4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #83

[TL4S]

Back when this came up before: there was mention of a car accident near his apartment. ? if he had to detour around it? I really haven't looked at a map near his apartment to see where this occured and if it relates to the route he took.....

Just hours before the Idaho murders, another grisly scene unfolded outside Bryan Kohberger's window

It's unclear whether the crash had anything to do with the killings or was a coincidence of two bloody crime scenes not far from each other.

www.insider.com

Wow, thanks, I wasn't aware of this.

 

[Boxer]

I think the problem is the optics of the explanation set forth by the defense team---saying they cannot tell the court about BK's whereabouts during the crime, until they go through the entire discovery.

He either knows where he was at that time or he doesn't.

"He either knows where he was at that time or he doesn't."

Yep.

 

[TL4S]

Back when this came up before: there was mention of a car accident near his apartment. ? if he had to detour around it? I really haven't looked at a map near his apartment to see where this occured and if it relates to the route he took.....

Just hours before the Idaho murders, another grisly scene unfolded outside Bryan Kohberger's window

It's unclear whether the crash had anything to do with the killings or was a coincidence of two bloody crime scenes not far from each other.

www.insider.com

According to this article, this accident happened elsewhere. Not sure...

19-year-old WSU student arrested for allegedly running over pedestrians while driving drunk, fleeing the scene

 

[Chloegirl]

According to this article, this accident happened elsewhere. Not sure...

19-year-old WSU student arrested for allegedly running over pedestrians while driving drunk, fleeing the scene

That this pretty much across the street.

Steptoe Apartments to The Grove Apartments Pullman

www.google.com

 

[U.N. Known]

Exactly: that is an absolutely absurd statement- it is ridiculous-- if he has an alibi doesn't anybody believe he would have shouted it from the tree tops- " I couldn't have done this - I was ____________". but nope, his attorney has the gall to actually state they can't tell the court about BKs whereabouts during the crime until they go thru the entire discovery!!!

His not revealing a legitimate alibi (if he has one), and not revealing it, and waiting until the defense reviews all of the discovery, is highly suspicious to me. If I was accused of a crime and I knew I had a solid alibi, it would be the first thing I would tell the detective-- wouldn't you?

I have seen several people use the, "If I was innocent, I would be screaming it to anyone who would listen" or something similar to contrast BK's lack of loud protest to indicate guilt. Innocence and loud protestation are not mutually exclusive. There is also the simple matter of BK speaking only to his attorneys. Considering that the crime happened at 3-4 in the morning, it is not surprising that BK, even if not guilty, does not have an obvious alibi.

I read the additional time request to mean that he has provided an alibi to his attorneys, but does not have the means to prove it. IMO, they want to use some part of the collected evidence to corroborate the alibi he provided to his team.

 

[U.N. Known]

For those of us not familiar with the "standing silent" option in response to a criminal charge it seemed unusual, but the Judge in this case made it clear that it is not something mysterious and he was frustrated that the media made such a big fuss about it when it is fully acceptable and within the confines of the law.

I don't know what percentage of criminal cases involve defendants who "stand silent" and if they are mostly related to pleas following grand jury indictments, but it would be interesting to find out. Also, are there certain kinds of charge that lead to this plea option more than other kinds of charges, etc.

I found his teachable moment very interesting. It also may have been a not-so-subtle look into his thoughts on whether the media needs unfettered access to information i.e, without the gag order.

Here, they had first-hand access to the information, but rather than use it as a opportunity to explain a bit of law to the masses, chose to speculate and sensationalize.

 

[Nila Aella]

According to this article, this accident happened elsewhere. Not sure...

19-year-old WSU student arrested for allegedly running over pedestrians while driving drunk, fleeing the scene

That this pretty much across the street.

Steptoe Apartments to The Grove Apartments Pullman

www.google.com

Yes. Just North of his apartment complex. The first article I linked states that one entrance way to his apartment complex was blocked off that night...that he had to go a different way taking four turns to exit. Don't really know where it was blocked off though or what route that forced him to take (plotted on a map) or whether that relates to the Nevada Street capture. JMO

 

[wary]

I found his teachable moment very interesting. It also may have been a not-so-subtle look into his thoughts on whether the media needs unfettered access to information i.e, without the gag order.

