2010.06.29 -- LE says TH not POI nor suspect

[CASH]

tt is possible that they still don't have enough evidence to convict her of a crime, even though they may have enough evidence to suggest she was involved in something that stinks. This could be why Kaine can't stand the thought of being around her anymore. And who could blame him IF that is what he has really come to learn.

All of this gives me hope that that they think Kyron may still be alive somewhere. They either want to put the pressure on her so badly that she cracks (taking her child could do that) or they want someone else (an accomplice?) to think that she is going down unless they come forward. The fine line they have to walk is not getting the accomplice so scared that they panic and kill the child.

 

[tlcya]

It could be that something incidental was discovered during the investigation -- something not directly related to Kyron's disappearance, but something so deeply hurtful to Kaine that he couldn't bear to stay in the same house with Terri any longer and, in his pain, he retaliated by filing for divorce.

I could easily see that as a possibility...IF there weren't a TRO on behalf of the baby involved. That just goobers it all up. :crazy: I guess it could be taken a step further to say that, if the above happened, Terri might've threatened harm to herself and Kaine feels it's unsafe for the baby to be around her.

I'm running out of benefit of the doubt options for Terri. The above was my best shot at making a case for it. Still, I'm not completely convinced that LE didn't mean exactly what they said -- that she's not a POI or suspect. Maybe they are being truthful, even if it is SOP not to name someone prior to arrest.

We need a "pulling-my-hair-out" emoticon. ::insert teeny, tiny Kojak here::

Thank you. Well put. I was thinking the same thing in regards to the pending divorce being something not necessarily directly related to Kyron's disappearance but perhaps peripherally. Picture this, the woman you love and staunchly supported from day one is the last one to see your child. Her whereabouts that day cannot be confirmed to LE satisfaction because she has not been an "open book". LE slowly begins piecing together the timeline of her day and certain facts come out about her activities that while perhaps not directly related to Kyron, cause Kaine to reevaluate who he thought this woman was. Perhaps he blames her - "If she hadn't been in such a rush to sneak of to whereever to meet up with whoever, she would have made sure Kyron arrived in class."

Perhaps it is something more nefarious and more directly related to Kyron's disappearance, time will tell.

Like you, I have tried from the getgo to give Terri the benefit of the doubt and am still trying, til LE gives me reason not to, but I am finding it harder and harder in the face of this united family now fractured.

As to the TRO - it may be that Kaine is concerned that in the face of all the scrutiny, questions and suspicions and now with him seperating himself from her, she may become desperate enough to run off with the baby. If she is suffering some post partum issues, that could be another reason Kaine would not want her in a position to harm or take off with the baby unsupervised.

I pray LE resolves this soon, for everyone involved sakes.

 

[JBean]

Be careful to not start discussing each other . Read your post and decide if you are discussing the case or other members. If you are discussing other members, you shouldn't be.

thanks

where this post lands is random.

 

[darlin gal]

The difference between suspect, accused, and perpetrator can get a bit complicated, and these terms are sometimes misused, especially in the press. When law enforcement personnel believe that someone has committed a crime without any solid proof, that person is considered a suspect. Suspects may have behaved unusually, left trace evidence at a crime scene, and so forth, but they have not been positively identified as the actors who committed the crime. Suspects may be temporarily taken into custody for questioning, and they may also be asked to submit samples of hair, fibers, and so forth to see if they can be matched with evidence found at the crime scene.
If a suspect is formally brought to trial, he or she becomes the accused. The accused is entitled to an assortment of rights which are not available to a suspect, in recognition of the fact that the accused needs to be able to mount an effective defense in court. If the outcome of a trial is a guilty verdict, the accused becomes the convicted, and goes on record as the perpetrator.
Police sometimes use the term “person of interest” to describe a suspect. This term is used in part because of the negative associations with the word “suspect.” Many members of the general public confuse suspects with perpetrators, and when it is announced that someone is a suspect in a case, the public may assume that this means he or she actually committed the crime. A person of interest, on the other hand, is simply someone the police would like to have a conversation with.
The use of the term “suspect” to describe someone who may be involved with a crime dates back to the late 16th century. Since then, the legal system has changed radically, and there are many steps between being listed as a suspect and being convicted of a crime. Suspects are also entitled to certain legal rights in many nations such as the right not to implicate themselves in a crime, and typically they can only be held in custody for a brief period of time before they must either be formally charged or released.


