2011.05.27 Sidebar Thread

[Stella5]

But we heard the body was in trunk 2.6 days, and outline of a child Caylees size in shape of fetal position was visible. ITA she could have used the freezer AT SOME POINT, but if she wrapped the body in bag (s) and it in freezer right away, the shape of Caylee wouldn't have been present (due to being in a bag) if Caylee was THEN put in the trunk, after being in freezer. KWIM? I think she had the body in the car the 16, 17, part of 18th, then she bagged it due to smell and purging of fluids. Maybe that's why she used the duct tape?

If the duct tape was in such bad condition when they tested it, I dunno how they were able to determine it was placed on Caylees face PRIOR to her death. How can they tell it wasn't 2.6 days later, etc?

Because her mandible was still in tact as if she were alive. If you've ever seen a person die, their mouth drops open almost immediately.

 

[Leila]

You know - I thought I'd missed the announcement and was too embarrassed to mention it:crazy::crazy:
CONGRATULATIONS!!!!

Adding my congratulations to Nurse!

 

[yeknomaras]

sidenote: today I graduated the Cindy M. Anthony School of Decomposition Nursing

I'm fully qualified to take your blood pressure and smell pizza.

I'm really excited for her testimony though.

 

[davehead21]

This is off-topic and I don't know if it's been talked about because I'm not able to keep up 100% of the time. Just out of curiosity, where does the defendant eat lunch?

 

[LolaMoon08]

I agree with that! She is incredibly lazy as evidenced by leaving Caylee only 20 feet from the road. She did back the car in twice, and IMO she was probably going to try to bury Caylee in the yard (maybe under the playhouse?!) the day she borrowed the shovel from the neighbor. That ended up being too difficult for Princess ICA, so back in the trunk Caylee went. I also wonder if she was in the dumpster at Tony's apartment at one point, and she retrieved her along with that bag of trash. There are so many possibilities, but the fact remains that beautiful baby girl was in that trunk deceased.

Maybe the State should take the jury out to Suburban Drive and use that little tape measurer and show them where every single little bone of Caylee's was found. The defense is making it sound like Caylee's entire skeleton was found 20 feet from the road when that is not true. Can't wait for the jury to see just how scattered Caylee really was and all because animals had torn that poor baby apart and scattered her!

 

[Chiquita71]

:sigh: Seriously?

When a thread moves this fast, it might be best to look back and see why someone might be talking about something.

I was referring to the idea that with the way Jose and Casey are that with Mr. Birch to be cross examined by the defense it wouldn't surprise me if Jose wanted to place blame on Simon Birch.

I am sorry for thinking that others felt the same as I, that Roy Kronk and many others have and are being thrown under the bus in this case. I was unaware I was the only one who had been discussing that for a few years as I was unaware none of that had happened in this case.

I see now that I am the only one who "gets" the "joke" that Jose would try to make some kind of "federal case" out of the "fact" that Simon Birch thought he smelled decomp coming from the pontiac sunfire but did not alert LE.

:bow:

I hope this clears things up. I am under an impression from the defense that may be all my own.

Thank you and I am sorry for any misunderstanding.

:cow:

 

[logicalgirl]

I have a question: Jose asked W.Waters if KC "made off with anything" from his house. He said, No. Can the SA now ask that same question of Amy?

Oh Good one!!!! :rocker:

 

[Turnadot]

Cindy and George both smelled that car and didn't call 911 and they knew Caylee had not been seen or heard from in a month. Simon Birch didn't know a little girl named Caylee was missing from her family. He didn't have the same emotional connection as the Anthony's had.

He smelled it. He didn't see anything out of the ordinary and dismissed it. The same way George and Cindy did when they picked up the car on the 15th and they smelled the car when it was completely opened unlike Mr. Birch three days into the car being towed. Cindy and George both dismissed it and went back to work until Cindy was forced by her boss to face it.

It's more alarming that Cindy and George didn't call police right away. More alarming than a man who didn't know what was going on and only got a whiff of the smell when looking into the car from the sealed windows.

It sucks that he didn't call police... but what is done is done. I don't think he did anything wrong.

That's the sticking point for me.

But really, it's not going to matter during deliberations, IMO. Why did he dismiss it? Because he did. Like I said, I wonder why he didn't alert the police to the smell, if he didn't, but I'm not perfect either and I don't always make the right decisions 100% of the time. I don't think Mr Birch did anything wrong. It's just curiosity that's making me wonder.

 

[fifteen89]

I have a question: Jose asked W.Waters if KC "made off with anything" from his house. He said, No. Can the SA now ask that same question of Amy?

I thought of that when he said it too. But JB said it in response to Waters saying he 'trusts everybody until they do something' - to JB that could've suggested to the jury that she took something, so he had to ask.

 

[Marina2]

Not really. If he didn't alert the police, I do wonder why, but hindsight is 20/20. We all wish we could turn back the clock sometimes and have a do over for certain moments.

He comes across like a good person. I'm not calling his character into question. But if a few of us wonder why Mr Birch didn't call the police then at least a few jurors wonder, too. So far Mr Birch is excellent for the State. I really don't think him not calling the police right away when he smelled human decomp is going to matter to the jury during deliberations.

If I were on the jury I'd be curious why he didn't ( if he didn't) call the police, but during the deliberations, I would answer it myself like this: Because he didn't. We all have coulda, shoulda, woulda moments. Hindsight and all that bit.

I agree and, fwiw I think it's inconsequential to the testimony he gave. I even pictured him answering on cross that "Yeah, I've often wondered myself why in the world didn't I call the police when I smelled that". It may very well have been a coulda, shoulda, woulda moment for him.