Here, they had first-hand access to the information, but rather than use it as a opportunity to explain a bit of law to the masses, chose to speculate and sensationalize.

Didn’t one of the attorneys use it as a teachable moment for the judge—that if people hadn’t been so tightly gagged, someone could have explained to the media how ‘standing silent’ works.

MOO

 

[U.N. Known]

Didn’t one of the attorneys use it as a teachable moment for the judge—that if people hadn’t been so tightly gagged, someone could have explained to the media how ‘standing silent’ works.

MOO

I don't recall that, but that 2nd hearing was long and I skimmed it...

Though, if one of them did, IMO it would have made him or her look worse, not better. Considering the MSMs penchant for noting their investigative skills and their importance in informing their readers/viewers I'd think that they would not want to tell a judge that they did not know nor attempt to learn the definition of and significance of standing silent.

 

[maskedwoman]

I have seen several people use the, "If I was innocent, I would be screaming it to anyone who would listen" or something similar to contrast BK's lack of loud protest to indicate guilt. Innocence and loud protestation are not mutually exclusive. There is also the simple matter of BK speaking only to his attorneys. Considering that the crime happened at 3-4 in the morning, it is not surprising that BK, even if not guilty, does not have an obvious alibi.

I read the additional time request to mean that he has provided an alibi to his attorneys, but does not have the means to prove it. IMO, they want to use some part of the collected evidence to corroborate the alibi he provided to his team.

That is certainly a fair assessment. "I was home asleep", might be 100% true but it would suck as an alibi. Although, being stubborn, I still feel that if he had what everyone likes to call an "iron clad" alibi - "I was working out with my best friend and it was just us and the attendent from 4-5:30", or "I was training with the track team and the other 20 guys will tell you I never left practice" - then it seems logical to me that he would have said so instead of letting this train just keep on going. I'm probably wrong, but I just can't let it go yet.

I would still love to know what his real, immediate, unrehearsed reaction was to being arrested. Was it really "Has anyone else been arrested?" Because, to me, that suggests consciousness of guilt. Kind of like being told your wife was murdered and your first question is "do you have any suspects yet?" instead of "OMG are you sure it's her!?!" Or reporting your husband missing and referring to him in the past tense the whole time.

 

[Orange Tabby]

Didn’t one of the attorneys use it as a teachable moment for the judge—that if people hadn’t been so tightly gagged, someone could have explained to the media how ‘standing silent’ works.

MOO

Yes, I posted about that very point last night. It was the media attorney Wendy Olson.

4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #83

[I’m not sure if I’ve properly linked to the post, alas.]

 

[TL4S]

Yes. Just North of his apartment complex. The first article I linked states that one entrance way to his apartment complex was blocked off that night...that he had to go a different way taking four turns to exit. Don't really know where it was blocked off though or what route that forced him to take (plotted on a map) or whether that relates to the Nevada Street capture. JMO

I think I was misunderstanding where his apartment was located. The PCA now seems to put him heading towards his apartment at 2:44, maybe? Maybe he went home during those 9 minutes? Except there really wasn't enough time for that? If that's the case, then where was he before 2:44? Am I missing something here?

 

[Twistinginthewind]

Wow, thanks, I wasn't aware of this.

IIRC it was right near his apartment and not in a direction that would affect his travel to Moscow, and it was many hours before the murders.

Oh, now I see the MSM article has been relinked here.

Let me know if this recollection isn't accurate, thanks.

 

[Balthazar]

We know from the PCA he made x 3 passes...he left the area and returned is what I read that as. Between 3.29 and 4.04am. I'm interested in your interpretation of the PCA if it differs from this? Ofcourse we are free to speculate pn why he didn't park and wait at 3.29am, and that has been done on many threads in the case. The camera didn't catch him parking. It caught him driving east past 1122 before parking somewhere else (off camera to the east of the house) Imoo. Most have deduced it must have been in the lot situated above and to the south-east of the front of the house. Moo. All my inferences come from my reading of PCA. Again, would be interested in what inferences you draw from your reading of it? Moo
spelling edit.

