2011.04.01 Frye Hearing (DISCUSSION THREAD) - PM edition

[A_News_Junkie]

I found my can.
It says: Febreze Air Effects Air Refresher. "Limited Edition" Apple spice & delight.

Ingred: Odor eliminator, water, fragrance, non-flammable natural propellant, quality control ingredients. No CFC's and contains NO Phosphates.

A Caution: about over use of concentrating or inhaling the contents can be harmful or fatal. Help stop 'inhalation abuse'. More info visit .. www.inhalant.org.

Darn it, THWARTED AGAIN.
<----------- puts self in time out!

 

[A_News_Junkie]

What amazed me was CA being ever so uncertain of the date of the depo, but ever so clear that she was on new medication. GMAB!!!

EPIPHANY -- I guess we know now, why her and her attorney had a meeting with JB last Friday.
What do you want to bet, JB said just tell about how you obstructed justice and tampered with evidence -- they won't charge you now. Remember, back in depo days, that was a REAL concern.

(I promise to stay in my time out corner now!)

 

[darnudes]

So basically this trial is never going to happen, and KC will end up walking because the State can't hold her in jail forever. She'll be out until the State can afford to prosecute her, because the defence has been allowed to suck the taxpayers dry while delaying any real work in this case.

Anyone see a motion coming up for illegal detention based on time in county?

 

[BigFatMommyDog]

Darn it, THWARTED AGAIN.
<----------- puts self in time out!

come come now junkie - don't be so hard on yourself. Regardless of the delivery system, don't you think that if Febreeze interacted with other household cleaners or items to produce chloroform that a good many folks would be found, at very least unconscious, or expired in their teen son's bedroom clutching a bottle to their chest?

 

[LancelotLink]

I looked at her depo. Thank goodness they index them. The only mention of medicine or medication was when LDB asked if she had eaten, was under any influence of alcohol or drugs and she said just my prescription medication. She didn't say NEW. She didn't say she JUST started it.

TY. The only mentions of Febreeze was pages 306,330, and 335. Mentioned was "some" Febreeze.
Of course, this was when she was trying to stop all those nasty obstruction and tampering rumors....

 

[BigFatMommyDog]

Anyone see a motion coming up for illegal detention based on time in county?

they waived speedy trial and are responsible for the delays - heck she's not even on the top 10 in OCJ in terms of time

 

[logicalgirl]

EPIPHANY -- I guess we know now, why her and her attorney had a meeting with JB last Friday.
What do you want to bet, JB said just tell about how you obstructed justice and tampered with evidence -- they won't charge you now. Remember, back in depo days, that was a REAL concern.

(I promise to stay in my time out corner now!)

Yeah - sure - I'm thinking her attorney sat there and said no way Jose - this woman is in enough trouble - she's going to start being just a teensy bit more truthful to see if anyone will ease off the ramifications of all the carp she's come out with over the last two years......

 

[pip]

Anyone else find it suspicious that George decided to move the car out of the garage and close the trunk when police got involved? Trying to hide the smell factor, imo. I would also venture a guess to say it was Cindy who directed him to move it, and that it was done when cops were not at the house. They both knew what the smell was. Why would they put it in the garage to begin with? Wouldn't you want it outside airing out? Wouldn't that be more effective? Not if you don't want the smell of decomposing body in the front of your house. They were hiding it in the garage and Cindy was going to work her magic cleaning powers on it. I think they told the cops about the car only out of fear that they had already smelled the odor. And I have to wonder when and what they REALLY told YM about the car. I would think they would have been on that car like white on rice with that particular piece of info.

 

[darnudes]

You know, Darnudes, you bring up a very good point, and after reading your question, I thought long and hard about it....and this is the best I can come up with...

Several years ago, my Aunt was SA down in Key West and she tried several child molestation/rape cases. She told me that a common ploy by defense attorneys was a game of "chicken"....with overwhelming evidence, the defense would refuse and hold out pleaing all the way up to trial date in the hopes the victim or family would "chicken" out of putting a child through testifying...

With that in mind...the only scenario I can come up with for delays by DT in this case is.....is it POSSIBLE that there is truth in the speculation that KC and DT are ready to negotiate a plea, but SA continues to say NO WAY...

The reason behind dragging this out in delay after delay is simply a game of "chicken"....? Will SA finally cave and be willing to end this case through a plea deal due to financial constraints, as well as time constraints ( having many other cases to prepare for trial?)????????????????

That certainly is a good theory - I don't see ICA being a part of the negotiation of it as I just don't think there is any way she will plea, there is something going on though. So, what we have so far...

1. Delay start of trial in the hope that there will be no funds available?
2. Delay start of trial in the hope of a better plea deal?
3. Delay start of trial indefinitely(?) in the hopes that witnesses testimony falters down due to length of time since crime committed?
4. Delay start of trial then try a sneaky maneuverer to get ICA out of jail on a technicality of some sort as illegal detention due to trial taking to long? (this is my one and I think it has merit not knowing Florida law, however)

 

[A_News_Junkie]

:denied:

Anyone see a motion coming up for illegal detention based on time in county?

