ARUBA - Robyn Gardner, 35, Maryland woman missing in Aruba, 2 Aug 2011 - #11

[Dushi]

If he were not so obsessed with putting that claim in right away I'd think it was possible they had an argument that went wrong and somehow she ended up dead and he tried to cover it up. But trying to put a claim in so soon after she disappeared does not sound like something innocent people do. I wonder if he was concerned about notifying the insurance company before he left Aruba because this policy only covered them until their return. Again, most people who have just lost a friend are not concerned with those matters and are in shock from their loss, not calling an attorney and hiring him to advise you how to deal with placing a claim with the insurance company.

As far as his present social life it appears he is not letting this little incident with RG break his stride and it's business as usual. jmo[/QUOTE



Well, really I don't know what his thought process was but the above bolded statement doesn't make him sound guilty to me (many things do, but not this thought)

If many policies are only valid while someone is at their destination, it makes sense to me that he would call and report it to the insurance company while still on the Island JMO

 

[R.U.Kidding!]

“This guy’s a piece of work,” a source told The ENQUIRER. “I think it’s creepy that he’s going to places where Robyn went.”

It is creepy to me too Why would he be doing this, like he's flaunting it, 'look at me, I'm here but Robyn's not, haha...'

LOL! Has anyone here been to Gaithersburg, Maryland?? Maybe there just aren't a lot of places to go, so he winds up at the few places people socialize. Remember , It was an accident that took RG, so life does not stop for him. That just seems consistent with a man who has nothing to hide.

.....and the "creepy" for me is the ENQUIRER. Is that even considered MSM?

 

[Dushi]

LOL! Has anyone here been to Gaithersburg, Maryland?? Maybe there just aren't a lot of places to go, so he winds up at the few places people socialize. Remember , It was an accident that took RG, so life does not stop for him. That just seems consistent with a man who has nothing to hide.

.....and the "creepy" for me is the ENQUIRER. Is that even considered MSM?[/QUOTE]

LOL, I really don't think so

 

[LambChop]

I read somewhere that beyond the reefs, the current can take a body out, but within the protection of the reefs, a body would be washed in. Tugela seems to be saying that GG & Robyn were beyond that protected area, at least that is how I interpreted his previous post.

Yet ALE claim her body would not have been carried out to sea. But you're saying for a body to be carried away one would have to be several miles out. Seems I remember reading something like that in Dave Holloway's book about Natalee, as that's what they believe, that she was taken several miles out by boat.

When I hired a boat in Aruba to bring my husband's ashes out we were way out. We headed out from town and up the western coastline until I could see the lighthouse which appeared to be about 2 inches high when I looked at it so we could have been 5 miles or more out to sea. The captain stopped at a place where he said there was no danger of the ashes and small bone fragments washing ashore (that was my concern). Where he stopped I could see a light area in the water. Almost as if there was a sandbar 15 or 20 feet below the surface of the water. The captain said the current would carry the ashes south but that they would always be offshore. The few cemetaries they have are above ground so they must dispose of remains out at sea because he certainly knew the exact spot to drop those ashes.

JVS's father is on record as saying, "No body, no case". He was a Dutch attorney and knew what to do to make sure there was no body. I think everyone realizes that. I know the Arubans I know feel arrangements were made to take NH body out to sea so she would not come back in and were outraged that this happened. And most of the fishermen whose bodies are missing and presumed drowned were far out to sea. Drownings that happen close to the beach areas their bodies are quickly recovered. jmo

 

[LambChop]

I worked for an insurance company in the legal department and my husband worked in another department. After he died it was weeks before I even thought about putting in a claim. I guess it depends on how much money means to you. And since he was having some serious financial difficulties it appears the money was what was more important to him. jmo

 

[Dushi]

I worked for an insurance company in the legal department and my husband worked in another department. After he died it was weeks before I even thought about putting in a claim. I guess it depends on how much money means to you. And since he was having some serious financial difficulties it appears the money was what was more important to him. jmo

Yes and the fact that he was out of the country and as you suggested above, there could have been issues submitting a claim like this after leaving the Island

Also during that phone call to the insurance company, did he submit a death claim or ask information about the policy covering searches etc.?

