4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 72

[Nila Aella]

yep. common sense tells us how footprints work, and this doesn't make sense imo I have a few theories, but I was hoping others would have thought about it, too. All I've gotten so far are rote explanations multiple times, but pretty sure the guy couldn't fly, and pretty sure they'd have used better if they had it, so... if you think of anything, pls let me know.

Amido Black is not specific for blood. It also detects some other bodily fluids.
The PCA does mention a presumptive test for blood (not which test or result) and then mentions Amido Black, which the PCA states is a protein stain that detects the presence of "cellular material." page 5

So, it might not have been a print from blood.

JMO

Forensic Science - Amido Black

dps.mn.gov

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/122922%20Affidavit%20-%20Exhibit%20A%20-%20Statement%20of%20Brett-Payne.pdf

 

[iamshadow21]

Probably not that relevant to the whole BK case, but a lot of RA positions are paid just like TA positions. I have funds through my university to pay RAs to assist with my research. It gives the PhD students some much-needed income, allows them to learn from experienced researchers, and often allows them to understand a research method or data analysis procedure they wouldn't have used or understood well otherwise. All making them a more well-rounded researcher for when they finish a PhD program and are looking for jobs. And it's a massive help to the professor, as you pointed out.

My thought with WSU's vague wording (thank you for posting that, by the way!) was that maybe they offer some TA positions and some RA positions (although those might be more ad hoc and not quite as formalized as the TAs based on the wording?) So I wondered if perhaps he could have eventually ended up in an RA position where he wouldn't necessarily be as public-facing (if he was doing online surveys, content analysis, or another method that didn't require face-to-face interaction, as the university would probably be pretty careful with that given the complaints against him).

I suppose we'll never know, and probably doesn't really matter much in the context of this case given everything we know now. I do think if other options were available to him to either self-fund or earn some money through RA work, he would have absolutely been planning to go back to WSU after the Christmas trip to PA, and he could've probably gotten by without ever telling his family he was fired from the TA position. JMO.

I doubt he would have been appealing as a prospect for another position. The issues weren't just that he had problems with his interactions with students. He had multiple altercations with his professor and proved resistant to any attempts to learn from correction or change his behaviour. Front-of-house, back-of-house, either way, he sounds like a nightmare of an employee and a hot mess I wouldn't risk taking on. Not when there were probably other students who were far more suitable also looking for a paid position.

MOO

 

[DizzyB]

I’m not so sure that BK would be devastated by losing his TA position. I have a feeling his lack of self awareness might lead him to conclude that he did nothing wrong, and the administration was at fault.

 

[ag513]

I doubt he would have been appealing as a prospect for another position. The issues weren't just that he had problems with his interactions with students. He had multiple altercations with his professor and proved resistant to any attempts to learn from correction or change his behaviour. Front-of-house, back-of-house, either way, he sounds like a nightmare of an employee and a hot mess I wouldn't risk taking on. Not when there were probably other students who were far more suitable also looking for a paid position.

MOO

Oh yes, I totally agree with you. He would have been an absolute nightmare to have as a PhD student if you were his advisor. The worst students tend to take up far more of your time/energy than the good ones so I'm sure he was a constant nightmare to whomever his advisor was. I know from experience that it is extremely difficult to kick students out of a program (haha, I've tried!), so it seems like someone in that department would have had to take him on or keep him on as their advisee unless his academic performance was so poor that he would be kicked out of the university for his grades.

In terms of whether he would appeal for another position, based on the limited info we know about him, I imagine him to be the type of person to think everything was someone else's fault and he seemed to have very little self-awareness. He probably would've felt justified in asking for another position because to him, the problem was the students/faculty, not actually him or his behavior. JMO

 

[SMK777]

Inside the Idaho Student Murders: Part III

The investigation into the Moscow killings and the manhunt for the alleged murderer was crowd-sourced—for better and worse.

airmail.news

 

[iamshadow21]

I’m not so sure that BK would be devastated by losing his TA position. I have a feeling his lack of self awareness might lead him to conclude that he did nothing wrong, and the administration was at fault.

Yeah, I suspect he was never going back, even without the murders being a factor, if his reaction to being politely told to stop being a creep at that PA restaurant is any indication. Being told off by 70 odd students and being disciplined by faculty - there's no way. His ego wouldn't allow him to return, with all those people knowing. And having lost his TA position? WSU would be dead to him. He'd easily find some excuse. Probably complaining about the curriculum or staff not being up to HIS standards. He'd find somewhere closer to home, or at least far enough away that he thought rumours of his disgrace wouldn't have spread. All speculative now, though. All he's going to be studying for a long, long time are four walls and the Department of Corrections' idea of vegan cuisine.

