2009.09.30 Baez Motions-the missing Memos of Law/Exhibits

[wallflower67]

I know the duct tape issue will get disected in court...but for me, on a jury, I wouln'dt count non-matching duct tape as reasonable doubt! I have rolls of duct tape all over the house because I can never find a roll when I need one. So I go out and buy more!

 

[3doglady]

Don't know if this'll work, but trying to post a pic of the Anthony home posters.....I don't see duct tape, tho.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/crime/orl-caylee-anthonypics-photos,0,5614814.photogallery

Photo #70 btw. See also #89 and #90, *97, #123.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news...me-scene-photos-121808,0,7133183.photogallery

Here's another good photo #58 at the above link.

Pic #76 in the first gallery is back of CA's toyota. Looks like poster could be taped on with duct tape but I can't tell for sure.

 

[MissJames]

Basically, we have two FBI statements from two separate tests. The first statement had to do with the adhesive. It stated that the two pieces of duct tape (crime scene vs gas can) had similar adhesive indicative of either being in the same production run or maybe even the same roll.

Then we have the FBI statement from tests of the fibers (cloth) part of the duct tape. Their statement there is that the fibers are microscopically different (and they do not qualify that statement based on environment, etc.) and do not appear to be from the same roll.

Now, that means the tape can be from the same production run.

IF GA had more than one roll and it was bought in a two-pack (which wouldn't be out of the question) - that could explain the two findings and still tie it back to the Anthony home.

George and Cindy are going to have to be questioned about this tape,if they weren't already.SA's depo's ,maybe? Can't wait to hear what they said.

 

[3doglady]

I'm going to answer my own question. Looks like the 4 Runner name instead of duct tape on CA's car. There is a video of the Blanchard Park run in between CA and LP that shows the back of GA's truck. The poster is taped on but no clear enough for me tell with what kind of tape.

 

[RR0004]

The motions from the defense are a push for the prosecutors to show their hand and further explain their theory of the case.

Yup...they want an advance look-see. The State still is holding much IMO. They have time. BTW...where is the defense's stuff?

 

[RR0004]

I know the duct tape issue will get disected in court...but for me, on a jury, I wouln'dt count non-matching duct tape as reasonable doubt! I have rolls of duct tape all over the house because I can never find a roll when I need one. So I go out and buy more!

I agree...6 months later...who knows what happened to that one roll...but the chances of having rolls of the same brand...that sticks in my mind more than anything...that and the fact that it was stuck to poor Caylee.

 

[affinity]

wow. Quite a lot of "discussion" in that motion (to do away with DP) about an ACCIDENT.

 

[RR0004]

There's that one comment, made by Lee, which I think he made on July 15, 2008 when he learned about Caylee being missing. He said, "Is this like that other time." I know that phrase has been dissected here, but with so much happening in this case over the last 14 months, I can't remember all the specifics. But that phrase sticks out - "Is this like like that other time."

It leads one to think that at some previous time, Casey lost Caylee. Perhaps she was shopping at a mall and left Caylee behind in a store, while she left and went to another store?

Cindy had sought counseling and had been advised by the counselor to seek custody of Caylee. There had to have been a basis for a counselor to suggest Cindy seeking custody..........a pattern of behavior on Casey's part that made her unfit to retain custody of her child.

That's exactly what I was referencing. Could fit!

 

[Nore]

But hasn't it already been stated that this is all explanable due to the weathering and erosion? The fibers are gone from the tape on Caylee's skull because they were outdoors, under water, in hurricanes, etc. and are therefore not exactly matching the brand new duct tape from the A's? There is a lot of talk in the duct tape match thread, and this may be better off over there, too.:blowkiss:

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A bit O/T but there is a good read on Casey/Caylee on Blink.I dont know how to copy urls.

 

[tasylshari]

wow. Quite a lot of "discussion" in that motion (to do away with DP) about an ACCIDENT.

