOO: I have doubted she was killed in the van for many reasons, it's hard to move around much in there, not good space for even a good argument that includes throwing hands (not saying it can't happen, AT ALL, yes it could, just really small quarters. Also, it didn't appear the cadaver dogs caught a sense of that. Also, I don't think the van could even drive to where her body was found and that is a LONG distance to haul a lifeless body without help or machinery in a public space where anyone could walk by at any time, like nearly 9 football fields.

I am wondering if that is where they set up camp and pitched their tent. It was a lovely spot, and these campgrounds, as I mentioned before, are usually super super tent friendly. Plop where you want. It was a great spot, especially if not needing to haul a bunch of supplies. They could pitch their tent, haul a small cooler, go back to the van easily enough to get anything else and have a terrific spot for a few days. I would be looking for signs of tent pegs, fire, and signs of someone settling in there. I think whatever happened, happened there. I do NOT think Gabby would have stayed in a tent there by herself for long stretches of time, or overnight. MOO...and I could be wrong. Maybe would leave the tent there and come back to van, IF they could see that spot from the van, just to keep an eye on things.
Again, MOO.

The media has said there were the ashes of a campfire near where Gabby was found. I think they set up their tent in that area and whatever happened, happened there.

 

[insearchoflight]

Harrowing photos show trees and rocks around Gabby Petito's death site marked by FBI | Daily Mail Online

Has it been confirmed that the spot she was found was the spot the murder occurred or is this irresponsible reporting?

 

[Sassafrass]

He was already quoted as saying he was doing this for Gabby and her family. I'm sure he is not in it for the money. The guy is a multi millionaire of his own making.

I prefer to think he is doing it primarily for honorable reasons. But that doesn't mean he's unaware that publicity is good for business in general, and that his being involved reinforces his fame and reputation as "the" bounty hunter.

 

[Diddian]

Remember in the Moab footage he talked about wanting to go work on an organic farm. He mentioned “woofing”.

World Wide Opportunities on Organic Farms | WWOOF

I remember him mentioning that too and it would be a good way of staying underground.

Until 2016, we had a summer home on a couple acres in a small agricultural and seasonal tourist community near the Pacific Ocean in SW Washington. I designed a landscape plan for about an acre of the property and, because there really weren’t any landscape installers in the area, hired a guy who ran an organic farm and did some small scale landscaping to help me get my plan built. He had relationships with folks who could build my stone walls and walkways and he had a group of people - Wwoofers - who worked with him on his organic farm and they helped me install the moving truck full of trees and shrubs that I brought down to the area as well as the lawns.

The host farmer had lived with his wife in Mexico working as Wwoofers there for years before they established their own farm in the area I found him. The folks who worked his farm temporarily lived on his property and they ate their meals together, did yoga together, made and sold handcrafted items in addition to their organic produce (much of which supplied local restaurants). It was like a commune of young people hosted by this guy in his 60’s (his wife had died years before I met him). The Wwoofers were somewhat itinerant; they’d stay a season or several and then move onto another place and they informally shared information about the places they’d been with each other.

I could definitely see BL fitting into such a community and I could definitely see the others there being blissfully unaware that he was a wanted man.

GP and BL were supposedly to end their trip in Portland. I think that’d be about 2-1/2 hours from the host farm I was acquainted with and IIRC, that farmer had mentioned there were others in that SW Washington/NW Oregon Area.

I wonder if BL had actually made any contacts with any such farms prior to the events in August/September with the intention of checking any of them out when he and GP arrived at what was to be their end destination.

 

[Barbie619]

They don’t want help because HE AINT MISSIN! Lol jmo but he wasn’t posing a threat to them! Can’t just call cops for someone knocking on your door

I think you can and should if you see someone sketchy at your door. Sorry, Dog, but he looks sketchy and these people probably have no idea who he is....

 

[karen in New York]

Dog The Bounty Hunter runs on numerous stations around the country and around the world ...DAILY Every time a show plays he gets money.
I
The guy is ANythING but needing money or attention.

I take it many of you have never watched his shows or saw his charitable contributions. Beth is deceased wife was a BIG contributor to poor people who could not make bail and to the Breast Cancer society.

From Duane Chapman - Wikipedia
"At the age of 15, Chapman joined the Devils Diciples, an outlaw motorcycle club, and ran away from home.[7][3] In 1976, Chapman was convicted of first degree murder, and sentenced to five years in a Texas prison. He had been waiting in a getaway car while his friend shot and killed Jerry Oliver, 69,[10] in a struggle during a deal to buy cannabis.[11]

Chapman served 18 months at the Texas State Penitentiary in Huntsville, Texas. While he was in prison, his first wife LaFonda divorced him and married his best friend. During his incarceration, he did field work and acted as the warden's barber. In a 2007 interview for Fox News, Chapman claimed that while serving his sentence, he tackled an inmate about to be shot for attempting to escape, and a congratulatory remark by a corrections officer inspired him to become a bounty hunter later.[12] Chapman was paroled in January 1979.[13]

As a result of his felony conviction, Chapman is not permitted to own any firearms, and has been refused entry to the United Kingdom.[11]

 

[mejane]

Putting myself in the Laundries situation (if I were protecting my son)
If I were truly afraid my son was suicidal, I would welcome help from Dog the bounty hunter. An alive kid in prison is better than a dead kid, right? (assuming you love him) However, If I knew he was safe, I would not want him involved because he will bring more attention to the manhunt. And to my family in general. ( he might even discover my potential involvement) The obviously don't want him found. They must know where he is.