 

[R.U.Kidding!]

If he had not planned her death the policy would have had nothing to do with her death, that is correct. According to the agent he seemed excited that he would be getting the money. If he had killed her during an argument you would think his focus would not have been on the money but on keeping attention off himself. She wasn't missing a full 12 hours and he was discussing calling the insurance company with an attorney. That sounds like suspicious behavior on his part. GG originally hired his Aruban attorney for a personal injury matter (RG), not a criminal matter, and how he should go about collecting the money from the insurance company. His attorney wanted him to sign an agreement representing him on a contingency for 1/3 of the insurance money. Personal injury attorneys charge 1/3 of whatever you get as an award/settlement. For all other legal matters attorneys charge an hourly rate. So it is clear GG hired his Aruban attorney to advise him about making a claim on the insurance, which GG admits and JB confirmed in their GMA interview. I think JB made a big slip by revealing that information because if the FBI chooses to make a case this is valuable information regarding the insurance.

And if the insurance had nothing to do with it why was the first thing he did was hire an attorney to inquire about insurance and that was before he even notified her family. No one has ever come forward to verify that anything GG said was true. No one. jmo

I'm just not sure those bolded statements in the above post are "true" I do not recall reading anything that specifically said those things. GG said (and I am paraphrasing)" he called the insurance company on advice from counsel to find out if the cost of the search would be covered in that, since it was going to be very expensive" .....and that even the Aruba stated in their travel guide to contact your insurance company.

It would seem to me if GG was so familiar with "forgery" and "scams", he would have already researched or knew all the answers about collecting insurance in a foreign country, personal injury, and any other "scam" he might have in mind. No attorney needed for a con artist , right? JMO

 

[R.U.Kidding!]

JVS's father is on record as saying, "No body, no case". He was a Dutch attorney and knew what to do to make sure there was no body. I think everyone realizes that. I know the Arubans I know feel arrangements were made to take NH body out to sea so she would not come back in and were outraged that this happened. And most of the fishermen whose bodies are missing and presumed drowned were far out to sea. Drownings that happen close to the beach areas their bodies are quickly recovered. jmo

Since we are not positive when ALE began their search, if it was the next morning, couldn't a body drift that far out to sea, So RG may have been in the immediate area immediately following her disappearance, but by the time search efforts started had been taken farther out to sea? Possibly to that point in the Ocean where "bodies" don't return to shore?

 

[Elley Mae]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/12/01/gary-giordano-interview_n_1123396.html

"My lawyer at the time, Michael Lopez, said you need to call insurance immediately. Helicopters and divers might send you an invoice. Call insurance and ask them how they deal with these expenses," said Giordano, who also claimed a Dutch travelers handbook urges visitors to alert insurance providers after tipping off authorities about a missing person.

 

[Dushi]

Since we are not positive when ALE began their search, if it was the next morning, couldn't a body drift that far out to sea, So RG may have been in the immediate area immediately following her disappearance, but by the time search efforts started had been taken farther out to sea? Possibly to that point in the Ocean where "bodies" don't return to shore?

My only question is about where they supposedly went in the water
It was not that protected area of the Baby Beach horseshoe

I realize that drowning victims have been easily found when having drowned outside of that immediate beach That has the Jetty protecting it

 

[LambChop]

I'm just not sure those bolded statements in the above post are "true" I do not recall reading anything that specifically said those things. GG said (and I am paraphrasing)" he called the insurance company on advice from counsel to find out if the cost of the search would be covered in that, since it was going to be very expensive" .....and that even the Aruba stated in their travel guide to contact your insurance company.

It would seem to me if GG was so familiar with "forgery" and "scams", he would have already researched or knew all the answers about collecting insurance in a foreign country, personal injury, and any other "scam" he might have in mind. No attorney needed for a con artist , right? JMO

Wouldn't the FBI like to find that little tidbit of information on his computer???