http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-a-suspect.htm

 

[Ash]

I believe LE is waiting to make an arrest because of the other kids. It has been clear from statements made by LE very early on TH was always the prime suspect. For her to just snap with no reason at all doesn't make much sense. So we must know what else was going on within the family and determine if the kids are safe with Kaine. It still would not surprise me if there was a history of abuse to all of the kids within the family by both parents and that both will ultimately be arrested and convicted on various charges. Time is not an issue in this case.

 

[Calliope]

There have been many posts here and all over the net asking if she's NOT a POI, why doesn't LE just say so?

Well, they did, and now some peeps think they must be lying? I just don't get it.

snipped and bbm

Exactly.

And they've claimed that if only LE would do so, they (these anonymous posters) could then direct their energies toward other possible suspects and scenarios.

 

[Calliope]

I believe LE is waiting to make an arrest because of the other kids. It has been clear from statements made by LE very early on TH was always the prime suspect. For her to just snap with no reason at all doesn't make much sense. So we must know what else was going on within the family and determine if the kids are safe with Kaine. It still would not surprise me if there was a history of abuse to all of the kids within the family by both parents and that both will ultimately be arrested and convicted on various charges. Time is not an issue in this case.

bbm

Why wouldn't time be an issue?

If kyron is alive, then of course time is an issue in getting him back safely.

If he isn't, then evidence that could be used to convict degrades as time goes by.

 

[JBean]

Be careful to not start discussing each other . Read your post and decide if you are discussing the case or other members. If you are discussing other members, you shouldn't be.

thanks

where this post lands is random.

reminder

 

[JBean]

The difference between suspect, accused, and perpetrator can get a bit complicated, and these terms are sometimes misused, especially in the press. When law enforcement personnel believe that someone has committed a crime without any solid proof, that person is considered a suspect. Suspects may have behaved unusually, left trace evidence at a crime scene, and so forth, but they have not been positively identified as the actors who committed the crime. Suspects may be temporarily taken into custody for questioning, and they may also be asked to submit samples of hair, fibers, and so forth to see if they can be matched with evidence found at the crime scene.
If a suspect is formally brought to trial, he or she becomes the accused. The accused is entitled to an assortment of rights which are not available to a suspect, in recognition of the fact that the accused needs to be able to mount an effective defense in court. If the outcome of a trial is a guilty verdict, the accused becomes the convicted, and goes on record as the perpetrator.
Police sometimes use the term “person of interest” to describe a suspect. This term is used in part because of the negative associations with the word “suspect.” Many members of the general public confuse suspects with perpetrators, and when it is announced that someone is a suspect in a case, the public may assume that this means he or she actually committed the crime. A person of interest, on the other hand, is simply someone the police would like to have a conversation with.
The use of the term “suspect” to describe someone who may be involved with a crime dates back to the late 16th century. Since then, the legal system has changed radically, and there are many steps between being listed as a suspect and being convicted of a crime. Suspects are also entitled to certain legal rights in many nations such as the right not to implicate themselves in a crime, and typically they can only be held in custody for a brief period of time before they must either be formally charged or released.


http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-a-suspect.htm

But does a "suspect" that is not detained nor arrested have any more or less rights in Oregon? That is the question. I do not think it is a legal term in and of itself.

 

[raeann]

I think the confusion here about the "suspect" term is that being named one does not GIVE someone certain rights. EVERY person already has and ALWAYS has those rights. Legal measures such as the Miranda act are meant to insure that those rights are protected and not infringed upon. A suspect does not suddenly receive more rights than anyone else has, they just do not LOSE any rights simply by being named a suspect or even by being arrested. They are entitled to all due processes of law----as we ALL are.

jmo

 

[kbl8201]

i dont know. i dont really care who's involved anymore.

all i want is for them to find kyron and bring who's responsible to justice. and right now both still look far away

this case is totally draining me and i cant sleep

 

[grandmaj]

http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/37992992/ns/today-today_people/


Listen to what Dan Abrams says about the POI issue.