 

[LeeJay55]

I agree. She knew. His parents know him well, she lived with the three of them. There had to be a lifelong family dynamic (I think of it as "Protecting Brian") because his parents knew he was...different. They probably saw him as a troubled but romantic and talented young artist, a nature loving young man who could hardly stand to live in regular society (which, to them, helped explain his other behaviors, such as throwing tantrums in public).

Both Gabby and BL probably thought that Gabby "helped" Brian in the same way that his parents had. Gabby overlooked his possessiveness and dependency because she "loved him."



People have certainly had "on the run for life" as a plan. There are 65 people wanted on federal warrants who have evaded capture since 2010. Eleven years.

I too am a little surprised at what appears to be a narrow focus on the swamp, which makes me think they have no digital evidence of Brian being elsewhere since he came back from WY. In fact, perhaps they have no digital evidence - just the parents' statements - to place him in the swamp.

Ever since the story (last couple of days) about the missing man found inside a 500 pound alligator, I've been curious as to just how many alligators the divers encountered in that swamp, and how big they are. It looks as if there are several different ponds, each has been searched.

If the parents believe Brian meant to stay in the preserve indefinitely, then they must be grieving his death or hoping against hope that he is hiding somewhere in the swamp.

If the parents know that Brian never meant to stay in the swamp or was never in the swamp, then they have some explaining to do. I think LE can probably compel them into court via Grand Jury to say what they know about his disappearance (as they moved the car, which was evidence). They can of course take the 5th, but that points directly to them helping him disappear, IMO.



He was picked up near Colter Bay, about 16-17 miles from where the van was. Inside the National Park. He rode only a couple of miles when he realized the couple were going to Jackson Hole (which is what many tourists call Jackson, WY, but technically. "Jackson Hole" is the valley in which Jackson sits. Anyway, when Brian realized he was going to Jackson via the route that's a bit further away from Spread Creek, he became somewhat agitated and demanded to be let out of the vehicle (and may have then hitched a ride with another couple). To me, it seems clear that he was trying to get back to Spread Creek.

I don't think there's any evidence that BL walked from Merry Piglets to Spread Creek (and he was hitching from northwest of Spread Creek; Merry Piglets is south of Spread Creek.

Of course, it's possible that he hitchhiked to Colter Bay from Jackson, and that Gabby drove the van (which she didn't like to do) and then Gabby for some unknown reason chose to park the van in a pull-out and not in the general camping area where at least there were pit toilets. There's no evidence of that. To me, it appears Gabby was already dead (and Brian had her phone and credit cards) at the time of the hitchhiking back to Spread Creek.

I believe he fled Spread Creek because he had killed and buried Gabby, and he wanted to get some cash for his cross country journey, to avoid leaving a further digital trail. Of course, that led to his current federal charges, because the FBI also apparently believes Gabby was dead when BL went to the ATM.

Sorry but I have.not heard anything bad about either not them till the ending of this trip!
Something changed!
They were.not.enjoying it anymore.maybe!
Out of.money?
Stressing over a blog?
Sad!

 

[SandSage]

I prefer to think he is doing it primarily for honorable reasons. But that doesn't mean he's unaware that publicity is good for business in general, and that his being involved reinforces his fame and reputation as "the" bounty hunter.

Yep. They're not mutually exclusive. Just like every single media organization covering this. They want to help, of course... but there is also big money behind it. MOO

 

[EyeCandy]

What does a meth person look like? What does that even mean? I wouldn't care if someone on meth found him as long as someone does!!!

That whole scene was opportunistic and just for publicity. It was offensive to me TBH.

offensive or not ... if he helps then I'm all for it

Dog has been The Dog for decades, he isn't in a beauty contest, he hunts fugitives!!! His resume is extensive I don't care WHAT he looks like, if he is hunting Gabby's killer I would never call him names. And for those who says it is for publicity ... if he gets publicity for finding Brian would you say "let him go" Come on man!!!!

 

[tiara1972]

YES! Sadly as soon as I saw that Dog was involved... It felt fake. If HE is the one that brings him in... I will have no words! (don't get me wrong, I will be happy he is caught, but c'mon...)

Please remove this if it breaks rules, it might and that is fair. MOO!!!! I agree completely. This case is SO odd and strange that it creates space for some suspicions about what is really happening here. When the financial rewards start rolling in from places NOT connected to official law enforcement or FBI, it can trigger, for me anyhow, some suspicions related to motivation or staging, or some odd way to send money to someone like Dog. If Dog ends up receiving these rewards and finds Brian, regardless of what happens after that, it makes it icky, feels staged, whether or not it is spun as a legitimate discovery...too commercialized. For me, it somehow taints the entire process if such a thing happens....