But, he did put two and two together when he heard the story of Caylee missing and remembered the trash bag in the dumpster. That might have been another coulda, woulda...

 

[tehcloser]

Because her mandible was still in tact as if she were alive. If you've ever seen a person die, their mouth drops open almost immediately.

And that is why I think she put it on her after she died, but before decomp. She wanted her mouth closed.

 

[Leila]

Leila you will love listening to Simon Birch - elegantly clear and concise - he's back after lunch and I'm so looking forward to Baez's cross - yuk yuk - mincement coming up with no birch in it....:innocent:

I heard SB's testimony and I agree, he's very articulate and I love his accent! Looking forward to the rest of his testimony. But I'm going to miss the last couple hours of court today as I have to pick up my grandson after school - 25 miles away, 50 miles round trip.

 

[TonyGatto]

I find it interesting...the focus on Simon Birch not calling police (all in hindsight). It's my experience that people "don't get involved". People go to work everyday and just do their jobs. There are crimes committed all the time and people keep walking, driving. I'm the type to always call the police...and most of us here probably would...cause we're into sleuthing. Have you ever seen a car wreck?. There are those who will stop and help, but the majority are blowing their horns and trying like hell to get around it. And the smell of decomposition does not mean criminality. OK, the defense will score a point or two, but that's about it.

 

[ebedeeb]

I have a question: Jose asked W.Waters if KC "made off with anything" from his house. He said, No. Can the SA now ask that same question of Amy?

Thats the first thing I thought of too...JB screwed up in asking that IMO

 

[fifteen89]

Cindy and George both smelled that car and didn't call 911 and they knew Caylee had not been seen or heard from in a month. Simon Birch didn't know a little girl named Caylee was missing from her family. He didn't have the same emotional connection as the Anthony's had.

He smelled it. He didn't see anything out of the ordinary and dismissed it. The same way George and Cindy did when they picked up the car on the 15th and they smelled the car when it was completely opened unlike Mr. Birch three days into the car being towed. Cindy and George both dismissed it and went back to work until Cindy was forced by her boss to face it.

It's more alarming that Cindy and George didn't call police right away. More alarming than a man who didn't know what was going on and only got a whiff of the smell when looking into the car from the sealed windows.

It sucks that he didn't call police... but what is done is done. I don't think he did anything wrong.

I thought Cindy's call to police said "I found my daughters car today...."

I agree, it sucks that he didn't call police.

 

[logicalgirl]

:sigh: Seriously?

When a thread moves this fast, it might be best to look back and see why someone might be talking about something.

I was referring to the idea that with the way Jose and Casey are that with Mr. Birch to be cross examined by the defense it wouldn't surprise me if Jose wanted to place blame on Simon Birch.

I am sorry for thinking that others felt the same as I, that Roy Kronk and many others have and are being thrown under the bus in this case. I was unaware I was the only one who had been discussing that for a few years as I was unaware none of that had happened in this case.

I see now that I am the only one who "gets" the "joke" that Jose would try to make some kind of "federal case" out of the "fact" that Simon Birch thought he smelled decomp coming from the pontiac sunfire but did not alert LE.

:bow:

I hope this clears things up. I am under an impression from the defense that may be all my own.

Thank you and I am sorry for any misunderstanding.

:cow:

I'm with you on that one Chiquita71 - it seems to be a mantra with the Defense Team - everyone except ICA and I completely understood your comment. Perhaps other posters who are not as familiar with the evidence as we are - are the ones with more questions and needing clarification...:waitasec:

 

[kaRN]

But we heard the body was in trunk 2.6 days, and outline of a child Caylees size in shape of fetal position was visible. ITA she could have used the freezer AT SOME POINT, but if she wrapped the body in bag (s) and it in freezer right away, the shape of Caylee wouldn't have been present (due to being in a bag) if Caylee was THEN put in the trunk, after being in freezer. KWIM? I think she had the body in the car the 16, 17, part of 18th, then she bagged it due to smell and purging of fluids. Maybe that's why she used the duct tape?

If the duct tape was in such bad condition when they tested it, I dunno how they were able to determine it was placed on Caylees face PRIOR to her death. How can they tell it wasn't 2.6 days later, etc?

GRAPHIC ALERT.........sorry
BBM I believe because the tape was on so securely, holding the mandible and hair matte in place it was determined it was placed before or immediately after death. If the body was purging fluids and Caylee was in fetal position, the side of her face against the carpet would already be seeping and if anyone tried to apply tape, it wouldn't have stuck. The skin also slips away from the flesh after death so it's an improbable scenario IMHO.

Dr G will explain to the jury and captivate them IMO.

 

[Linda7NJ]

I so wish the jurors could see Casey when they are not in the room! Animated, bright eyes and quick to smile just chatting away

 

[fifteen89]

I think it would have made a difference in the case as far as evidence goes. IF SB had alerted the police and they investigated the car, and opened the trunk. They wouldn't find a body, but the odor would have alerted LE that something was wrong - perhaps a dead body was transported in that car. I think LE would have gone to the registered owners, GA and CA, and questioned them. If GA and CA were truthful, LE would have learned that although the parents have talked with their daughter, they hadn't seen their granddaughter for more than two weeks.

LE would have a car that was untouched as far as evidence goes. I'm sure LE would have tracked KC down and the story might be entirely different.

Exactly. Thank you!

 

[Turnadot]

I thought Cindy's call to police said "I found my daughters car today...."

I agree, it sucks that he didn't call police.

IIRC, she didn't call about the smell right away. It was that night when she learnt Caylee was missing, she put 2 and 2 together, IMO.