Agreed, Affinity. Also, can't wait to hear the defense explain away how that super rare duct tape that the Anthony family also owned accidentally ended up covering the mouth and nose of Caylee.....amidst all of the other mountain of circumstantial evidence.

Shoot, I wish I could be on the jury!!!!!!!!!!

 

[skygirl]

I recognize that the inability to definitively state that both samples came from the same roll could be of benefit to the defense. When giving testimony regarding forensics, the opposing party is always going to "force" for lack of a better word one to state that "nothing is 100%" and that there is always a margin of error. Realistically, NOTHING is a 100%. Is it a statistical improbability? Sure, but each side is going to use it to their own advantage. SO, as much as the defense will argue the tape issue as evidence that their is no match...there is no way to argue that point to 100% accuracy. The SA will be able to cross "forcing" the expert to state that it can NOT be ruled out with 100% certainly. There is always wiggle room. It may be slight, but it exists....the key is how each side argues the point. If this tape issue were turned around.....the defense would have a number of experts doing the same thing. One can never re-create an environment that is a 100% match during testing. There are variables that just can't be manipulated because they just don't know what that tape was exposed to at what time. I doubt that this trial will come down to a piece of tape when there is far more to consider.

I would not be suprised if the Body Farm is doing this experiment as we speak? They have the facilities to replicate it. I know they can't replicate the exact hurricane, elements, ect, 100% as you mention nothing can be 100%, but it can be close!

 

[static]

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A bit O/T but there is a good read on Casey/Caylee on Blink.I dont know how to copy urls.

http://************.com/


btw that is a good article, thanks for that one

 

[cecybeans]

Basically, we have two FBI statements from two separate tests. The first statement had to do with the adhesive. It stated that the two pieces of duct tape (crime scene vs gas can) had similar adhesive indicative of either being in the same production run or maybe even the same roll.

Then we have the FBI statement from tests of the fibers (cloth) part of the duct tape. Their statement there is that the fibers are microscopically different (and they do not qualify that statement based on environment, etc.) and do not appear to be from the same roll.

Now, that means the tape can be from the same production run.

IF GA had more than one roll and it was bought in a two-pack (which wouldn't be out of the question) - that could explain the two findings and still tie it back to the Anthony home.

Great idea about GA doing the five-finger discount to get this at a job site. That just seems way more Anthony to me. And having an environmentally specific duct tape would fit in perhaps with the needs of the client.

 

[MD MOMMY]

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A bit O/T but there is a good read on Casey/Caylee on Blink.I dont know how to copy urls.

Yes it's a must read...and it's what quite a few of us on here thought.

 

[Dear Prudence]

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4246932&postcount=3"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - 2009.10.05 Today's Current News - ***NO DISCUSSIONS HERE PLEASE ***[/ame]

Prosecutors file motion to strike defense's motion to dismiss charges. Say that the defense's motion is legally flawed and not worth the judge's time.

See above link from Sprout for details. Thanks Sprout!

 

[ZsaZsa]

It seems that the Prosecution was not too impressed with the motions filed by Baez.
http://www.wesh.com/news/21207035/detail.html

Legally flawed is what they called it. They say the errors were glaring and fatal!

 

[cyberborg]

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - 2009.10.05 Today's Current News - ***NO DISCUSSIONS HERE PLEASE ***

Prosecutors file motion to strike defense's motion to dismiss charges. Say that the defense's motion is legally flawed and not worth the judge's time.

See above link from Sprout for details. Thanks Sprout!

You would think for something as important as this that they'd thoroughly research and prepare it with i's dotted and t's crossed, unless:

1. They knew this was not going to fly and were just going through the motions (pun intended) on a regular due-diligence cycle to protest,

2. They want to keep the ineffective counsel as a plan B option should they not get a technicality, based on KC's mistrial statement.

 

[Dear Prudence]

You would think for something as important as this that they'd thoroughly research and prepare it with i's dotted and t's crossed, unless:

1. They knew this was not going to fly and were just going through the motions (pun intended) on a regular due-diligence cycle to protest,

2. They want to keep the ineffective counsel as a plan B option should they not get a technicality, based on KC's mistrial statement.

