ARUBA - Robyn Gardner, 35, Maryland woman missing in Aruba, 2 Aug 2011 - #10

[vlpate]

Looks as if it's a rock. They have a lot of rocks in the water. jmo

Well yeah, I figured it wasn't really someone's face since it would be the size of a small island.

I just thought it was cool - I'm thinking I might superimpose it onto a piece of toast and sell it on ebay :rocker:

 

[LambChop]

Throw her dress on the rocks? They found her dress on the rocks? I didn't realize they found her dress.

I guess the talk of the front, the back, the side of rum reef and whether or not his pants were wet, has exhausted me so I started watching his interviews again....trying to find clues as to where he may have taken her.

His heading back to Palm Beach, or to an area between there and Baby Beach is as feasible, if not more, than human traffickers taking her.

The witnesses who said they saw him at 4:30 - I wonder, did they look at their watch because that moment was going to be important? How close to them were they? Could they have had the day mixed up with the day before? According to LE, there were no credible or helpful witness statements. The re-enactment didn't include a walk on the levy.

Knowing the geography of the beach as a tourist, and knowing back roads and shortcuts to remote areas are two different things. I don't doubt Giordano, if this was planned, had scoped the island out - probably on trips and on google earth.

Heck, maybe he had someone helping him that he paid off with a promise of more once the insurance money came in. I realize that's a stretch, but it happens all the time.

Trust me. Palm Beach area is like Downtown Disney at that time of night. The whole stretch along there is one giant hotel, condo, etc. right after another on the beach side. On the other side are restaurants, bars, shops, a mall with a theater, you name it, it's there. People are all over the place. There is no place he could have put her body that someone would not have seen him. Lots of activity in that area.

The search area by LE was all in the area of the southeastern portion of the island because that is the timeline they were working with. LE knew he never would have made it back to the hotel and back in time. The search grid is all in the remote area of the southeastern portion of the island that is not populated. No homes back there and only a very rocky dirt road heading up the coast. He could not have gotten far and gotten back in that amount of time. I think they were searching this area because they had good reason to believe he was there.

As for the dress GMA reporter (the woman) in an earlier video said the dress was on some rocks a distance from the towels which she commented "they" thought was unusual. She did not say who they were but I'm thinking LE. This was RG's favorite dress I don't see her tossing it onto the rocks where it might become damaged when the car was right there. Another thing that sets off the hinky meter. jmo

 

[vlpate]

The helicopters fly along the coast many, many times during the day. I think it is highly unlikely they did not look the first night and there are photos of GG standing on the beach with LE pointing to where they were supposedly snorkeling. You can see from the satellite that water is very clear. One picture also showed divers in the water. Until it became too dark to see I would think they would search. I don't recall seeing a report that they did not search that evening.

I believe I stated that it was not confirmed by LE. But the fact remains they did bring in the dogs right after that "rumor" to search the very spot where this took place. And I'm just throwing out a theory here because there is no proof but how did NE get the information about the pet cemetary. It's not common tourist knowledge and I certainly did not know about it all the times I had been down there. So, yes, it is rumor and should be treated as such.

It would be nice if they had Dr. Lee look at the blood splatter on that towel. jmo

BEM: NE is very resourceful, and they most likely had boots on the ground there - not to mention they were EVERYWHERE for years doing stories on Natalee.

 

[LambChop]

Well yeah, I figured it wasn't really someone's face since it would be the size of a small island.

I just thought it was cool - I'm thinking I might superimpose it onto a piece of toast and sell it on ebay :rocker:

We took a ride in a glass bottom boat years ago and there are a lot of rocks. All we could see was sand, rocks, starfish, a turtle, stingrays and little else. Once we were out by the German shipwreck there were fish out there and that was interesting. But along the coast there is very little to see. Sand and rocks, that's it. lol

 

[LambChop]

BEM: NE is very resourceful, and they most likely had boots on the ground there - not to mention they were EVERYWHERE for years doing stories on Natalee.

I just find it interesting that their search area was in the very spot where they were rumored as being seen. So I think LE has a pretty good idea where he took her. jmo

 

[vlpate]

Trust me. Palm Beach area is like Downtown Disney at that time of night. The whole stretch along there is one giant hotel, condo, etc. right after another on the beach side. On the other side are restaurants, bars, shops, a mall with a theater, you name it, it's there. People are all over the place. There is no place he could have put her body that someone would not have seen him. Lots of activity in that area.

The search area by LE was all in the area of the southeastern portion of the island because that is the timeline they were working with. LE knew he never would have made it back to the hotel and back in time. The search grid is all in the remote area of the southeastern portion of the island that is not populated. No homes back there and only a very rocky dirt road heading up the coast. He could not have gotten far and gotten back in that amount of time. I think they were searching this area because they had good reason to believe he was there.

