Found Deceased WY - Gabrielle ‘Gabby’ Petito, 22, Grand Teton National Park, 25 Aug 2021 #68

[Bekind89]

It is. MOO Still not "felony-murder", though it is a murder which is a felony, lol. MOO I obviously am not doing a good job. Maybe google is better. MOO

But isn't strangulation considered a premeditated murder? If it is would that make it a felony? Last question, I promise, what about the location? Does that matter? Jmo

 

[SuperTmo]

I'm confused now about the order in which things happened surrounding the welfare check and the missing person report.

I thought the welfare check came first, and when GP wasn't found during the check, nor was information provided about where she was, that then led the family to report her missing.

Do I have it backwards?

That is how I understood it happened. Perhaps during the welfare check the police officer(s) identified her van as being there and were informed BL was there but she was not. So then that was relayed to Joe Petito and they reported her missing. MOO but it makes the most sense this way. I feel like reporting her missing first means it is a missing person investigation not a welfare check.

 

[kittythehare]

I'm confused now about the order in which things happened surrounding the welfare check and the missing person report.

I thought the welfare check came first, and when GP wasn't found during the check, nor was information provided about where she was, that then led the family to report her missing.

Do I have it backwards?

Well, I think it's appropriate to be confused because there were so many 911 calls from the Laundries that my head gets fried if I even attempt to begin to tidy them into sequence. I think there were possibly a few welfare calls but I have no idea which one was for Gabby.
A journalist FOI'd the document and I find it to be crazy making...
I have a 'maths and stuff' box in my head that I pt things I can't understand.
And I leave them there forever. Pandora's box, I call it.

 

[housewife]

I've done a thread search, and I hope this hasn't been asked already...

When the NPPD went to the Laundrie home the first time, they were denied entry to the home and handed a lawyer's business card.
Under the Community Caretaking Doctrine, couldn't the police have entered anyway to see of Gabby or Brian were there?

2021 Florida Statutes, 937.021 Missing child and missing adult reports.—
"Additionally, no court order is required for police to conduct a welfare check. As long as the officer has reasonable grounds to believe that an inhabitant in a residence is endangered, they can legally enter the premises. Law enforcement is given this power under the Community Caretaking Doctrine, a judicially created exception to the warrant requirement of the Fourth Amendment."

 

[Bekind89]

JMO but I don't believe there was a storage unit to clean out unless it was on the parents property. Maybe the shed or a room?

Neither do I and even if there was and it was this size, why not have the father or a friend empty it to save the expense of flying back? I just do not understand the logic. Jmo

 

[Jurisprudence]

But isn't strangulation considered a premeditated murder? If it is would that make it a felony? Last question, I promise, what about the location? Does that matter? Jmo

Yes, it's a felony. Felony Murder is a very specific type of murder charge. BL if he's charged at all will be charged with murder, which is a felony. "Felony Murder" is actually the name of a different type of murder charge. MOO This may do a better job.

Felony Murder

Night all.

 

[blackbeary]

BBM. The parents tried repeatedly to contact GP and BM and I think it was to ask them about the charges. Then they tried to contact BL parents to no avail. If they didn't know whether the charges were valid or not, why would LE waste resources investigating at that point? My local police won't do it. I've tried. jmo

What To Do If You See Fraudulent Charges
The first thing to do is call your bank or issuer.
How To Get Fraudulent Charges Removed From Your Credit Card

On the Dr. Phil episode, both biological parents called any number they could find of the Laundrie family members & called & text repeatedly. Police & detectives also tried to speak with RL by phone.
They found out that Gabby's van was in Florida the night of September 11.

 

[SuperTmo]

But isn't strangulation considered a premeditated murder? If it is would that make it a felony? Last question, I promise, what about the location? Does that matter? Jmo

that would make it capital murder. Or murder in the first degree. Every jurisdiction seems to have their own classification system.

 

[Bekind89]

Yes, it's a felony. Felony Murder is a very specific type of murder charge. BL if he's charged at all will be charged with murder, which is a felony. "Felony Murder" is actually the name of a different type of murder charge. MOO This may do a better job.