 

[Dushi]

[/B]
Wouldn't the FBI like to find that little tidbit of information on his computer???

I expect that the FBI and Aruban LE would be happy to find enough evidence to bring charges

I believe that has always been the goal
I don't believe there is a lot of incompetence here, I believe there is a lack of evidence

 

[LambChop]

Since we are not positive when ALE began their search, if it was the next morning, couldn't a body drift that far out to sea, So RG may have been in the immediate area immediately following her disappearance, but by the time search efforts started had been taken farther out to sea? Possibly to that point in the Ocean where "bodies" don't return to shore?

It would have to be a pretty strong current when there was none. GG reported they were in 10 to 20 feet of water which is not that far from the beach. They should have found her easily that first night. All bodies surface after a short period of time, and as LE reported her body should have been there. There is no proof, nor was there any report by Aruban authorities that a strong current carried her out to sea. By the following day her body would have been on the surface or close to the surface making it easy to spot her.

If they were looking for her in the wrong area, and witnesses did say they left, chances are her body was never there and there is no proof that she ever went into the water at that location. jmo

 

[neesaki]

LOL! Has anyone here been to Gaithersburg, Maryland?? Maybe there just aren't a lot of places to go, so he winds up at the few places people socialize. Remember , It was an accident that took RG, so life does not stop for him. That just seems consistent with a man who has nothing to hide.

.....and the "creepy" for me is the ENQUIRER. Is that even considered MSM?

Is that said tongue in cheek, lol ? :innocent:

Maybe not MSM, but is frequently linked or quoted in the forums.

Ijmo that GG is a creepy guy regardless of where he goes.

http://abcnews.go.com/meta/search/i....com/images/GMA/abc_aruba_boyfriend_nt_110812

 

[LambChop]

I expect that the FBI and Aruban LE would be happy to find enough evidence to bring charges

I believe that has always been the goal
I don't believe there is a lot of incompetence here, I believe there is a lack of evidence

And isn't it ironic that his favorite vacation spots are where it is so easy to dispose of a body without a trace. Certainly not evidence but it does make you wonder. And we still do not have proof he always took out million dollar policies when he travels, just that he claims he does.

O/T a bit but I remember in November of 2010 a report that a woman's jaw bone washed ashore on the beach up near the Marriett. The jaw bone did not belong to NH but was determined to belong to a young woman. So it is still possible that remains could be found for RG. Years ago I remember seeing bags of trash washing up on the eastern beaches and someone in town said it could be from the cruise ships. The beaches on the eastern side are much cleaner now since they started to fine those cruise ships and you don't see as much junk lying on the beaches.

It is possible GG did research the tides and currents and intended to take RG to the cliff areas on the eastern coast all along. Baby Beach would be the perfect "decoy" area to get the attention away from LE searching to the east and that open sea. At that end of the island you go from the calm area to the secluded, rough and dangerous cliff areas where someone could fall to their death quite easily in minutes. This plan would have been harder to pull off up by the high rise hotels. It is possible this was the plan all along. RG goes into the water off the cliffs, he watches as she gets pulled under and off he goes to have investigators/rescuers look in a totally different area where he figures authorities will assume a "rough" sea would carry her body out to sea in an entirely different direction. What he never counted on were the witnesses who saw them leave and the fact that the water was not rough but calm that day. Had he truly been in that water snorkeling he would have realized that and had to come up with an entirely different sceniaro. There is no proof he was ever any deeper than ankle deep in that water and his story just does not pass the sniff test. jmo

 

[Dushi]

And isn't it ironic that his favorite vacation spots are where it is so easy to dispose of a body without a trace. Certainly not evidence but it does make you wonder. And we still do not have proof he always took out million dollar policies when he travels, just that he claims he does.

