Found Deceased WY - Gabrielle ‘Gabby’ Petito, 22, Grand Teton National Park, 25 Aug 2021 #66

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If he left her body out in the open (unburied) he could have been hoping her remains would be scattered by animals., making it more difficult to find her.

As to the theft over 1,000 and unauthorized use charges - hard for him and a future defense to say she had given him permission to use the card/funds when she was deceased and unable to to do so.

I agree, I was just trying to think of what his end game was. With the theory that I thought, I do think it might have seemed good at the time, just like the hiking but he soon realised it made him look even guiltier so he followed lawyers advise and kept quiet. I just can’t see any other reason he would think using her cards was ever going to help him. All MOO.
 
I feel like if GP's step-father was on scene, being shown the exact location and position of where her body was found (per his Dr. Phil interview), then his account of a possible tent location and a fire pit carry weight. That's just my take.

And as for it being unrelated to GP and BL, what are the chances she would end up by a fire pit?
Oh, I believe that he saw the old firepit and tent spot, but it had probably been used numerous times by other campers, so it was permanently marked there. I just don't think that after the scene at Merry Piglets, they happily went back to set up a nice camp spot together to enjoy the scenery. I'm with rickshaw, I think she ran away from him and that's where he caught up with her. jmo
 
She already has. Gabby's homicide is shining a bright light on important topics that are sparking dialogue, and hopefully changes. People everywhere are trying to figure out how this seemingly much in love young couple could end up so tragically. Could this have been prevented? I've been asking myself that ever since the debate of the Moab LE stop began.

I think that the only way to prevent such tragedies starts way before LE intervention. It starts with education (hopefully at home), but in the schools; what a healthy relationship looks like, warning signs of trouble, and what to do if there is trouble. I will also say that while this educational and collective conscious shift is underway, there needs to be zero tolerance policies in institutional settings that help irradiate certain behaviors. I am seeing progress there, but much more is needed.

Whether abusive and dangerous behavior is a result of mental imbalance, chemical abuse, or entitlement, we have to decide as a society that there is zero tolerance for it. And this is where i believe Gabby's death is going to make a difference. "Let it be"....the catalyst for change.

Amateur opinion and speculation

I especially like your last paragraph. I hope someday we can explore all the issues that contributed to what happened. I truly feel we are missing a part of the puzzle. And to help prevent tragedies like this in the future, everything has to be looked at.
 
I feel like if GP's step-father was on scene, being shown the exact location and position of where her body was found (per his Dr. Phil interview), then his account of a possible tent location and a fire pit carry weight. That's just my take.

And as for it being unrelated to GP and BL, what are the chances she would end up by a fire pit?
Too many coincidences.
 
She already has. Gabby's homicide is shining a bright light on important topics that are sparking dialogue, and hopefully changes. People everywhere are trying to figure out how this seemingly much in love young couple could end up so tragically. Could this have been prevented? I've been asking myself that ever since the debate of the Moab LE stop began.

I think that the only way to prevent such tragedies starts way before LE intervention. It starts with education (hopefully at home), but in the schools; what a healthy relationship looks like, warning signs of trouble, and what to do if there is trouble. I will also say that while this educational and collective conscious shift is underway, there needs to be zero tolerance policies in institutional settings that help irradiate certain behaviors. I am seeing progress there, but much more is needed.

Whether abusive and dangerous behavior is a result of mental imbalance, chemical abuse, or entitlement, we have to decide as a society that there is zero tolerance for it. And this is where i believe Gabby's death is going to make a difference. "Let it be"....the catalyst for change.

Amateur opinion and speculation
Oh sweet rose, I really like it when you come into a case. You always seem to keep the big picture in focus and don’t get all tangled in the noise. Well said…
 
It seems obvious that a forensic autopsy, on a body out in the elements for 3+ weeks, is far from an exact science. Even if she was killed right after the restaurant, would her stomach contents be decomposed so much at that point to make it impossible to link to the restaurant? I would tend to think so, but I'm obviously no expert.

It seems a few people were expecting the autopsy to narrow down the TOD to the minute. Assuming BL did it (safe assumption, imo), we know the TOD was between the 27th and 30th. The autopsy didn't help narrow down that window any. I think the important thing is that (hopefully) nothing in the autopsy contradicts that window.