MOO

 

[Sundog]

(BTW, there is incredible cultural difference between the coasts, and migration from E to W might be objectively difficult, for many. Which of course doesn’t condone being rude or misogynistic or trying to ascertain yourself instead of spreading the knowledge, what BK was expected to do).


I can get the financial details tomorrow, but yes, it seemed to be inexpensive. Also, and I’d like to get people’s opinion, but mine is, TA is not a prerequisite for a Ph.D., merely a way to support oneself if there is no other, such as, indeed, a good summer internship, for example.

You asked for people's opinion on whether or not being a TA is a prerequisite for a Ph.D. It is not. Both my husband and I received full scholarships with a stipend for living expenses for our Ph.D. programs. They were two different universities in two different states (California and Georgia), and we had to agree not to work as both universities wanted their students to graduate within four years (or as close to four years as possible) and so discouraged working (either on campus or off campus) and offered the funding so that students could focus solely on their doctoral studies.

 

[ag513]

I’m not so sure that BK would be devastated by losing his TA position. I have a feeling his lack of self awareness might lead him to conclude that he did nothing wrong, and the administration was at fault.

I didn't see this and basically just posted the same thing about it being someone else's fault!

He definitely lacked self-awareness. I do think that being fired from the position would have to upset his ego in some way, though. He lacks self-awareness, but based on everything we know, I also suspect that deep down he is extremely insecure and his disruptive/disrespectful behavior is a mask for that. JMO

 

[Sundog]

My evolving theory about BK's convo with dad: BK knows he's probably not coming back but there still is a slight possibility in his mind he's gotten away with it. Knows he needs to get rid of the car. Calls dad, says 'I need a better car for winter, this one is bad in the snow'. Dad says, 'I'll come out, help u drive home, and we'll get u an SUV you can drive back'.

<snipped for focus>

IIRC, when BK and his father took the Elantra to a mechanic/garage to have it worked the car worked on when they arrived in PA, there were comments made by BK's father that the car would be making a return trip to Idaho, hence the need to make sure it was in top shape. So the father must have believed at that time that BK would be returning to Idaho, and with the same vehicle they arrived in, the Elantra.

That might not have been BK's plan, but it's what his father expressed at the time.

 

[Sundog]

I found it odd when the father told the officer, "My son is a student at WSU." As if a cop in the Great Lakes Midwest would automatically know the dad meant Washington State.

<snipped>

I doubt this proves anything but Mr. K's lack of sophistication and knowledge of higher education. No wonder he was proud his son was in a Ph.D. program!

I found it quite endearing.

 

[ag513]

Yeah, I suspect he was never going back, even without the murders being a factor, if his reaction to being politely told to stop being a creep at that PA restaurant is any indication. Being told off by 70 odd students and being disciplined by faculty - there's no way. His ego wouldn't allow him to return, with all those people knowing. And having lost his TA position? WSU would be dead to him. He'd easily find some excuse. Probably complaining about the curriculum or staff not being up to HIS standards. He'd find somewhere closer to home, or at least far enough away that he thought rumours of his disgrace wouldn't have spread. All speculative now, though. All he's going to be studying for a long, long time are four walls and the Department of Corrections' idea of vegan cuisine.

MOO

Clearly I do not know BK and so I can't speak for what his actions would be after losing the TA position, but based on knowing some students who seem similar in terms of his behavior, demeanor, etc. (thankfully not murderers as far as I know, though! ) I personally believe he would have returned to WSU almost as an F-you to the faculty who fired him and to show that they can't just get rid of him. It would've been extremely difficult for him to ever get into another PhD program (see next paragraph) so I feel that he would have kept on going at WSU. JMO and I may be wrong.

Without getting too into the weeds, it's not easy nor common to "transfer" to another PhD program at another university. I wrote at length on the PhD application/acceptance/supervisory process in previous threads and it's all extremely different from the processes for an undergrad or master's program. Any university he would try to transfer to would undoubtedly want to speak with his previous supervisor(s) at WSU to find out what kind of student he was before agreeing to take him on. Can't imagine that convo would go very well!

 

[TL4S]

Looking at things as one large picture (in hindsight, of course), BK moving to Pullman and getting a new phone number, as a 28 year old student, might be telling. It has the feel of a "fresh start," which there isn't anything inherently wrong with, but seeing how things sort of spiraled for him from there, it makes me wonder why he needed the "fresh start" to begin with, especially with a new number. The confrontation with students and staff, the troubles with his TA job, etc., don't feel as much like triggers as they do yet another signal of how he was functioning. I can't call them triggers to the murders, even though the timing might appear so, because I think the PCA is suggesting that BK started possibly stalking the King RD residence as far back as August 2022, not too long after he arrived. I'm sure there was a compounding effect with it all, but I'm curious. Why did he need a new phone number?

 

[Sundog]

I'm curious. Why did he need a new phone number?