O/T a bit but I remember in November of 2010 a report that a woman's jaw bone washed ashore on the beach up near the Marriett. The jaw bone did not belong to NH but was determined to belong to a young woman. So it is still possible that remains could be found for RG. Years ago I remember seeing bags of trash washing up on the eastern beaches and someone in town said it could be from the cruise ships. The beaches on the eastern side are much cleaner now since they started to fine those cruise ships and you don't see as much junk lying on the beaches.

It is possible GG did research the tides and currents and intended to take RG to the cliff areas on the eastern coast all along. Baby Beach would be the perfect "decoy" area to get the attention away from LE searching to the east and that open sea. At that end of the island you go from the calm area to the secluded, rough and dangerous cliff areas where someone could fall to their death quite easily in minutes. This plan would have been harder to pull off up by the high rise hotels. It is possible this was the plan all along. RG goes into the water off the cliffs, he watches as she gets pulled under and off he goes to have investigators/rescuers look in a totally different area where he figures authorities will assume a "rough" sea would carry her body out to sea in an entirely different direction. What he never counted on were the witnesses who saw them leave and the fact that the water was not rough but calm that day. Had he truly been in that water snorkeling he would have realized that and had to come up with an entirely different sceniaro. There is no proof he was ever any deeper than ankle deep in that water and his story just does not pass the sniff test. jmo

Why would you suggest its his favorite vacation spot?
I have never read anything about him being a frequent visitor

Lambchop, I firmly believe you can get rid of someone anywhere
Look around at how many people are missing and can't be found on this forum

 

[LambChop]

Is that said tongue in cheek, lol ? :innocent:

Maybe not MSM, but is frequently linked or quoted in the forums.

Ijmo that GG is a creepy guy regardless of where he goes.

http://abcnews.go.com/meta/search/i....com/images/GMA/abc_aruba_boyfriend_nt_110812

One can only hope that one of those "blonds" he has seen lately is an FBI agent. LOL

 

[LambChop]

Why would you suggest its his favorite vacation spot?
I have never read anything about him being a frequent visitor

Lambchop, I firmly believe you can get rid of someone anywhere
Look around at how many people are missing and can't be found on this forum

While this is true.....Aruba and cruise ships seem to be the most popular locations so far for partner's to disappear. Water hides a multitude of sins and tends to destroy evidence rather quickly. Mr. G has been on numerous cruises in the recent past. Four that we know of with one woman and he had booked a cruise for he and RG in July. Pretty good for someone with financial difficulties and a company that seems to bring in very little income. RG did not want to do a cruise so it appears GG offered to turn his points in for a trip to Aruba.......next best thing to a cruise, apparently. jmo

 

[Dushi]

While this is true.....Aruba and cruise ships seem to be the most popular locations so far for partner's to disappear. Water hides a multitude of sins and tends to destroy evidence rather quickly. Mr. G has been on numerous cruises in the recent past. Four that we know of with one woman and he had booked a cruise for he and RG in July. Pretty good for someone with financial difficulties and a company that seems to bring in very little income. RG did not want to do a cruise so it appears GG offered to turn his points in for a trip to Aruba.......next best thing to a cruise, apparently. jmo

Really

I think that is a bit of a stretch

There are lakes and rivers and streams everywhere

And sadly, people disappear everywhere

and really, even having said that, I still don't get your comment about it being one of his favorite spots


Have any of his travel partners disappeared on these cruise?

 

[katydid23]

Thanks Dushi,

That was exactly what I was about to post. So what happens to "motive"?

You know, the one everyone was so sure was the Insurance pay out by forgery?

Maybe it wasn't his original plan. Maybe he did just sign the insurance papers because he always did that when he took vacations. But once they got there, it occurred to him that she was a possible way out of the financial mess he was in. And maybe she was so negative, and made him so mad the way she was acting, that he decided to go ahead and do it.

I think he always planned to make money off of her in some way. I think the original plan was for 'dirty pictures' to be sold. But maybe he decided that was not enough this time. A million dollars is a big bonus.