As for the dress GMA reporter (the woman) in an earlier video said the dress was on some rocks a distance from the towels which she commented "they" thought was unusual. She did not say who they were but I'm thinking LE. This was RG's favorite dress I don't see her tossing it onto the rocks where it might become damaged when the car was right there. Another thing that sets off the hinky meter. jmo

I never stated he took her back to the hotel. Over and over I've stated NEAR and BETWEEN the two areas.

I can't find anything about her dress on the rocks

 

[LambChop]

I never stated he took her back to the hotel. Over and over I've stated NEAR and BETWEEN the two areas.

I can't find anything about her dress on the rocks

The only place would be around the airport and he would have had more than a scratch on his shin if he tried to go into the areas with the vegetation. There are pricker bushes and cactus glore. The kind that could rip your clothes. The areas inbetween San Nicholas and Palm Beach have a lot homes and businesses on those back roads. The only area that is desolate is on the eastern coast. Most of the homes are in the center of the island and out towards the western coast. You really can't bury someone on the island much less if you have no tools. All the graves are above ground, way too rocky. So even if he tried to get rid of her on land, they would have found her. Plus he expected her body to be found she just did not go in where he said she did.

The island now recycles everything, garbage, plastic, metal, they do it all. Very high tech so putting her in a dump is out of the question they would have found her.

As I said, the search area was in that southeastern portion and LE has to believe that is where he took her because that is area where the dogs were focused. We know LE is not telling us everything so the fact they searched this particular area is significant, IMO. jmo

 

[vlpate]

I just find it interesting that their search area was in the very spot where they were rumored as being seen. So I think LE has a pretty good idea where he took her. jmo

What I found ridiculous about their story, that they waited until 9/17 to tell, was that they didn't report a man beating the daylights out of a woman who was screaming her head off.

 

[LambChop]

What I found ridiculous about their story, that they waited until 9/17 to tell, was that they didn't report a man beating the daylights out of a woman who was screaming her head off.

The locals sometimes do not go to police and try to avoid them. The story might have been told a couple of times and passed on before NE got the story. T. Stein addressed the part about RG being buried in the pet cemetary as ridiculous, which if you know the area it is.

They are use to Americans being there and sometimes acting stupid and pretty much do not interfer with you when you are down there. The locals are very nice and friendly but they don't interfer unless you are doing something to them. My guess is if this were true, they did not want to get involved and the story came from someone else which NG could not confirm.

I also heard a rumor when I was down there the week NH disappeared. It turned out the rumor was true and it came from locals. At the time LE was looking at the security guards and had them locked up and the rumor was that it was 3 local boys who took her to the beach from Carlos and Charley's bar which is what happened.

It's like a small town down there. Rumor's spread like wildfire. jmo

 

[R.U.Kidding!]

I just find it interesting that their search area was in the very spot where they were rumored as being seen. So I think LE has a pretty good idea where he took her. jmo

From the sound of that statement it seems you think there is some validity to the "car beating" and her being "buried alive in the PET cemetery? Please tell me I am wrong.LOL!

Also you seem to know that island so well. Did you or do you live there?

 

[LambChop]

From the sound of that statement it seems you think there is some validity to the "car beating" and her being "buried alive in the PET cemetery? Please tell me I am wrong.LOL!

Also you seem to know that island so well. Did you or do you live there?

No, I never said I believe the "buried in the pet cemetary" story. You can't dig a grave deep enough to put a body there unless you are in an area with sand dunes. What I said was the NE got the story about her being beaten from someone and since no name was mentioned, no pictures, I would guess it was from someone who was told by someone else. But that is my theory. Also LE focused their search area in that exact location and brought in dogs, not San Nicholas and not Palm Beach but they were searching the area along the southeastern coast. That is a fact.

I own property in Aruba and spend up to 4 weeks a year there. It's a small island and after 30 years I've been just about everywhere on the island. I also have friends there. jmo

 

[TheWNP]

I've seen video of LE searching a phosphate mine (which to me, looks like a hole that's been dug straight down), but was there ever a statement to the effect that an exhaustive search of all of these known holes was ever made? Seems to me that this might be the most logical type of place GG might have dumped RG into. I know that this goes against the insurance claim motive, but perhaps this was his "retirement plan", to collect after 7 years. If, perhaps, he killed her by strangulation, which seems to be his typical modus operandi (or at least his most common tactic with women), then perhaps he couldn't risk having her body found in the water, because how else could that have been explained to LE.

I still believe that all of this snorkeling nonsense has just been a big diversionary tactic cooked up by GG. What's really convinced me was that even his first attorney stated in a video (in a link that was provided by Dushi quite a ways back) that they were "sunbathing", to support the placement of the towels on that rocky surface. Since more than one witness has said they left the area, he had to have placed those towels there upon his return. And perhaps RG did cut her foot strolling that "beach" area and used a towel to apply pressure to the wound. He had to have planted that and her dress there as well.