Felony Murder

Night all.

Thank you for explaining that. Much appreciated.

 

[kittythehare]

I've done a thread search, and I hope this hasn't been asked already...

When the NPPD went to the Laundrie home the first time, they were denied entry to the home and handed a lawyer's business card.
Under the Community Caretaking Doctrine, couldn't the police have entered anyway to see of Gabby or Brian were there?

2021 Florida Statutes, 937.021 Missing child and missing adult reports.—
"Additionally, no court order is required for police to conduct a welfare check. As long as the officer has reasonable grounds to believe that an inhabitant in a residence is endangered, they can legally enter the premises. Law enforcement is given this power under the Community Caretaking Doctrine, a judicially created exception to the warrant requirement of the Fourth Amendment."

Great work finding that! Thank you.

 

[customCF]

Im sure LE has surveillance on any properties owned by the Laundries. It would be easy to get a warrant to search them if they are vacant but LE thought that BL was holed up in one. But why wouldn’t they have any rentals occupied by renters?

Could some financial scam be happening? MOO Not sure how far I can go with this before TOS

 

[SuperTmo]

I've done a thread search, and I hope this hasn't been asked already...

When the NPPD went to the Laundrie home the first time, they were denied entry to the home and handed a lawyer's business card.
Under the Community Caretaking Doctrine, couldn't the police have entered anyway to see of Gabby or Brian were there?

2021 Florida Statutes, 937.021 Missing child and missing adult reports.—
"Additionally, no court order is required for police to conduct a welfare check. As long as the officer has reasonable grounds to believe that an inhabitant in a residence is endangered, they can legally enter the premises. Law enforcement is given this power under the Community Caretaking Doctrine, a judicially created exception to the warrant requirement of the Fourth Amendment."

But did they have grounds to think she was endangered at that time? Apparently she didn’t live at that house at the time of their trip, based on the Rose story last night, and so was she an inhabitant? If they said she wasn’t there and stayed out on the camping trip while he came home, not sure they could go in looking?

 

[cady]

It is. MOO Still not "felony-murder", though it is a murder which is a felony, lol. MOO I obviously am not doing a good job. Maybe google is better. MOO

I didn't spend much time but I was disappointed to see that it isn't murder 1. Should be, because it's pretty obvious that it's premeditated. Not saying there are no cases of murder 1, but I didn't see any. Just more misogyny , in my opinion, because the majority of people who die of premeditated strangulation are, of course, women. Probably hard to prove the intent, though. JMO

 

[10ofRods]

But she wasn't killed during the commission of that felony. She was killed prior to it. I didn't intend to make this complicated. Sorry about that. Maybe this will clarify it better. Murder is a felony that requires intent. BL can try to argue there was "no intent to kill" and seek a lesser charge (manslaughter, depraved heart, whatever). But, there are certain felonies (violent, mostly) where if you are committing them and someone unintentionally ends up dead, it doesn't matter if you intended to kill them or not. You can get charged with murder. Not manslaughter - voluntary or involuntary, or depraved heart, etc. The crime you were in the process of committing is enough to capture it as murder. That's "Felony-Murder" (an unintentional killing occurring during the commission of a separate, violent, felony). Not sure if that makes sense. BL won't be on hook for felony murder because GP was not killed in the commission of those felonies and those felonies are likely not of the class for which felony murder would apply anyway. If he is charged he will be charged with some degree of murder - which is a felony, and where it goes from there is anyone's guess at this point. MOO JMO IMO

Oh - well then, you haven't been reading the speculation here. Yes, people are speculating that her death was more or less an accident - an unintended outcome of some other, less serious crime.

As for how big something has to be, to be a felony. in Wyoming (whose laws also matter here, as Federal Jurisdiction may include crimes not specifically in Federal statutes, as long as they are state statutes in the place where the crime was committed).

I really have no clue if Wyoming has a felony murder rule.

But I am very much intending to address the issue of Gabby not being fully strangled (woke up later, then dies of something else or is killed by someone else), or Gabby's death is unintentional (she's pushed down by BL and the rocks that hit each side of her neck are somehow wedged against her arteries; thereby he didn't really murder her).