:denied:

 

[logicalgirl]

Anyone else find it suspicious that George decided to move the car out of the garage and close the trunk when police got involved? Trying to hide the smell factor, imo. I would also venture a guess to say it was Cindy who directed him to move it, and that it was done when cops were not at the house. They both knew what the smell was. Why would they put it in the garage to begin with? Wouldn't you want it outside airing out? Wouldn't that be more effective? Not if you don't want the smell of decomposing body in the front of your house. They were hiding it in the garage and Cindy was going to work her magic cleaning powers on it. I think they told the cops about the car only out of fear that they had already smelled the odor. And I have to wonder when and what they REALLY told YM about the car. I would think they would have been on that car like white on rice with that particular piece of info.

Pip - they were probably sitting around in their living room and went "Sniff, sniff - Ph...eee..www! What IS that!! George - get that blanking car out of the garage right now!!

 

[pip]

Pip - they were probably sitting around in their living room and went "Sniff, sniff - Ph...eee..www! What IS that!! George - get that blanking car out of the garage right now!!

They knew how bad it smelled before they even pulled it into the garage! George knew, he had to drive it home with the windows down :sick: And then they put it in the garage??

 

[joypath]

The most maddening of many points: playing semantics!

I have a background (BSMT) in medical technology and served as a generalist (areas of clinical hematology,chemistry including special chem (toxicology & molecular diagnostics),microbiology & mycology, immunohematology (blood bank) & serology and urinalysis). Some MTs sub-specialized in particular areas of interest and then "end up" being called a specialist in the area (chem, micro) and CAN take specialty exams offered by the credentialing agency. SO...I'm admitting I hated clinical chemistry in practice, adored microbiology.....does that make me a microbiologist but negate my chemistry skills & knowledge? (So see why I relate to Dr. Vass!)
My point: the specialists testifying within this area of the Frye hearings have multi-discipline experience & backgrounds, practicing without "heavy ID tags" around his/her necks. The entire field of these Frye hearings involves multiple interactive sciences and for some wacky reason certain legal participants want to "single label" the specialists. NOW, I am NOT speaking on the "scientists" who are commenting on DOG BEHAVIORS since no one so far has declared a degree in ANIMAL behaviorism.

This has been another episode of smoke & mirrors BUT this time, there's quite a bit riding on HHJP's decision!

 

[logicalgirl]

They knew how bad it smelled before they even pulled it into the garage! George knew, he had to drive it home with the windows down :sick: And then they put it in the garage??

Clearly learned something new - smell - really good or really terrible - travels....:floorlaugh:

 

[Joan (Canada)]

In part 1 on WFTV of this mornings hearings there was a side bar. At one point I think I saw Mr. Mason pointing his finger at Judge Baez. The judge cut the conversation and banged on the mike, stood up and said they were taking a five minute recess which turned into at least 10 - 15 min. The judge seemed really pizzed off. My opinion is that mason threatened the judge with appeal issues if they did not let this questioning go ahead. Anybody.......

 

[pip]

All that the A's have hidden over the past 3 years..started with hiding the death-smelling car in the garage. That's just how they roll in this family.. Everything looks good from the outside, but on the inside is a horrendously different story.

 

[Joan (Canada)]

It certainly went downhill from that point on. I am so fearful that the defense is going to drive the court and the state to have meltdowns and makes some serious mistake that could cause a mistrial.

 

[21merc7]

EPIPHANY -- I guess we know now, why her and her attorney had a meeting with JB last Friday.
What do you want to bet, JB said just tell about how you obstructed justice and tampered with evidence -- they won't charge you now. Remember, back in depo days, that was a REAL concern.

(I promise to stay in my time out corner now!)

Do not stay in your corner!

I don't like to say this, but I doubt JB knows what to tell CA. He gets the social jist of it, but not what the Court asks.

He can repeat to where clothes as if you would go to church as he has heard (hopefully) others say that. But, JB has no knowledge to share with CA, GA, LA, or KC, or anyone.

He is a starter lawyer, and sadly, will die before he gets the fame his wishes. He has no idea what to say. He hopes the others will guide him through the oyster hunt, and so far, they DO!

 

[pip]

EPIPHANY -- I guess we know now, why her and her attorney had a meeting with JB last Friday.
What do you want to bet, JB said just tell about how you obstructed justice and tampered with evidence -- they won't charge you now. Remember, back in depo days, that was a REAL concern.

(I promise to stay in my time out corner now!)

I think you're right. A powow with JB, CA atty and CA right before this testimony, yup.

 

[21merc7]

The most maddening of many points: playing semantics!


This has been another episode of smoke & mirrors BUT this time, there's quite a bit riding on HHJP's decision!

Respectfully snipped and bold by me.

As the train outside still exists, yes, real trains on tracks and I still love to hear and feel them go by, it helps sometimes.