2010.06.28 - Kyron's Dad files for divorce and restraining order

[kathryann]

Originally Posted by gardeness
Kaine thinks this money is his? Talk about dishonesty--he would know if she had this money. I'm sure he has his suspicions on where the money came from (her parents/family?). This is nothing more than harassment, IMO.


I don't think Kaine thinks the money is his at all, I think he wants to know where a person like Terri, who has no job, was able to come up with $350,000.00 when she needed money from him to move. I think he has the right to know if she had that money where it came from, selling photos of Kyron? A movie deal? A book deal? MFH Plot? Kidnapping? If I were him I would do that same thing.

 

[TxLady2]

Just when I think it can't get any weirder........... it does.

 

[PortlandMama]

Exactly. So the best of the best ... which lawyer is that, exactly? It's hard to say that among the group of top lawyers, there is a best of the best, IMO.

My point is that, because of your Justified and Very Real Fear, you would be willing to pay Any Amount You Could Get Your Hands On ... more than anywhere near Necessary ... because you'd hire the lawyer you'd heard Good Things about on the news.

And that lawyer just might be willing to take advantage of your Very Real Fear by charging you through the nose ... not because he is Worth It ... but because He Can.

I hope all the ...'s and capitalizing isn't getting on your nerves. I'm just having fun doing that because I Am Weird. Plus, I finally spent the day doing things that had to be done, instead of being here, and what do you know! I missed real news! That's enough to make anyone weird, eh?

Ah, Pooh-speak! You are a Collie After My Own Heart. :blowkiss: Never fear, Roughly, your capitalizing doesn't get on my nerves.

I have been out of town with no access to news since Thursday night, so I have a lot of catching up to do! And a lot of mosquito bites to tend to...

 

[nas212913]

Respectfully snipped by me for space.

I would not feel bad if such a person failed to even try to defend themselves and get some kind of visitation with their child, at the least. I would assume, in the absence of even an attempt at a defense, that there was a good reason why her child was taken and she was forced to move, etc.

Sorry, I know this was posted a ways back, but I just got home.

I think, and I'm sure you'd agree since you have experience in law, a lot of people do not understand what their rights are. Unless you've been through the family law system, there are a lot of things you don't know you're entitled to.

When she called 911 regarding a custody matter, the police didn't come out to her house because a custody matter is a civil matter, having nothing to do with law enforcement. I bet the operator told her that. She probably hung up the phone and felt defeated and felt like there was nothing she could do. This was done the Saturday before he filed his RO/dissolution.

There is no custodial interference if there is no order set forth by the court. If he's on the birth certificate, there was no custody order put in place, no one has more rights to the child then the other.

Also, on Monday when the order was filed and he was given temporary custody, because an RO is a temporary order until a permanent one is ordered by the judge, it clearly states she had no visitation. What should she have done? Walked into the courthouse and held it up with a gun? Burst through judges chambers and demanded visitation? At the time, she had no attorney. Last time I looked, she wasn't educated for a law profession. How should she have attempted to change the visitation? She probably had no idea she could.

When a DVI is filed, nine times out of 10 the abuser is not allowed to have contact with the child(ren) if the child(ren) remains with the victim. When they go before a judge, they state their case and visitation is ordered or denied. I thought that was pretty standard in most states.

If she didn't fight right away, maybe she didn't know she could. Maybe, after she hired her attorney, he said to her, "don't worry about that now, we'll fix that later".
Laws are set-up for self-help. Anyone at any time can go to the court house and pay the filing fee and open a case. Print the documents off the internet, fill them out, present your ID to a notary, and boom-done!
But not everyone in this country knows or understands that. People don't know you can use a law library in the court house for free (depending on location) to do research. People hire attorneys so they don't have to stress about motions or getting a case thrown out because of a technicality.

Now, I'm not saying anything about her guilt or innocence because, quite frankly, I have no clue. Maybe she doesn't want custody of Baby K. Maybe she's on Valium because she's distraught over losing Baby K, who knows.

 

[sofia76]

I really don't think Terri got 350K from selling Kyron. While children are priceless, they are not being bought/sold for that amount of money. Not even close!!!! There are at least 2 too many zeroes on that number. =(

 

[azmama]

I haven't read this whole thread yet, but wanted to comment. I haven't posted this before because I don't like to talk "hear say" and I think that is a common sentiment on this board.

However, since this is being discussed, I spoke to a friend of mine last week who lives in the area (we haven't spoken in many years and I had no idea that she lived so close or I would have called her for info before)... Anyway, she said it is common knowledge up there that TH gave her rights to any $ to be made via media (book, movie, etc) to the lawyer as a retainer/payment.

I can not verify this, which is why I didn't mention it here before, I did talk with a mod about it. I don't know, but it makes sense. It's a good bet, the lawyer has the "possibility" of that future revenue and since he is a defense attorney, no publicity is bad publicity, right?

All moo of course! Now I have to read the whole thread!

 

[gwenabob]

SBM

If the retainer came from TMH's parents, can KH petition to find out how her parents raised that money? Her parents cannot be considered common marital assets, surely.

My speculation is that if it is her parents, they've mortgaged their house and possibly cashed in some of their retirement funds. But what if they have pictures of Kyron from visits to their house and made a deal to sell them to the National Enquirer; would KH be entitled to this knowledge?

Keeping in mind that copyright for a photograph belongs to the photographer unless otherwise specified and all that.

That is true, but if she were selling pictures of a child, I would think one of the child's parents would have to sign a waiver allowing the publishing of the photo. Terri is not Kyron's parent.

 

[GrainneDhu]

Oh goodness lol. I didn't even notice that; I thought you were making a specific point

I see what you mean.

To be perfectly honest, I'd have NO idea how to find the best of the best, regardless of cost --- so I better keep my nose clean, eh?

Ask everyone you run across who they think the best criminal defence lawyer in the state is and keep a list.

Then look up their record; as a rough rule of thumb, any defence lawyer who wins more than 10% of their cases is either incredibly good, incredibly lucky or has some other advantage.

What sort of cases has this lawyer handled in the past? Anything that roughly resembles your own? How does this lawyer fare on appeals?

Check their previous cases and see how they handled the media, what their approach was in court, etc. If you're comfortable with all that, you've found your lawyer.

All this assumes, of course, that you have a fair chunk of money you can spend on a good lawyer. If you don't, you get whoever is assigned to your case. May the ghods have mercy upon you.

 

[gwenabob]

Typo, maybe? Maybe she meant $35K?

The law firm I work for recently defended a man in a multi-million dollar lawsuit. It was in arbitration--didn't even go to trial. We did not hire expensive experts. Our client paid us around $100k, plus over $10,000 in costs like deposition and copying fees.

I have no doubt in my mind that Houze, who is among the best criminal defense attorneys in the state, asked for and got $350,000. I also think that if by some tiny sliver of luck she is not indicted and someone else confesses, Houze will give her back the money he did not use.

Someone else commented earlier that they didn't think Kaine's legal bills should be very much because all that his attorney has done is file divorce papers and a couple of motions. Well, I beg to differ. I work in a law firm and know how they bill. This is a very complicated divorce, so I really doubt she is charging him a flat fee. She will be billing him by the hour and they bill everything. Kaine calls and talks for 7 minutes? He just got billed .2 of an hour, and I bet she charges a minimum of $200 an hour. Legal assistants and paralegals bill for their time too. Usually about $100 hr. I do not know for a fact, but I would not be surprised if she asked for a $10,000 retainer up front from Kaine. Wouldn't surprise me at all. This divorce will be spendy, and attorneys need to get their money up front because judges won't always let them out of a case if their client doesn't pay the attorney's bill.

As always, JMOJMOJMOJMO>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>to infinity and beyond!

 

[ZL27]

I'm of the belief that Kaine thinks Terri sold rights to the Kyron Horman Story.

I think $350k is Brangelina-baby-photo type of money, not missing-kid-story-kind of money. And only a reputable company would have that kind of money, and I can't imagine they would open themselves up to that kind of backlash.

I'm 100% sure it's money from her parents - either they mortgaged their home or raided their retirement fund. IF the amount is true, which I still have serious doubts about.

 

[gardeness]

Originally Posted by gardeness
Kaine thinks this money is his? Talk about dishonesty--he would know if she had this money. I'm sure he has his suspicions on where the money came from (her parents/family?). This is nothing more than harassment, IMO.


I don't think Kaine thinks the money is his at all, I think he wants to know where a person like Terri, who has no job, was able to come up with $350,000.00 when she needed money from him to move. I think he has the right to know if she had that money where it came from, selling photos of Kyron? A movie deal? A book deal? MFH Plot? Kidnapping? If I were him I would do that same thing.

bbm

Neither do I~it was a rhetorical question, lol.

 

[RoughlyCollie]

How does this lawyer fare on appeals?

The appeals issue is tricky. The vast, vast majority of criminal cases are upheld by the appellate courts.

It is a good idea to look up a trial lawyer's cases and ask the attorney who handled the appeals, if there are any, what he thinks about the trial lawyer. You might get an honest response, and it would be from someone who actually does know how well the trial lawyer handled the case.

 

[Kat]

I haven't read this whole thread yet, but wanted to comment. I haven't posted this before because I don't like to talk "hear say" and I think that is a common sentiment on this board.

However, since this is being discussed, I spoke to a friend of mine last week who lives in the area (we haven't spoken in many years and I had no idea that she lived so close or I would have called her for info before)... Anyway, she said it is common knowledge up there that TH gave her rights to any $ to be made via media (book, movie, etc) to the lawyer as a retainer/payment.