Lastly, and I apologize for not providing a link, but I have seen some panoramic views from other locations on the island. I believe that the one in question was from the vantage point of the highest location (perhaps also near where the cliffs are located?) in Aruba. In that view, I noticed what looked like many wooden platforms scattered all over the ground. To those of you who are familiar with the island, were these used to cover the phosphate mines that were once there? Maybe all GG had to do was lift one of these "covers" up and dump RG into the hole? It wouldn't surprise me if these holes were also filled with water at the bottom, maybe even enough to conceal a body when simply viewed from above.

 

[Dushi]

No, I never said I believe the "buried in the pet cemetary" story. You can't dig a grave deep enough to put a body there unless you are in an area with sand dunes. What I said was the NE got the story about her being beaten from someone and since no name was mentioned, no pictures, I would guess it was from someone who was told by someone else. But that is my theory. Also LE focused their search area in that exact location and brought in dogs, not San Nicholas and not Palm Beach but they were searching the area along the southeastern coast. That is a fact.

I own property in Aruba and spend up to 4 weeks a year there. It's a small island and after 30 years I've been just about everywhere on the island. I also have friends there. jmo

I don't buy the buried in the pet cemetary either
But I do have a question

If they could bury a pet there, why couldn't they bury a person?
I visited the pet cemetary years ago, tourists are aware of it

 

[Dushi]

[QUOTE=LambChop;7546486]Trust me. Palm Beach area is like Downtown Disney at that time of night. The whole stretch along there is one giant hotel, condo, etc. right after another on the beach side. On the other side are restaurants, bars, shops, a mall with a theater, you name it, it's there. People are all over the place. There is no place he could have put her body that someone would not have seen him. Lots of activity in that area.

The search area by LE was all in the area of the southeastern portion of the island because that is the timeline they were working with. LE knew he never would have made it back to the hotel and back in time. The search grid is all in the remote area of the southeastern portion of the island that is not populated. No homes back there and only a very rocky dirt road heading up the coast. He could not have gotten far and gotten back in that amount of time. I think they were searching this area because they had good reason to believe he was there.

As for the dress GMA reporter (the woman) in an earlier video said the dress was on some rocks a distance from the towels which she commented "they" thought was unusual. She did not say who they were but I'm thinking LE. This was RG's favorite dress I don't see her tossing it onto the rocks where it might become damaged when the car was right there. Another thing that sets off the hinky meter. jmo[/QUOTE]



Thats where I live when in Aruba
Its extremely busy!!

Now I am saying this only because I don't agree with your whole post, not that i believe or have any proof, opinion on them being on Palm beach


But, I had thought until recently they stayed downtown.
In reading back, I am hearing they stayed at the Marriott?????

Either way, Palm beach is very busy, til you go past the Marriott, then nothing til the windsurfers Cove

That is where the Ritz is being built so at this point, there is not much there and no reason for activity after construction is over for the day


Really just giving a picture of Palm beach to those unfamiliar with the area

 

[LambChop]

I don't buy the buried in the pet cemetary either
But I do have a question

If they could bury a pet there, why couldn't they bury a person?
I visited the pet cemetary years ago, tourists are aware of it

They appear to be shallow graves. I do not think you could bury a human there, much less one who was still alive. It amounts to being buried on the beach and you just sit up and there goes all the sand. lol On most of the island you won't find 6 foot of sand to bury someone in. The sand dunes, maybe, but I know they searched them. The bigger dunes are up by the lighthouse but I don't think whatever is on the eastern coast would be enough to bury someone without them being found. When that wind blows it displaces a lot of sand so anything buried would be found pretty quickly.

GG story was she drowned and I don't think he would risk them finding her body on the island anywhere. Wherever RG went in GG felt confident when and if they found her body she would have appeared to have drowned. jmo

 

[LambChop]

Well, beyond the Ritz site there is a bit of rocky coast and then there are all of the expensive homes up to a point, then there are some snorkeling areas, the dunes and the lighthouse (which is at the northern most tip of the island). That is what I don't understand about GG driving all the way to Baby Beach when there are some safe snorkeling places after the Marriett. I mean, they were right there. A five minute trip up the road. A lot of fish up in that area because the tour ships anchor there and throw food over the side for the fish to eat so the fish don't go far. But then there are always quite a few people in the water at that location so I guess it just was not good enough for him. jmo

 

[LambChop]

I've seen video of LE searching a phosphate mine (which to me, looks like a hole that's been dug straight down), but was there ever a statement to the effect that an exhaustive search of all of these known holes was ever made? Seems to me that this might be the most logical type of place GG might have dumped RG into. I know that this goes against the insurance claim motive, but perhaps this was his "retirement plan", to collect after 7 years. If, perhaps, he killed her by strangulation, which seems to be his typical modus operandi (or at least his most common tactic with women), then perhaps he couldn't risk having her body found in the water, because how else could that have been explained to LE.