Yes, you would think we'd be seeing their best work. Perhaps we are seeing Prof. Lyon's students' best work

WESH just report that the state's response says the flaws in the motions are glaring and fatal. :laughbounce:

 

[njustice]

This whole duct tape scenario has my mind reeling for several reasons:

a: even if the labs conclusively declared the pieces of duct tape as an "exact" match, Baez would still be calling it circumstantial, because KC's prints were not found on them.

b: The mere fact that he is now making such a big deal out of this duct tape in my mind shows he feels it is significant enough to tie KC to the crime - and if more information/tests come out in the coming days, he won't be able to backtrack on the importance he's given in this piece of evidence.

c: The defense keeps saying "the truth will come out at trial" yet with the thousands upon thousands of pages that have come out since the most recent dump, JB and his crew come out NOW and say there is no evidence to prove she committed the crime. So up to this point, we can only assume JB and the crew haven't been able to find ANYTHING to support their client's innocence. We know all of the evidence is not out there yet, so what gives? Seems sloppy and careless to me.

d: This whole duct tape nonsense seems to be a diversionary tactic designed to pull our thoughts away from everything else looming in the case. What about the Winnie the Pooh blanket she was found with? With no prints on the duct tape, isn't Caylee's bedding from her room just as significant as a piece of duct tape from her garage?

e: and then of course, there is all of the other evidence that we haven't heard a reasonable explanation for yet - the fact that she just randomly abandons her car, that happens to smell like human death to every member of her family. Visits to a missing children's website months before, the fact that Caylee's body shows up in her childhood hangout, countless lies, including lying about a pregnancy that her burgeoning belly can't even keep under wraps, etc, etc, etc.

It just kind of blows my mind JB can think his case is going to be dismissed because they can't find fibers on a waterlogged piece of duct tape that was rotting in a swamp for several months.

 

[Dear Prudence]

This whole duct tape scenario has my mind reeling for several reasons:

a: even if the labs conclusively declared the pieces of duct tape as an "exact" match, Baez would still be calling it circumstantial, because KC's prints were not found on them.

b: The mere fact that he is now making such a big deal out of this duct tape in my mind shows he feels it is significant enough to tie KC to the crime - and if more information/tests come out in the coming days, he won't be able to backtrack on the importance he's given in this piece of evidence.

c: The defense keeps saying "the truth will come out at trial" yet with the thousands upon thousands of pages that have come out since the most recent dump, JB and his crew come out NOW and say there is no evidence to prove she committed the crime. So up to this point, we can only assume JB and the crew haven't been able to find ANYTHING to support their client's innocence. We know all of the evidence is not out there yet, so what gives? Seems sloppy and careless to me.

d: This whole duct tape nonsense seems to be a diversionary tactic designed to pull our thoughts away from everything else looming in the case. What about the Winnie the Pooh blanket she was found with? With no prints on the duct tape, isn't Caylee's bedding from her room just as significant as a piece of duct tape from her garage?

e: and then of course, there is all of the other evidence that we haven't heard a reasonable explanation for yet - the fact that she just randomly abandons her car, that happens to smell like human death to every member of her family. Visits to a missing children's website months before, the fact that Caylee's body shows up in her childhood hangout, countless lies, including lying about a pregnancy that her burgeoning belly can't even keep under wraps, etc, etc, etc.

It just kind of blows my mind JB can think his case is going to be dismissed because they can't find fibers on a waterlogged piece of duct tape that was rotting in a swamp for several months.

Great post! On Geraldo's show last night JB was talking about the DNA on the duct tape from the FBI lab tech and how that means the FBI contaminated "possibly the most important piece of evidence in the case." I think he might try to get it dismissed as evidence. It is the most important piece of evidence because it shows Caylee did not die accidently. No matter what scenario anyone comes up with, I will never believe that the duct tape was anything other than a malicious act of violence and hatred. Without that duct tape JB could argue death by accident or natural causes.