2011.06.13 TRIAL Day Seventeen (Morning Session)

[Oakley]

DiDimond Diane Dimond
I'm not sure this decomp hair banding testimony helps state.1st time ever in court, not conclusive ,kinda confusing 4 #caseyanthony jury


And with that I am going to work. I will be reading you all from there.

DD's quotes are kind of biased, IMHO. I discount them.

 

[Tipstaff]

JB taking Ms. Simms to sidebar says she is HIS babysitter and SHE understands what JP is saying but she isn't allowed to front and center in the questioning of the witness.

Time for Ms. S to get the 'flu'.

 

[GiantPickle]

We could turn this into a drinking game and do a shot each time they go to sidebar. We'd all be hammered by lunch time.

we'd be hammered by the first "special break" hehe

 

[Phoebeb]

I took it to mean Q12 didn't just fall out naturally, or come from a brush or comb, rather it was pulled out of the head with force.

Maybe moving the body and head (while duct tape attached to the hair) would cause the hair to be pulled out...

 

[ahoyhoy]

JMO, but last week was DEVASTATING for the defense, and when they spend all their time arguing THIS--after what we saw & heard last week---it looks very, very desperate.

Lots here have mentioned the JB tactic that EVERY expert for the State, and the cops, and the FBI, and Kronk, and GA, ALL had a vast conspiracy to frame ICA. This has to look ridiculous to scoff at EVERY WITNESS' CREDENTIALS and MOTIVATIONS! JMO

(like somebody goes into such advanced studies about these dry topics for the MONEY & Glamour? Give me a break.)

 

[Mysteeri]

is that what that meant, she pulled out some of caylee's hair??

I think the hair may have been tangled up and pulled out when the body was moved.

 

[Socprof]

PLEASE no more cross from JB I can't take it anymore, please put CM up Please.

I understand. But wasn't it JB that got to the information that this particular banded hair was pulled out? Not naturally shed? That's a big piece for the prosecution and somewhat damning for ICA. Making the state's case, again.

 

[Eidetic]

JA: Just a couple questions sir. The brush like appearance that counsel asked you about that distinguished the Q59 hairs found at the scene of the body and the Q12 hair from the trunk, is that an indicator of more advanced decomposition?
SS: Yes, the hair mass and the brush like appearance is an indicator of further decomposition.
JA: The two hairs that Mr. Baez spent some time speaking to you about that initial examiners included as banding and then excluded what were the environmental conditions in which those two hairs were maintained?
SS: They were both submerged in water for approximately 17 days.
JA: So neither one of those hairs was in the trunk of a car?
SS: That's correct.
JA: The Q12 hair that counsel was asking you about he talked about shed hairs, was Q12 a shed hair?
SS: No. Q12 was an anagen or stretched root hair which would indication some force was required to removed that hair
JA: And counsel correctly pointed out that you see hairs all the time from crime scenes, correct?
SS: Yes.
JA: Over your career would it be a fair statement that you've seen thousands of hairs?
SS: That's fair, yes.
JA: Aside from this particular case, the Q12 hair, have you ever seen a hair with the decomposition band that didn't come from a corpse?
SS: No, i have not.
JA: No further questions.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

I bet Caylee loved kittens.

We were just trying to figure out names for them. Orange one is Cheeto. 2 cream ones. One of them is really feisty. Hubby and I were kicking around names for these two. I'm now going to call the feisty cream one Caylee.

 

[Alabama]

I'm sorry to do this but I'm not home where I have all my bookmarks. Where can I listen to audio only of trial on iPhone? Thanks

 

[Amster]

Should let the jury take a break....ICA needs a stretch and a giggle

 

[LyndyLoo]

I dont think any of DT's jumping up and down about this Root Banding is going to shake the mere fact that only hair from Dead humans show that particular artifact..Yesl, all protein decompose to a certain extent..but it does not form that root banding such as was found on Caylee's single hair found in that trunk!1
As to those two single hairs identified originally as root banding..Yikes any and all studies do have an allowable error rate..and in this study those 2 (out of 600) were disgarded..thus showing 100% of hairs with root band were from deceased human beings!! "Game Set and Match"!!!