I still believe that all of this snorkeling nonsense has just been a big diversionary tactic cooked up by GG. What's really convinced me was that even his first attorney stated in a video (in a link that was provided by Dushi quite a ways back) that they were "sunbathing", to support the placement of the towels on that rocky surface. Since more than one witness has said they left the area, he had to have placed those towels there upon his return. And perhaps RG did cut her foot strolling that "beach" area and used a towel to apply pressure to the wound. He had to have planted that and her dress there as well.

Lastly, and I apologize for not providing a link, but I have seen some panoramic views from other locations on the island. I believe that the one in question was from the vantage point of the highest location (perhaps also near where the cliffs are located?) in Aruba. In that view, I noticed what looked like many wooden platforms scattered all over the ground. To those of you who are familiar with the island, were these used to cover the phosphate mines that were once there? Maybe all GG had to do was lift one of these "covers" up and dump RG into the hole? It wouldn't surprise me if these holes were also filled with water at the bottom, maybe even enough to conceal a body when simply viewed from above.

I think that is why they brought in the dogs. I know on the backside of the island there are a lot of fisherman's huts and sometimes they have collapsed so that may be what you see. I know years ago my husband and I had a jeep and we went up one hill, following a younger couple who said they felt they could make it no problem. We watched from below and they got up fine so we tried it. Never again, not in a million years. We were looking for the Natural Pool and we did find it but there were so many rocks I thought for sure the jeep was going to flip.

But there are elevations with roads up into the hills but you have to be careful so I'm not sure where those pictures were taken. And they could be covers for the mines as well. jmo

 

[Dushi]

Well, beyond the Ritz site there is a bit of rocky coast and then there are all of the expensive homes up to a point, then there are some snorkeling areas, the dunes and the lighthouse (which is at the northern most tip of the island). That is what I don't understand about GG driving all the way to Baby Beach when there are some safe snorkeling places after the Marriett. I mean, they were right there. A five minute trip up the road. A lot of fish up in that area because the tour ships anchor there and throw food over the side for the fish to eat so the fish don't go far. But then there are always quite a few people in the water at that location so I guess it just was not good enough for him. jmo

And around the Ritz site is very desolate

I know you can't grasp them going to another area

You know, I am sure he had his reasons and they probably weren't pure and perhaps he picked this location because it seemed like a good place to carry out his plan , if he had a plan, whatever that plan may have been

I don't really think they were looking for a snorkel site. do you?

But the fact is, when vacationing , many people explore their location

I mean, you have travelled all over the Island, why wouldn't someone else?

 

[LambChop]

And around the Ritz site is very desolate

I know you can't grasp them going to another area

You know, I am sure he had his reasons and they probably weren't pure and perhaps he picked this location because it seemed like a good place to carry out his plan , if he had a plan, whatever that plan may have been

I don't really think they were looking for a snorkel site. do you?

But the fact is, when vacationing , many people explore their location

I mean, you have travelled all over the Island, why wouldn't someone else?

This is true but then I did not drown while apparently dressed for dinner. jmo

 

[vlpate]

The only place would be around the airport and he would have had more than a scratch on his shin if he tried to go into the areas with the vegetation. There are pricker bushes and cactus glore. The kind that could rip your clothes. The areas inbetween San Nicholas and Palm Beach have a lot homes and businesses on those back roads. The only area that is desolate is on the eastern coast. Most of the homes are in the center of the island and out towards the western coast. You really can't bury someone on the island much less if you have no tools. All the graves are above ground, way too rocky. So even if he tried to get rid of her on land, they would have found her. Plus he expected her body to be found she just did not go in where he said she did.

The island now recycles everything, garbage, plastic, metal, they do it all. Very high tech so putting her in a dump is out of the question they would have found her.

As I said, the search area was in that southeastern portion and LE has to believe that is where he took her because that is area where the dogs were focused. We know LE is not telling us everything so the fact they searched this particular area is significant, IMO. jmo

Actually, that is not where the dogs were focused, that is the area where the searchers took the dogs to focus. This was based on information they got from interviewing Giordano and witnesses.

The pet cemetery was a joke - a National Enquirer story with no legs. Dogs were brought to the area (not the Netherlands dogs), because it was a tip, and the dogs did make a hit....on dog bones.

I believe they will find Robyn's body - 2 hours is a lot of time to dispose of a slightly built young woman. A man in Houston put a woman in an industrial drum in his back yard - it wasn't discovered for 20 years. He had killed a grandmother and her grand daughter prior to the drum woman. They only found her body because the man rented out a room and the roommate opened the drum.

Doesn't seem like hiding a body takes a brain surgeon - so many are missing.