I am mainly wondering why the circling and then going over to the area of the Mobil station. If the lights are on, why circle 1122 King Rd 3 times which could draw attention to your vehicle and then leave the area and go over to the area of the Mobil station then come back 35 minutes later? Also, according to Google Maps, it is a 5 minute drive between 1122 King Rd and the Mobil station, so he was doing something else for about 25-30 minutes, then came back to 1122 King Rd. What was he doing?

Strategically, I would think he would have chosen to drive over to 1122 King Rd and lie in wait of the lights going out - maybe on Walenta or in the parking lot of the apartments adjacent to the back yard of 1122 King Rd. It would have made more sense to know exactly when the lights went out, wait 30-45 minutes and then enter the house knowing everyone would likely be asleep by then. But instead, he circled 3 times and then left the area and then came back and went into the house not knowing how long the lights had been out, so he didn't know if it was likely people in the house were still awake or completely asleep. I'm just perplexed by this behavior and the decisions behind it from a defendant who had months to plan this crime.

And I'm also perplexed by what he did while he was over near the Mobil station. He allegedly went down a side street near the Mobil station, so was he thinking of attacking another residence instead? There seems to be a lot of low cost student housing on Hanson, for example and - this is probably just coincidental, but there is a white Nissan Sentra parked at the head of the cul de sac on Hanson.

Anyway, I'm really just ruminating over what was going on that night.

 

[Nila Aella]

I think I was misunderstanding where his apartment was located. The PCA now seems to put him heading towards his apartment at 2:44, maybe? Maybe he went home during those 9 minutes? If that's the case, then where was he before 2:44? Am I missing something here?

You made me look
SE Nevada is South of his apartment and NOT near the accident or his apartment.
This is what I find in the PCA

Camera
2:44 North on SE Nevada at NE stadium way: definitely headed in the direction of his apartment.
2:53 SE Nevada towards 270 : I take that to mean he was now heading away from his apartment possibly toward stadium way over to 270? They don't say that in the PCA though. Noting that this is 9 minutes later than the North on SE Nevada time stamp. I did look up the time it takes to get to his apartment from SE Nevada and Stadium Way and it is 5-6 minutes.

Later in the PCA
Phone
2:42 Phone is consistent with being at Kohberger apartment
2:47 Phone is consistent with being in SE Pullman (this might match above)
2:47 Phone stops reporting.

Hmmmm When looking at the above:
2:42 Consistent with being at apartment
2:44 North on SE Nevada at Stadium Way ------but it is 5-6 minutes away?

edit 2:47 changed matches above to might match above: depending on how far he went before heading the other way
ETA: and if his car was headed North on SE nevada at 2:44 he was not home before then right? He was headed that way from somewhere? Maybe his car and phone were in different places, he went home to get his phone? Not sure about that last part....still thinking on it.
ETC 11 minutes to 9 minutes LOL having coffee now!

 

[jepop]

Yes. Just North of his apartment complex. The first article I linked states that one entrance way to his apartment complex was blocked off that night...that he had to go a different way taking four turns to exit. Don't really know where it was blocked off though or what route that forced him to take (plotted on a map) or whether that relates to the Nevada Street capture. JMO

Nevada Street is way south of his appartment. It's actually NE Nevada Street. It's off NE Stadium way, quite close to that Street's intersecton with Main Street that turns into the Highway that heads east to Moscow,. NE Nevada Street bisects NE Stadium Way. There's no Nevada Street in Pullman. I'm sure the Nevada Street referred to is infact NE Nevada Street. Moo.