 

[Ur728]

Putting myself in the Laundries situation (if I were protecting my son)
If I were truly afraid my son was suicidal, I would welcome help from Dog the bounty hunter. An alive kid in prison is better than a dead kid, right? (assuming you love him) However, If I knew he was safe, I would not want him involved because he will bring more attention to the manhunt. And to my family in general. ( he might even discover my potential involvement) The obviously don't want him found. They must know where he is.

Exactly. They clearly aren’t worried or upset about anything it seems because they know where he is

 

[Sassafrass]

For hippies, it was also necessary for them to leave their parents' homes. In my own case, I left at 18, but knew many kids in high school who went homeless/hippy at 15 or 17. One was my best friend since 4th grade. Hippies were not all the same in their motivations either. But people could recognize them by their homelessness and raggedy appearance. Some among them were super religious, some among them walked barefoot, some wore dreadlocks - but the majority were just homeless kids who lived next to bus stations and train stations or in bushes near where rivers flowed out to the beaches. There was no housing they could afford, either. In fact, I'd say that it's easier now to find a minimum wage job than it was back then (my own home town had about 1/10 the restaurants and motels as it does now...you had to know someone to get a fast food job).

There was a serious affordable housing crisis in the 70's, as well. We lived in groups of 4-5 people (before cities passed ordinances disallowing it).

I think people forget that corporal punishment of children was permitted in the 70's, in nearly all states, that parents tried to exercise extremely strict control over every aspect of their kids' lives and teens did not get given cars in the same percentages as now. Hitchhiking at freeway onramps was legal, so there were encampments up and down every freeway in California - but many of the kids came from inland states.

If Van Life isn't a movement, then neither were the hippies. In my professional opinion. Van Life became way. more popular when Alex Honnold revealed his van, his life style, etc. I have interviewed many young men who adore Alex and want to be just like him (and they're making good progress - I just managed to talk to an older climber about the whole situation, as he is a person who allows Van Lifers to stay on his property near Yosemite). There. are entire documentaries about this movement and the principles they think guide it.

Not everyone living in a van is a Van Lifer, but people who use #VanLife as their hash tag to monetize their experience are indeed an economic and cultural force, which is what a cultural movement is, by definition.

Here is a link to an academic article that discusses the main components of VanLife:

Van Life: A Creative Exploration of Contemporary Nomadism

I think there's a wide difference in choosing to live nomadically/minimally (out of principle or as a financial need), and choosing to live in a van for a few weeks or months (and possibly stitch together and market a pretty picture of it). That's not to denigrate either one, but they don't seem like the the same level of reality at all, or a single "movement.". Living vs vacationing.

 

[Herat]

Dog The Bounty Hunter runs on numerous stations around the country and around the world ...DAILY Every time a show plays he gets money.
I
The guy is ANythING but needing money or attention.

I take it many of you have never watched his shows or saw his charitable contributions. Beth is deceased wife was a BIG contributor to poor people who could not make bail and to the Breast Cancer society.

Beth was the one behind their success. she was really smart, with great emotional intelligence and deep kindness.

IMHO

 

[ninvestigate]

Another fugitive "on the run" from the Sarasota area, since 2017, John Pyle.

Of interest from linked article: "Though Pyle surrendered his passport as part of his bond, he was still able to board a Carnival Cruise Lines ship to Cozumel, Mexico, according a court document. Pyle then got off the boat and did not return."

Pyle's Wikipedia shows his location as unknown since at least 2018, with assumption he is no longer in Mexico.

It's been done before, so. Noteworthy.

 

[Pepper6564]

I think you can and should if you see someone sketchy at your door. Sorry, Dog, but he looks sketchy and these people probably have no idea who he is....

He didn’t look sketchy to me and I am well over 60 he looked like a old hippy friendly he stepped back from the door after knocking which I consider manners so the people inside could see him.

 

[carbuff]

The media has said there were the ashes of a campfire near where Gabby was found. I think they set up their tent in that area and whatever happened, happened there.

No telling how old that was though. One thing you find a lot of around public campsites is lots of ashes, either from where the fire was built or where somebody dumped wet ash from a fire pit.

 

[bestill]

Putting myself in the Laundries situation (if I were protecting my son)
If I were truly afraid my son was suicidal, I would welcome help from Dog the bounty hunter. An alive kid in prison is better than a dead kid, right? (assuming you love him) However, If I knew he was safe, I would not want him involved because he will bring more attention to the manhunt. And to my family in general. ( he might even discover my potential involvement) The obviously don't want him found. They must know where he is.

Exactly and if you were worried about him harming himself you would be distressed and pleading for help to find him first. Their actions don't match their story one bit.

 

[mejane]

I wonder how many people, friends and family included, would be willing to get involved with helping Brian now? If he was getting help outside of his parents, who would be stupid enough to continue to help him? Hide him? House him? Feed him?