 

[shelbar53]

I think everybody had their suspicions about TM in the beginning but LE needed to keep KM calm so they could build their case around TM. So LE convinced KM and TM that they didn't suspect her, however deep down KM had his doubts and that's why we saw the very restrained body language and the non supportive talk of TM at the press conference.

yesterday LE sat BM, SD and KM down and outlined their case. It made KM so sick he immediately filed for divorce.

I do think LE kept the family in the dark until they had their case. I feel an arrest is coming today.

LE even had TM convinced that she wasn't a suspect. TM should be fully aware that things are not looking good for her.

FWIW, I think TM hated the little boy and layed in bed at night thinking about how to commit the perfect crime. Wouldn't surprise me that she did a few trial runs in the past year or so. She probably had passive aggressive behaviors with him...love him one second the be nasty to him the next ... not physically but verbally. I don't think anyone else is involved. She is probably more devastated that her daughter was taken away from her.

 

[Indianagirl]

Him filing for a divorce doesn't really make me think she is guilty. They could have had cracks in their relationship and the strain and stress of Kyron being missing may have been the straw that broke the camel's back. The fact that he took the 18 month old with him could be a red flag.

IMO, filing for divorce at this stage can only mean Kaine has strong reason to believe Terri is responsible for Kyron's disappearance.

Let's pretend we know for a fact Terri had nothing to do with Kyron's disappearance, would Kaine really be filing for divorce at this point in time :waitasec:

No matter what Kaine has learned as a result of this investigation, IMO the only logical reason for him to file for divorce is because of the evidence against Terri. Anything else could be handled at a later date.

 

[rosiebean]

Respectfully, BBM and not directed at you, darlin -- just bouncing off your post. IMHO, there's a big difference for LE to actually name a suspect or POI as opposed to saying a person is NOT a suspect or POI.

LE's actions have made it seem that TH is a POI and they have been so tight-lipped in this case. There have been many posts here and all over the net asking if she's NOT a POI, why doesn't LE just say so?

Well, they did, and now some peeps think they must be lying? I just don't get it.

Personally, I've never said that if she's not a POI, then why doesn't LE say so...I've merely said that I look to LE for my cues in what to believe. Given what I've seen in other cases (where LE says they don't have POIs a day before they arrest someone who was obviously a POI), I take LE denials about that subject with a grain of salt.

These are what I can tell from LE (culled from their statements, actions, and other information released from SM's friends/family):

They have said that everyone in the family is cooperating.
They released a flyer specifically asking about SM's actions on June 4.
They have said that SM isn't a POI.
They have given her more than one LDT and have questioned her extensively, and despite their assurances to her that she's not a POI, she's feeling picked on, for lack of a better word.

Here's what the BioDad, BioMom, and SF have done/stated in the last 24 hours:'

BioDad served SM with divorce papers, took their daughter, AND filed a RO against her.
BioDad, BioMom, and SF released a statement--pointedly without SM being included (she didn't even know the statement was going to be released)-- saying that they have been fully briefed about the investigation and they support where it's going.

Given that, I'd say that despite LE's saying SM isn't a POI, she IS indeed involved in what they are investigating.

While the divorce could be linked to something outside of the investigation, the fact that the papers were served within fifteen minutes or so of the released statement from the other three parents tells me that it IS somehow related to the current investigation.

I don't know if SM is responsible, or if she was involved and is withholding information or WHAT exactly. But IMO, LE hasn't 'cleared' her. AND the other parents have cut her out of their circle related to the investigation in a very public manner...I just can't see that happening over personal, non-Kyron related issues between her and Kaine, IMO.

 

[Kimster]

Be careful to not start discussing each other . Read your post and decide if you are discussing the case or other members. If you are discussing other members, you shouldn't be.

thanks

where this post lands is random.

Bumping up. Memorize this post.

 

[WholeLottaRosie]

I don't believe for one minute that she is not a POI. And seriously, even if their marriage was ont he rocks, wouldn't you stay with the person through this just because? Where are all the SM supporters now?

I am still one.