I can not verify this, which is why I didn't mention it here before, I did talk with a mod about it. I don't know, but it makes sense. It's a good bet, the lawyer has the "possibility" of that future revenue and since he is a defense attorney, no publicity is bad publicity, right?

All moo of course! Now I have to read the whole thread!

I can't remember the exact details but IIRC it was either KC or her parents that were reported to have made upwards to 250,000 dollars for just pictures of Caylee. (I haven't seen it debunked as rumor but I may have missed it).

That's not the same as "rights" to a movie or etc, but there is a sum of money that can be made if one strikes the right deal with the right person in these high profile missing persons cases. JMHO and scant recollections.

 

[CarmelEyesD]

Maybe KH doesn't even really care where she got the money, or about getting any of it-but wants the world to know how much it was to buy the attorney, as part of the plan to keep up pressure. He would also know everyone would be speculating as to why Houze was charging TH so much.

 

[crystalgenie]

I think TMH is going to be indicted. Any grand jury in the state of Oregon would indict her. Too much public pressure and she's already been tried and convicted in the court of public opinion.

I also do not believe that this is applying any sort of pressure to TMH. If she is the type of person who would do this to a child then I doubt she's going to be confessing over some minor bs.

Kyron is important not how much money TMH is paying her attorney or where the money came from.

I wish KH would keep the spotlight on his missing son and not a soon to be nasty divorce.

 

[BeanE]

I really think we have to think about this.I have no doubt there is no way in my turnip patch she or Kaine could get a loan in less than 30 days on their best day. No way...and the way this is so highly publicized, who would give either of them a loan...if there is anyone on this forum that could get $350,000 in less than 30 days...email mail me....cause I could sho use one right about now!

You're absolutely right, kappy, my dear friend. Kaine has to question this.

1) it could be connected to what happened to Kyron in some way and if so, he needs to know that, and this is a great way to find out.

2) if it sets him up for a large financial obligation, he NEEDS to know that, because it would definitely impact his ability to care for the baby, and for Kyron if he comes home. Also his ability to hire a PI to work on Kyron's case, should he wish to do so.


There's no harrassment here. This is a simple, basic, and necessary action on Kaine's part. It will be quickly taken care of.

:cow:

 

[Calliope]

At least when I viewed it last night (the Scribd document attached to the news article), the date and time for Terri to appear was left blank. But the judge had signed off on the motion.

 

[scotslass]

Am i the only one who does not think this is a huge amount of money for her legal fees? She hired a high profile criminal lawyer not a divorce lawyer. I recently had to see an employment lawyer (contract details) they (law firm) charge between $350 - 425 /hr depending on the lawyer(jnr,snr etc)

(disclaimer: i only needed to pay for a few hours of their time Phew).

Also I really don't think it is a surreal amount of money for family to get a hold of in her defence maybe if it were a million or so.. I see this as much less than the average price of a family home if you can get a mortgage why not a loan? perhaps her retirement funds, stocks, shares, equity in the marital home has all been put forth as funds I'm sure she would have access to more than the amount requested. Also we have no idea what the bank balances were/are in that family perhaps Terri was left money by family members (grandparents etc). They were living on one income and have seen no reference to that being a struggle. (well until Th requested money from KH to move etc that is)

I'm also sure KH wants to know what resources she is tapping into financially they are still tied together. I'm sure he doesn't want all their assets spent on Legal fees especially if they are not his. They whole going back and forth on money issues between them does not surprise me..

JMHO


ETA: I do find it odd that she retained a criminal lawyer and paid out that much money without being charged, I recall in the Tori Stafford Case LE told the mom she was their prime suspect, although publicly stated she was not. She however did not go out and hire a criminal attorney..(btw she looked incredibly guilty but was not) I think she must have hired him to defend her on the MFH plot since LE had set up a sting etc.

 

[citigirl]

I think that Kaine is also trying to get her in trouble again with her attorney. I am going to guess Houze told her not give out this information. And, if it is a lie, the attorney will see she is lying even while her every move is scrutinized. She is a loose cannon, for sure. I wouldn't want her for a client...

 

[Melanie]

I really don't think Terri got 350K from selling Kyron. While children are priceless, they are not being bought/sold for that amount of money. Not even close!!!! There are at least 2 too many zeroes on that number. =(

So true -- one couple tried to sell their baby for $25.00 at Walmart. And that was just this month!

http://nancygrace.blogs.cnn.com/2010/07/02/cops-couple-tries-to-sell-baby-for-25-at-walmart/

IMHO I continue to say that this has to be a rumour. $350K? Where would she get that? And it's atty/client priviledge. Who disclosed this amount --

MOO

Mel