Personally, I'm a little skeptical of the autopsy window given (22nd to 29th (unofficial dates, I know)). It just seems pretty convenient how well it lines up with what was already known, or assumed.

Like, what if dr. Blue gave a window of the 26th thru the 2nd? There would be endless debates about how BL possibly COULDN'T have done it.

I'm not saying that the fix is in, or that there is something nefarious going on. I just think that the autopsy window would probably have been a little different if the TOD hadn't already been narrowed down (presumably) to a few days before the autopsy was even conducted. We are, after all, all human.

JMO

So much is known about what bodies do in different tempss, on different kinds of surfaces, in varying humidity, etc., that I would say it is as exact a science as figuring out whether a person needs a certain dose of medicine, depending on their size. There are thousands of studies, two major body farms,. and 5 decades of carefully collected data.

First, the body begins to break down all of the cells in the soft tissue. This is accompanied by the production of various enzymes, whose rates are correlated closely with temperature and humidity (especially temperature). The ME and Coroner know more about the temps at Spread Creek than we do, I'm sure.

The reason that they have a week long window (which is pretty narrow) is that there was probably not a lot of mold or mildew in the area - some, enough to get a window on that stage of decomp. It's really unlikely that all insects, birds and rodents would have avoided the body, so I doubt there's much evidence of what a last meal would have been. It's possible - but that takes sending samples to specialists. There's been no word whether they hired an (expensive) forensic entomologist or not - but they must have preserved the evidence needed for that analysis to take place. I think they could still hire one - if they find BL. Why bother and use up a precious expert resource if he's not found?

I'm not sure why some think 7 days is a wide window. I do not think the pathologists and the ME used alleged facts about restaurant visits or texts to determine cause of death - that's not how it works. The Coroner will include that information in the final report, if it is verified but the autopsy itself focuses on what is known about the body.

Since most of us believe the Merry Piglets visit occurred, that does narrow the window. I wrote a fairly lengthy post about it last night.

IMO, there's no way that the medical examiner worked backwards from any outside facts, as that would be assuming way too much about BL's movements and GP's as well. A ME's job is to do an autopsy, not to go out into the field and ask people at restaurants questions - that's a different aspect to the investigation. Nor would the ME be watching the Bethune's video in order to make a determination of ToD.

Wyoming ME's are well versed in WY conditions. I trust the ME implicitly and believe they found the best expert (from Sheridan) that they could.

Being kept just above freezing for some of the time that Gabby was out there would have slowed decomp a little, so it is possible that they could find evidence of last meals...maybe. A lot depends on whether she was face up or face down. It does not appear that any large scavengers discovered her or by the time they did, there wasn't enough for them to bother. It is usually ravens who get there first (and stand/fly around the various campsites in the area, at the ready).

I should add that even a non-entomologist is going to know how to use the various (often generational) evidence from insects to help determine time of death, and there may not be a lot of exotic insects at Spread Creek. The creek itself had very little water in it and from photos I've seen, I'm pretty sure I could cross it easily and would be unlikely to get much of my boots wet.

A Coroner's full report is different than an autopsy report...once all the verified data are combined, the window of Gabby's death will be August 27 to August 29...(using Merry Piglets). During that entire time, I believe it will be easily established that the van was parked within a few hundred feet of where she was found.
 
Good question. On last night's special, and even with the RW&B video, the CNN crew had trouble finding that exact spot. So maybe it's not so easy to say that for both sightings was it the exact same spot or just somewhere near there.
I think the importance of the Bethunes and the Elk Hunters is that they saw the van from two different angles. The Bethunes were on the road and made a video of the parked van. The elk hunters saw the van thru a gun scope from further away but noticed the identifying wheel covers and other details. The FBI may have better information than CNN, hopefully.
 
Good thinking. This could make sense of the boots at the scene. Still curious why they weren't gathered if killer packed up the rest of camp... of course we don't know that is actually the case yet
Another speculative scenario: She may have partially recovered in a delirious state and removed the boots. That might also explain the "Stan" text.
 