Im sold!!

 

[mitzi]

The mock juror gave up and went outside to play with new kittens.

Bad mock juror!!

Heck, I don't blame ya! I just got here a few minutes ago, and to me, this is tedious.

 

[Donjeta]

Why the sidebar? Anyone know?

Talking about the thesis JB referred to?

 

[jane the dood]

JB: "The underlining conclusion... blah, blah, blah"

Underlying, JB... underlying!

It was underlying until he cutted it. Heh heh.

 

[yllek]

I'm not sure saying the hair was removed by some force is the same as implying Casey pulled some of Caylee's hair out. I think it was just a clarification that the hair was not naturally shed. It could have been pulled out in attempting to fit the body in the wheel well or some other time the body was moved and forced into a bag, etc...

JMO...

 

[mombomb]

CROSS EXAMINATION OF STEPHEN SHAW BY JB:

Hair mass and trunk hair - he did not do a side by side. The trunk hair had root material below the band. The hair mass had a more brush like appearance. Speaking of only the root portions - the two hairs were dissimilar.

The thesis he used referred to some of their changes as fraying and darkening and banding closer to the end of the root than in post-mortem banding. They were seeing decomposition in the actual root material. The hair mat did not have much root material remaining.

The difference is obvious between the apparent decomposition and post-mortem root banding. Apparent decomp is an umbrella. Post-mortem banding is a type. Examiners' initial analysis both identified one hair incorrectly. They then realized between themselves they had made errors and their confirmed results corrected that.

OBJECTION BY JA - SUSTAINED.

He does not know if post-mortem root banding is specifically from people who are deceased. If someone says post-mortem root banding, they can't say if it is from deceased.

Examiners had less experience. They were 2 examiners that were not involved in his initial analysis of these hairs.

Research continues on post-mortem root banding. It is a pretty well established discipline, but for the most part based on examination of hairs.

He has never testified in Court on post-mortem root banding. This is the first time.

He had a depo done in this case. Since then, he has submitted this study. He requested approval of that study to be expedited in order for it to be complete for this trial. This was done after the deposition and his reports in this case.

Post-mortem root banding was already valid - primarily based on experience.

Not many studies based on environmental factors on anti-mortem hair.

Cannot say that post-mortem root banding comes from a dead person.

Subjecting hair to different environments can alter the appearance of hair, darkening, to the point that a trained examiner would see that.

Q-12 hair is only one hair. 100 hairs shed a day, most have a club-like appearance. Shed hairs can be transferred. Hairs are at scenes all the time. They can be transfer hairs, including indirect or secondary transfer. A hair left at a crime scene does not mean the person was there. Finding any hair separate from a person's scalp is transfer.

Finding only one hair may indicate indirect transfer.

The hair samples in his study were tested around Quantico. It gets cold there. Climate and heat can increase the rate of decomp.

No further questions by JB.

REDIRECT BY JA:

Brush like appearance in hair mass is an indicator of further decomposition.

The 2 hairs the examiners originally included had both been submerged in water for 17 days - not in the trunk of a hair.

Q-12 was an andegen or stretched root - requiring force to remove the hair.

He has seen thousands of hair during his career.

He has never seen a hair with the decomp band that has not come from a dead body.

RECROSS EXAM BY JB:

This is the first time he has testified on this topic.

Regarding prior thesis - he is familiar with the conclusion.

OBJECTION - HEARSAY -

SIDEBAR #2

RECROSS EXAM BY JB:

Without proper training, environmental effects can cause confusion in determining post-mortem root banding.

The Q-12 hair could have come out by a brush.

REDIRECT EXAMINATION BY JA:

Moving a dead body could have been one of the ways a hair could have been pulled out.

Witness is excused.

 

[Bobbarita]

JA got the last shot in...

 

[okiedokietoo]

JA: would moving a dead body be one of those ways a hair could have been pulled out
Shaw: yes

 

[CalifMomOf2]

Thank You Mr Ashton!!