<snipped for focus>

Some people like to have a phone number when they move that has the same area code as where they live. Other people don't care and would rather keep their current phone number.

Or he may have been on a family plan and moved to an individual plan, perhaps a different carrier.

I don't see this as being a significant factor, but who knows.

 

[al66pine]

I'm not arguing with anybody about response time.
But it was a Sunday afternoon in a small town. Maybe the MPD wasn't at full staffing level.

@Nova Thanks for responding.
And I'm not arguing on that point either.

Thinking about public perception of LE staffing. And misperceptions.

Even w Big City LE agencies, I doubt that multiple detectives instantly materialize at crime scenes.
(Well, except Joe Friday and Columbo.)

BTW, not criticizing MPD in any way, shape, or form.

Not every PD can be staffed up to instantly respond to and flawlessly investigate a quadruple murder, without assistance from state police or FBI. Esp'ly in a city w a seven year no-murder stretch.

 

[TL4S]

<snipped for focus>

Some people like to have a phone number when they move that has the same area code as where they live. Other people don't care and would rather keep their current phone number.

Or he may have been on a family plan and moved to an individual plan, perhaps a different carrier.

I don't see this as being a significant factor, but who knows.

Logically, I know the new phone number is not necessarily suspicious in any way. But if I consider somebody moves halfway across the country (and I know it was for school), potentially begins to stalk a home/people a short time later, and then eventually murders those people, it makes the phone number switch a bit more curious. JMO.

 

[deugirtni]

Piggy backing on the current discussion, another reason not to broadcast bloody footprints: a perpetrator may have thought he didn't leave any footprints or thought he had cleaned up after himself... no need to beg him to discard his footwear.

JMO

Sorry, I am way WAY behind, but... do suspects (and the public) get to know what is in a PCA prior to an arrest? I had thought the publication of the PCA only released after the fact?

 

[CSIDreamer]

I was doing a Google search for something. I didn't find it. What I did find were headlines from all the "experts" dissing Moscow Police before the arrest. Meanwhile, they were just tearing it up in stealth mode.

JMO

 

[10ofRods]

Amido Black is not specific for blood. It also detects some other bodily fluids.
The PCA does mention a presumptive test for blood (not which test or result) and then mentions Amido Black, which the PCA states is a protein stain that detects the presence of "cellular material." page 5

So, it might not have been a print from blood.

JMO

Forensic Science - Amido Black

dps.mn.gov

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/122922%20Affidavit%20-%20Exhibit%20A%20-%20Statement%20of%20Brett-Payne.pdf

It's very hard to think of what other cellular protein-containing liquid it could be. I can't think of any.

Further, I can't imagine that these tireless forensic investigators didn't immediately send a sample to the lab. IMO.

 

[DizzyB]

Looking at things as one large picture (in hindsight, of course), BK moving to Pullman and getting a new phone number, as a 28 year old student, might be telling. It has the feel of a "fresh start," which there isn't anything inherently wrong with, but seeing how things sort of spiraled for him from there, it makes me wonder why he needed the "fresh start" to begin with, especially with a new number. The confrontation with students and staff, the troubles with his TA job, etc., don't feel as much like triggers as they do yet another signal of how he was functioning. I can't call them triggers to the murders, even though the timing might appear so, because I think the PCA is suggesting that BK started possibly stalking the King RD residence as far back as August 2022, not too long after he arrived. I'm sure there was a compounding effect with it all, but I'm curious. Why did he need a new phone number?

Does anyone have any info on the new telephone number? Was it still a PA area code, was he removed from the family plan? Was it part of his way to establish residency, or to get a new phone via a deal offered only to new subscribers? Most people I know hate getting new numbers as it complicates your life-we have so many things established with our numbers, such as authentications for databases and paying bills, not to mention any contacts not knowing how to reach them.It’s not as if there is a forwarding service. Could this have been part of pushing out of the nest toward adulting? Or some weird part of BK’s mind about creating the perfect murder, where he was moving toward changing things like phone numbers, license plates, making him harder to find? I don’t know, it’s all interesting.

 

[Dotta]

Logically, I know the new phone number is not necessarily suspicious in any way. But if I consider somebody moves halfway across the country (and I know it was for school), potentially begins to stalk a home/people a short time later, and then eventually murders those people, it makes the phone number switch a bit more curious. JMO.

Maybe it meant ending old relations with PA and people living there.
No pesky phone calls from them.

Entering a new, exciting stage of life:
- home alone at last
- freedom to put his obsessions/dreams into reality

Or escaping from some problematic people living in home town - his new number was known only to the chosen few.

Or really prosaic reason - like changing the carrier for a cheaper option.

Or something else we have no real idea of.

Phew!
There are sooo many options to choose from

JMO