 

[jepop]

I am mainly wondering why the circling and then going over to the area of the Mobil station. If the lights are on, why circle 1122 King Rd 3 times which could draw attention to your vehicle and then leave the area and go over to the area of the Mobil station then come back 35 minutes later? Also, according to Google Maps, it is a 5 minute drive between 1122 King Rd and the Mobil station, so he was doing something else for about 25-30 minutes, then came back to 1122 King Rd. What was he doing?

Strategically, I would think he would have chosen to drive over to 1122 King Rd and lie in wait of the lights going out - maybe on Walenta or in the parking lot of the apartments adjacent to the back yard of 1122 King Rd. It would have made more sense to know exactly when the lights went out, wait 30-45 minutes and then enter the house knowing everyone would likely be asleep by then. But instead, he circled 3 times and then left the area and then came back and went into the house not knowing how long the lights had been out, so he didn't know if it was likely people in the house were still awake or completely asleep. I'm just perplexed by this behavior and the decisions behind it from a defendant who had months to plan this crime.

And I'm also perplexed by what he did while he was over near the Mobil station. He allegedly went down a side street near the Mobil station, so was he thinking of attacking another residence instead? There seems to be a lot of low cost student housing on Hanson, for example and - this is probably just coincidental, but there is a white Nissan Sentra parked at the head of the cul de sac on Hanson.
View attachment 428612
Anyway, I'm really just ruminating over what was going on that night.

Interesting thoughts, thanks for sharing. Two things we don't know are whether SV1 (the suspect vehicle) is the vehicle passing near mobil station at 3.45am (not specified in PCA), and the timing between SV1s passes past the residence Imo.

I think there are many possible interpretations re the suspect's state of mind on the night and speculations re how this might have impacted his decision making.Moo

 

[Justice101]

You guys are good researchers!

 

[jepop]

Nevada Street is way south of his appartment. It's actually NE Nevada Street. It's off NE Stadium way, quite close to that Street's intersecton with Main Street that turns into the Highway that heads east to Moscow,. NE Nevada Street bisects NE Stadium Way. There's no Nevada Street in Pullman. I'm sure the Nevada Street referred to is infact NE Nevada Street. Moo.

Whoops, I mean SE Nevada, not NE. Posting same time as @Nila Aella and noticed my mistake. It's easier to remember it as Nevada Street. Ditto for Stadium Way. Moo

 

[jepop]

You made me look
SE Nevada is South of his apartment and NOT near the accident or his apartment.
This is what I find in the PCA

Camera
2:44 North on SE Nevada at NE stadium way: definitely headed in the direction of his apartment.
2:53 SE Nevada towards 270 : I take that to mean he was now heading away from his apartment possibly toward stadium way over to 270? They don't say that in the PCA though. Noting that this is 9 minutes later than the North on SE Nevada time stamp. I did look up the time it takes to get to his apartment from SE Nevada and Stadium Way and it is 5-6 minutes.

Later in the PCA
Phone
2:42 Phone is consistent with being at Kohberger apartment
2:47 Phone is consistent with being in SE Pullman (this might match above)
2:47 Phone stops reporting.

Hmmmm When looking at the above:
2:42 Consistent with being at apartment
2:44 North on SE Nevada at Stadium Way ------but it is 5-6 minutes away?

edit 2:47 changed matches above to might match above: depending on how far he went before heading the other way
ETA: and if his car was headed North on SE nevada at 2:44 he was not home before then right? He was headed that way from somewhere? Maybe his car and phone were in different places, he went home to get his phone? Not sure about that last part....still thinking on it.
ETC 11 minutes to 9 minutes LOL having coffee now!

I think the PCA says his phone was utilising cellular resources consistent with being at his residence at about 2.42am from memory. I don't have the PCA in front of me right now. Moo

I think he was heading north on Nevada at c2.44, crossed over Stadium. Turned phone off at 2.47.Then headed south on Nevada towards intersection with Stadium Way at c2.53. May have stopped for a few minutes between turning phone off and restarting car (speculated). Pretty much the phone data is consistent with the video footage of the elantra when in Pullman. Ditto for the pings and accompanying video footage later that morning when heading into Pullman at around 5.25am. His phone appears to have travelled with his vehicle. Moo