Indeed, in some jurisdictions, attempting to strangle someone or assaulting them in a manner such as to cause serious injury is itself a felony. Often a pretty serious felony.

So even if, as some claim, BL walked off toward Colter Bay not knowing that Gabby was dead, having merely intended to push/shove/smoosh her again...I think he's got a felony in there somewhere.

I can't really discuss my theories about what frame of mind (in BL's mind) could produce any such outcome, hopefully the patient reader will think of those, as it is interesting to do that exercise.

I also don't believe she was unconscious in 10 seconds, but that's a different post.

 

[customCF]

The point of the book Into the Wild was that he did not survive and barely knew what he was doing. It's actually quite scary how clueless he was. Edit - to further explain, Chris McCandless trapped himself on the wrong side of a raging river while living in a school bus in Alaska. He had no food and no way to fend for himself. In desperation he accidentally ate some bad berries and died because he did not have the skills or knowledge to survive. If BL is smarter, he is in a house somewhere eating food from a grocery store.

Sad part is that not far down the river was a bridge that Chris apparently had no idea was there

 

[MyBelle]

It is. MOO Still not "felony-murder", though it is a murder which is a felony, lol. MOO I obviously am not doing a good job. Maybe google is better. MOO

Ok, I did google. In Wyoming, strangulation IS considered felony murder if the victim dies.

The matter becomes much worse if the victim died as a result of the alleged crime. In this instance, the prosecution may pursue a homicide charge against the defendent, which can mean either manslaughter or murder. Manslaughter involves a violent crime where a defendant kills someone else in the heat of passion or due to reckless actions. In contrast, murder must involve some level of malice or premeditation, meaning it was planned.


Both of these charges can lead to a significant amount of prison time, including the potential for life in prison or the death penalty with murder.

If You Are Accused of Strangulation, It Can Lead to More Serious Charges | Blogs by Steven Titus & Associates, P.C.

 

[MassGuy]

I think strangulation is an incredibly violent murder that isn't instantaneous. jmo

That's not the point of the OP.

They are saying this does not meet the definition of felony murder, as the murder did not occur during the commission of an applicable felony.

For example, if I rob someone at gunpoint and the gun goes off unintentionally, I may be charged with "felony murder."

This very well may meet the definition of first degree murder, but that's not the discussion.

 

[blackbeary]

I think the "Stan" text alarmed Gabby's mother, because it meant that her phone did have service and was receiving calls and voice mail going unanswered.
Moo

 

[Bekind89]

Oh - well then, you haven't been reading the speculation here. Yes, people are speculating that her death was more or less an accident - an unintended outcome of some other, less serious crime.

As for how big something has to be, to be a felony. in Wyoming (whose laws also matter here, as Federal Jurisdiction may include crimes not specifically in Federal statutes, as long as they are state statutes in the place where the crime was committed).

I really have no clue if Wyoming has a felony murder rule.

But I am very much intending to address the issue of Gabby not being fully strangled (woke up later, then dies of something else or is killed by someone else), or Gabby's death is unintentional (she's pushed down by BL and the rocks that hit each side of her neck are somehow wedged against her arteries; thereby he didn't really murder her).

Indeed, in some jurisdictions, attempting to strangle someone or assaulting them in a manner such as to cause serious injury is itself a felony. Often a pretty serious felony.

So even if, as some claim, BL walked off toward Colter Bay not knowing that Gabby was dead, having merely intended to push/shove/smoosh her again...I think he's got a felony in there somewhere.

I can't really discuss my theories about what frame of mind (in BL's mind) could produce any such outcome, hopefully the patient reader will think of those, as it is interesting to do that exercise.

I also don't believe she was unconscious in 10 seconds, but that's a different post.

Ridiculous! You do not accidentally strangle a person. That is preposterous. Jmo

 

[Bekind89]

I think the "Stan" text alarmed Gabby's mother, because it meant that her phone did have service and was receiving calls and voice mail going unanswered.
Moo

I wonder why those calls from Stan bothered BL so? Hmm. Jmo