I have been pondering this one. If something, Gods forbid, happened to my child, and, I learned that my spouse was cheating, there is no way I would want him with me through it. I mean if LE gave me proof. The person I would trust most, or should trust most betrayed me, he would be gone. And I would do whatever it took to keep him away from me and my other kids. What an awful thing, you have child missing, and learn your spouse is unfaithful. Maybe you had doubts before, maybe not. But for it to come out in the investigation would be too much for me.

MOO

 

[1Chump]

Maybe they believe Kyron is being held somewhere by an accomplice of TH. Maybe they are trying not to jeopardize Kyron's safety? I can't quite make those pieces fit, but it just crossed my mind. Probably not, but just maybe.

I'm sure they don't have enough to convict her. If they had enough to convict her, they would arrest her. Boy, I don't know, I'm just as clueless as everyone else.

I can't imagine at this point that Kaine does not believe that TH is in some way responsible for Kyron's disappearance. Either by direct act, or negligence. Otherwise, I agree, he would not split up their home so that Kyron could come back to a disaster.

Maybe LE suggested that Kaine get little KH out of there to try to gain some leverage on TH to get her to talk. As in…"If you want to see the baby again, you're going to have to spill some beans, Sister."

It's worth pointing out, that LE won't grant a restraining order to keep a mother away from her child without some significant evidence. That means Kaine has some reasonable supportable evidence to be able to request that he keep little sister KH and TH apart.

There is no evidence required for the restaining order at the time it is ordered. It is based on his word and his word only. He does not even need to state any abuse, just that he was afraid she would hurt the baby or him. That fear is continuing.

He only has to provide "evidence" of abuse if she contests the restraining order. Then the Judge will "hear" the case and his evidence to decide if the restraining order is warranted.

http://www.oregon.gov/OJD/docs/OSCA...010FAPAUpdate/Packet1/InstrucsOBTAIN-3-10.pdf

In divorce cases, it is quite common to get these types of restraining orders for immediate custody of both the children and the family residence. Until we read the actual restraining order, we have no idea what it means. If he did not attach any evidence to the restraining order, then we only know what he says, not that it is necessarily true.

IMO, most likely this restraining order is based on her emotional state because of Kyron missing/investigation. In a nutshell, he is afraid or knows that she is incapable of taking care of herself which makes her incapable of taking care of an 18 month old baby and puts the baby in harm's way.

 

[WholeLottaRosie]

I just don't get it. I'm racking my brain out trying to get it but I don't. If my child was missing and I found out ANYTHING about my husband, affair, abuse etc. I would likely kick him out of the house but to actually go to a lawyer and start divorce proceedings would be the last thing on my mind. My brain would be 10000% occupied with my missing child. You could always get a divorce later.

I have never been divorced, but, I believe you might sometimes have to file sooner than thought to protect assets, to protect custody, etc.

 

[Emma Peel]

This AM I woke up with the Zanny the Nanny thing in my head. I don't know why exactly...


It might have been because Thursday all the photos were published WITHOUT a photo of Terri.

Then Friday Desire & Kaine were sure Terri was working as hard a the rest of them to bring Kyron home.

Later Friday People Magazine hit the stands with her father given a 50/50 chance of arrest.

Then Terri's father joins her mother over the weekend at Terri's house for support, even after that magazine article quote.

Then, IMO, the divorce papers were well-in motion over the weekend, to have been filed, recorded & served Monday.

Then Teri's friend's quote from a Monday later article last night when her friends were at her house and the friend said Terri didn't understand Kaine's actions and believes that LE is still on her side. (paraphrased).

Followed by the LE statement that they wouldn't comment on a personal Horman development and Terri was not a person of interest and she was not a suspect.

******************************************

I wonder what Terri mean by LE being "her side"?
What does LE mean - is there another suspect or person of interest?

Could Terri have her own actual Zanny, or maybe her Zanny is a figment of her imagination...

Has she claimed to have left Kyron in another's care?

If so, why was she waiting at the school bus for him to come home?

If so, why did she come forward with where she left him long before the searching began?

How can there be a "side" of this situation from Terri's point of view, such that LE is on "her side"?

Is she blaming the other parents and coloring herself Kyron's hero somehow?


Pass the Excedrin, please. :crazy: