2010.06.28 - Kyron's Dad files for divorce and restraining order

[passionflower]

There is a hearing scheduled for 9:00 am that is estimated to last 3 hours, then another hearing at 1:30 pm estimated to last for 2 1/2 hours. When motions are filed, the moving party is asked to estimate how much time they think it will take, and that is where the estimate comes from.

Thankyou!!!!
I thought I was going nuts!
What a divorce this will be..............5.5 court hours! YIKES!!!

 

[loves2bmom]

There is a hearing scheduled for 9:00 am that is estimated to last 3 hours, then another hearing at 1:30 pm estimated to last for 2 1/2 hours. When motions are filed, the moving party is asked to estimate how much time they think it will take, and that is where the estimate comes from.

Thanks Gwen...where did you find that...or can't you say?

 

[loves2bmom]

Thankyou!!!!
I thought I was going nuts!
What a divorce this will be..............5.5 court hours! YIKES!!!

This isn't even the actual divorce either....I'm so glad I'm not a lawyer.

 

[gwenabob]

Thanks Gwen...where did you find that...or can't you say?

It is from the case docket on OJIN--Oregon Judicial Information Network. You have to have a subscription. There isn't a lot of info, just what's been filed, and when, and clerk notes, etc. You can't read actual pleadings.

 

[gwenabob]

This isn't even the actual divorce either....I'm so glad I'm not a lawyer.

Correct. These are just motions to decide the direction the divorce will go. Bifurcated or not? Where did the money come from to pay Houze? Stuff like that. The actual divorce is yet to come.

 

[Mylou]

I'm confused, why would either of them have armed guards and who's paying for that? Did TH & KH hire armed guards?

TH had death threats. The guards may come with her attorney, being as he takes the threats seriously, Im sure he would want to guard his own life as well as his clients going into court.
KH, Im not even aware he had any guards, guess it would be whether or not he thought his own life was in danger.

 

[Billylee]

TH had death threats. The guards may come with her attorney, being as he takes the threats seriously, Im sure he would want to guard his own life as well as his clients going into court.
KH, Im not even aware he had any guards, guess it would be whether or not he thought his own life was in danger.

So, as far as we know of these are not "court appointed" guards. It's some guards they hired themselves or their attorneys did? I was just curious if the courts had appointed guards for them when they go out. Terri or Kaine either one.

 

[Mylou]

So, as far as we know of these are not "court appointed" guards. It's some guards they hired themselves or their attorneys did? I was just curious if the courts had appointed guards for them when they go out. Terri or Kaine either one.

I really don't know if they were hired or appointed.

 

[debs]

Given all the press crushing in for a soundbite or paparazzi style photo, they're probably assigned by the courthouse just to get people to and from the courtroom.

 

[gwenabob]

I doubt it. Oregon just doesn't have the kind of money to hire guards for civil proceedings. If she were appearing for a criminal hearing, AND there were bona fide death threats, which I have seen no evidence of, then maybe the court would allow a couple deputies to accompany them.

 

[Aedrys]

TH had death threats. The guards may come with her attorney, being as he takes the threats seriously, Im sure he would want to guard his own life as well as his clients going into court.
KH, Im not even aware he had any guards, guess it would be whether or not he thought his own life was in danger.

I still think it's overkill. If someone wanted to hurt Terri, they would have done it by now, or they are waiting for her trial to attempt something. All there is words threatening her. No crazy person has shown up at the courthouse and threatened her. And this is about her divorce. Now if they want to worry about threats, that will probably happen at her eventual trial. That's where emotions are going to run high, not at her divorce proceedings. I think it's wasted taxpayer money to have guards all around her right now. I think Houze is trying to make these threats bigger than they actually are to show what kind of suffering his client is going through. It's nothing more than an act that he hopes benefits her in court some kind of way.

And btw, I don't think KH needs protection either, unless he needs protection from TH. Maybe that's why there's so many guards, to keep them from attacking each other. Lord, the last thing these divorce proceedings need is extra drama. They should be done quickly and quietly, IMO.

 

[GrainneDhu]

I was a tad bit confused, with her last appearance, with a CDL lawyer at a divorce proceeding. That would of cost her money to have Houze there, when not needed, unless he is truly working pro bono. Her text to MC might have been in the context of, "If I had to pay for him , it would cost me $350,000."

It may be different in Oregon but in my state, criminal defense lawyers don't really work by the hour; the client pays an upfront fee that the lawyer estimates will cover the cost of the defense.

If the retainer is more than the actual cost of the defense, the lawyer keeps the difference. If the retainer is less than the actual cost of the defense, the lawyer eats the difference (because, if found guilty, it is highly unlikely the client will be able to pay any more).

My guess is that Mr Houze's retainer is not actually $350K; that he charges somewhat less but that with the cost of court filings and expert witnesses, the total cost of the defense could go that high.

 

[desquire]

So, as far as we know of these are not "court appointed" guards. It's some guards they hired themselves or their attorneys did? I was just curious if the courts had appointed guards for them when they go out. Terri or Kaine either one.

The guards were just county sheriff's deputies who are responsible for courthouse security. (see http://www.katu.com/news/local/101511664.html

Most courts have standard procedures for security in high media/public interest trials or proceedings that include special accomodation and escort for participants and witnesses. I don't think we're really seeing anything other than SOP.

 

[Mylou]

The guards were just county sheriff's deputies who are responsible for courthouse security. (see http://www.katu.com/news/local/101511664.html

Most courts have standard procedures for security in high media/public interest trials or proceedings that include special accomodation and escort for participants and witnesses. I don't think we're really seeing anything other than SOP.

Thanks for the link, I missed it when it was reported. I'm now making a mental note about links and facts in my pea brain . I now understand why I see so much about links here, it seems very easy to get misquided quickly with speculation and rumor.

 

[passionflower]

Any news sourse on this?
I can not find anything outside WS on this yet.
Should be almost over by now???

 

[gitana1]

Perhaps one of the lawyers can answer this (or anyone else)? - is attendance mandatory for both TH and KH at this hearing?

Unless testimony from a party will be offered, or unless the court orders their presence, the parties do not usually have to attend such hearings.

or did lawyers get it postponed?
Will this be another shock........like stop the divorce???

I will wager my cats that Kaine will not drop the dissolution of marriage action.

New things have been added to the calendar since I first looked this morning. It's possible they will add it later today. ? Does anyone know if they are under any obligation to post it?

Many of the on-line case access sites of the court are notoriously slow. They are not obligated to keep those sites up to date.

Bunch reiterated that the $350,000 that Rackner suggested in court papers that Terri Horman paid for Houze was inaccurate and that Terri Horman didn't borrow any money to cover her attorney costs.

He suggested that a third party paid Houze and that the court will have to determine if the payment constitutes a marital asset.

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/08/terri_moulton_horman_creates_s.html

I just re-read this article, and found it interesting. I'm assuming the third party that paid Houze would be TH's parents, because I don't know who else it would be. However, why would the court have to decide if that's a marital asset. It wouldn't be, if they paid Houze directly, would it? Interesting statement that I hadn't seen before.

If the fees were a gift, they would not be a marital asset. But Kaine is seeking proof of where the funds came from. Did they come from an undisclosed marital asset or debt? Also, the main argument in fees cases is usually whether the parties should bear their own fees or whether one party should pay all or some of the other parties' fees. If one party has more funds than the other, from whatever source, that could bear on the court's attorney's fees award decision. But tomorrow, the issue is not who pays whom, or whether they bear their own fees, but rather, whether TH must disclose to KH the source and amount of fees she paid to her attorneys.
That will be the argument.

When I read that, I thought it was Kaine's attorney attempting to get her hands on whatever monies Terri had acquired, since she is still legally married to Kaine, and therefore money to one spouse could be considered marital assets. Although, now I think about it, aren't gifts to either spouse exempt from such a ruling? In any case, it would seem that Kaine opens himself up to the same rule, regarding his salary.

I dunno. I only imagine we'll get bits and pieces regarding any of it.

You are right. Gifts are considered the separate property of the spouse receiving it and are not to be divided. However, the court considers all assets and income the parties have, from whatever source, whether separate or marital, when deciding child support, spousal support attorney's fees and sanctions issues. Kaine's income and assets, would be considered as well as TH's.

 

[gitana1]

Any news sourse on this?
I can not find anything outside WS on this yet.
Should be almost over by now???

It's set for tomorrow!

 

[Jo in Calif]

It may be different in Oregon but in my state, criminal defense lawyers don't really work by the hour; the client pays an upfront fee that the lawyer estimates will cover the cost of the defense.

If the retainer is more than the actual cost of the defense, the lawyer keeps the difference. If the retainer is less than the actual cost of the defense, the lawyer eats the difference (because, if found guilty, it is highly unlikely the client will be able to pay any more).

My guess is that Mr Houze's retainer is not actually $350K; that he charges somewhat less but that with the cost of court filings and expert witnesses, the total cost of the defense could go that high.

I was under the assumption that a retainer fee was what was charged up front, to retain the lawyer. As the case moved on and the retaining fee got used up than the client had to start paying for the representing as the case moved along, of course no case in a criminal manner has started yet.
How on earth could a CDA know how much a case is actually going to cost, wouldn't a lot of them go broke practicing like that?

 

[Billylee]

Desquire thanks for the answer about TH's attorney's fees. I probably should have asked it under the legal thread. But here's what I don't get, if a 3rd party paid Houze directly, would that be considered a gift to TH, even though it never passed through her hands? So if I pay a bill for someone that's considered a gift to that someone?

 

[passionflower]

It's set for tomorrow!

Thanks so much.......I'm a day ahead of myself all day!!!
Even writing a check today I wrote 10/07/2010 WTHeck????