Thinking about SB and BL's last conversation that SB claims was 9/13... The story is BL took the mustang early to the park, no? Gate opens at 6am, so assuming the gate was closed prior and he parked inside it would be after that hour. Strangely, I read about the landscaping company that cares for the park claim the mustang was parked oddly in the grass, not sure if that means outside the gate or not but could be interesting wrinkle, anyway this is unconfirmed and pure speculation. Would be interesting to nail down the hour that BL left. If it was before sunrise it is hard to imagine him on the phone with SB at 6am 9/13. If the conversation was later in the day that would be interesting if true. BL leaves a phone at home early 9/13 but speaks to SB later that day? Well there is a ping in the reserve now from a different phone, to SB no less, that surely would interest LE! Speculation only of course...
 
I've missed something. Can you explain further please? : )
We're talking about the Dr Phil interview with her parents who were discussing the area where her body was found. They said there was the mark or imprint of what could have been a tent and a campfire beside where her body was located.
People are arguing that it wasn't necessarily their tent but a tent from some time before she died.
I don't think they would have mentioned it if they didn't believe it to be true.
 
I agree, I was just trying to think of what his end game was. With the theory that I thought, I do think it might have seemed good at the time, just like the hiking but he soon realised it made him look even guiltier so he followed lawyers advise and kept quiet. I just can’t see any other reason he would think using her cards was ever going to help him. All MOO.


I believe he killed her the night of the Merry Piglets incident. It is my belief that he was enraged when left there because Gabby apologized to the staff for HIS behavior.

I think they returned to their campsite and it escalated until he strangled her. I would not be surprised that when the full autopsy is released to find out that she had defensive wounds. Also would not be surprised to find out that his DNA was found under her fingernails.

I think after he killed her he took off on foot, trying to reach some sort of civilization. My belief is that once the couple that picked him hitchhiking (the ones he offered $200 to) clarified they were going to Jackson, not Jackson Hole as he presumed, is when he demanded to be let out of the vehicle. I don't think he wanted to back to Jackson out of fear being recognized by anyone who may have witnessed his behavior at the Merry Piglets.

He then probably realized his best chance of getting away was to return to the van and drive home to Florida. I surmise that he disposed of both his and Gabby's phones somewhere between Wyoming and Florida.
 
So many details missing. For example, do the witnesses at Merry Piglets...any of them remember what Gabby was wearing, and comparing that to what she was wearing when found. Also, I think LE does have the technology to analyze food passing through the digestive track more than they have disclosed. Helpful to estimate time of death.

Mystery still ......why LE is still focused on Reserve....
Agreed with entire post.
Esp. what she was wearing when found and what color of shirt/jacket/pants ?
Was she found covered or not ?
Did the investigators cover her ?
Mostly wondering how BL left her.
:(
If he's apprehended alive, maybe we'll find out if this goes to trial and what he told his family after arriving back home.
My opinion at this time is that Brian's the weakest link and will talk long before his parents will say anything about him -- whether his past demeanor or present actions.
Imo.
 
Last edited:
So this is exactly what Gabby's step-dad said (with a link!)

"There was remnants of a fire ring there and you could see where those rocks had been moved to make the fire ring. There was a clearing where I would assume, knowing I have a similar tent, where I would place my tent and that opening would face out overlooking the mountain range. And her body was found...I guess it would be in front of a tent, if that's what was there, or just in front of the fire ring. There was definitely a fire ring there."

Interview with family
 
So much is known about what bodies do in different tempss, on different kinds of surfaces, in varying humidity, etc., that I would say it is as exact a science as figuring out whether a person needs a certain dose of medicine, depending on their size. There are thousands of studies, two major body farms,. and 5 decades of carefully collected data.

First, the body begins to break down all of the cells in the soft tissue. This is accompanied by the production of various enzymes, whose rates are correlated closely with temperature and humidity (especially temperature). The ME and Coroner know more about the temps at Spread Creek than we do, I'm sure.

The reason that they have a week long window (which is pretty narrow) is that there was probably not a lot of mold or mildew in the area - some, enough to get a window on that stage of decomp. It's really unlikely that all insects, birds and rodents would have avoided the body, so I doubt there's much evidence of what a last meal would have been. It's possible - but that takes sending samples to specialists. There's been no word whether they hired an (expensive) forensic entomologist or not - but they must have preserved the evidence needed for that analysis to take place. I think they could still hire one - if they find BL. Why bother and use up a precious expert resource if he's not found?

I'm not sure why some think 7 days is a wide window. I do not think the pathologists and the ME used alleged facts about restaurant visits or texts to determine cause of death - that's not how it works. The Coroner will include that information in the final report, if it is verified but the autopsy itself focuses on what is known about the body.

Since most of us believe the Merry Piglets visit occurred, that does narrow the window. I wrote a fairly lengthy post about it last night.

IMO, there's no way that the medical examiner worked backwards from any outside facts, as that would be assuming way too much about BL's movements and GP's as well. A ME's job is to do an autopsy, not to go out into the field and ask people at restaurants questions - that's a different aspect to the investigation. Nor would the ME be watching the Bethune's video in order to make a determination of ToD.

Wyoming ME's are well versed in WY conditions. I trust the ME implicitly and believe they found the best expert (from Sheridan) that they could.

Being kept just above freezing for some of the time that Gabby was out there would have slowed decomp a little, so it is possible that they could find evidence of last meals...maybe. A lot depends on whether she was face up or face down. It does not appear that any large scavengers discovered her or by the time they did, there wasn't enough for them to bother. It is usually ravens who get there first (and stand/fly around the various campsites in the area, at the ready).

I should add that even a non-entomologist is going to know how to use the various (often generational) evidence from insects to help determine time of death, and there may not be a lot of exotic insects at Spread Creek. The creek itself had very little water in it and from photos I've seen, I'm pretty sure I could cross it easily and would be unlikely to get much of my boots wet.

A Coroner's full report is different than an autopsy report...once all the verified data are combined, the window of Gabby's death will be August 27 to August 29...(using Merry Piglets). During that entire time, I believe it will be easily established that the van was parked within a few hundred feet of where she was found.
Good post! The complete autopsy Will study the insect life cycle. I won't be gross while folks are eating on Saturday morning, abd most people know what I mean if they've watched any CSI.
 
Oh sweet rose, I really like it when you come into a case. You always seem to keep the big picture in focus and don’t get all tangled in the noise. Well said…
Very kind words, thank you.
I ask myself, is this case really extraordinary? Only in the media attention it has captured. Sadly, in the U.S. alone, we had almost 2000 "Gabby's" last year.
It's a complicated, multi-faceted plague on our society, but we can make positive change. Gabby's case, her sweet spirit, is helping do just that.

Amateur opinion and speculation
 
I believe he killed her the night of the Merry Piglets incident. It is my belief that he was enraged when left there because Gabby apologized to the staff for HIS behavior.

I think they returned to their campsite and it escalated until he strangled her. I would not be surprised that when the full autopsy is released to find out that she had defensive wounds. Also would not be surprised to find out that his DNA was found under her fingernails.

I think after he killed her he took off on foot, trying to reach some sort of civilization. My belief is that once the couple that picked him hitchhiking (the ones he offered $200 to) clarified they were going to Jackson, not Jackson Hole as he presumed, is when he demanded to be let out of the vehicle. I don't think he wanted to back to Jackson out of fear being recognized by anyone who may have witnessed his behavior at the Merry Piglets.

He then probably realized his best chance of getting away was to return to the van and drive home to Florida. I surmise that he disposed of both his and Gabby's phones somewhere between Wyoming and Florida.
bbm
Ita.
He may have received instructions from his parents about what he should/shouldn't do ?
MOO.
 
It is in Part 2 of the Dr Phil interview with her parents.
Right, but he never says there was an imprint of a tent, just that there was a clearing where one could pitch a tent.

"You can see where the rocks had been moved to make a fire ring and there was a clearing," he said, "Her body was found — what would be — in front of the tent if that’s what was there or in front of the fire ring."

He "pictured" a tent in that location, he did not say he saw evidence of one.

Gabby Petito's Stepdad Describes Identifying Her Body — Exactly Where And How She Was Found
 
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