Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #14 *Arrest*

[Procrastinator]

"@Eloise ... I've said all along and still believe now, the smoking gun (to me) is the fact she fed the food to her children and was unconcerned for their health. This only makes sense if she knew that food was uncontaminated and she knew they'd be fine - because her placement of DC was deliberate and focused. Nothing else accounts for those actions/behaviours. JMO."

Agree! "Scraped the mushrooms off" was the story early on. Then on the last day of being questioned by Dr Rogers, EP makes no mention of it, instead it's word salad about whether the leftovers were actually lunch leftovers and no mention of scraping off mushrooms.

 

[Detechtive]

Who among us hasn't mistakenly taken evidence to the tip, and mistakenly repeatedly factory reset a phone, and mistakenly repeatedly lied about having cancer, and mistakenly picked, dehydrated, powderised and cooked toxic mushrooms. Why, this could have happened to any of us. But for the grace etc etc.

And mistakenly gone onto the Inaturalist website and searched for death cap maps.

I mean... happens all the time!

 

[lazymaiden07]

What young girl would be hanging about counting her mother's toilet visits? My immediate instinct about this (back when it first came out in the hearing) was EP may have SAID to her daughter, 'oh dear, i've been to the toilet at least ten times this morning!'

You beat me to it! I also think the daughter said this because EP told her that is how many times she has visited the toilet.
They have a double story house- there is no way no that a child would be understanding how many times their parent has accessed the toilet. MOO

 

[Detechtive]

The turning up to the hospital that morning with a backpack and satchel is evidence I hadn't heard prior. That is quite damning too - it shows she was of course not ill prepared like she said, and that she ran home to quickly clean up the 'crime scene' imo.

 

[lazymaiden07]

Man, I would've loved to see Dr Rogers in action....it would be like watching an elite athlete at the height of their career.

 

[Detechtive]

Man, I would've loved to see Dr Rogers in action....it would be like watching an elite athlete at the height of their career.

It must certainly be the case of her career!

Honestly throughout the prosecution case, I felt like it was a bit disorganised, but that was likely due to scheduling, and availability of particular witnesses at the time, etc.

However, during the closing she shows what a sharp organised mind she has, IMO. She absolutely knocked it out of the park!

It's funny that everything we have come up with in here, she said in her closing! I feel like we are on the ball in here! IMO

 

[lazymaiden07]

It must certainly be the case of her career!

Honestly throughout the prosecution case, I felt like it was a bit disorganised, but that was likely due to scheduling, and availability of particular witnesses at the time, etc.

However, during the closing she shows what a sharp organised mind she has, IMO. She absolutely knocked it out of the park!

It's funny that everything we have come up with in here, she said in her closing! I feel like we are on the ball in here! IMO

Yes, agree with all the points above. It did jump around a little, and there were times were I wondered whether they drove the points home enough. But the closing was just brilliant, and suggested why she only engaged EP in yes/no type questions.

I'm sure she must be consumed by this case? I often wonder after the day's session has ended, how she attends to family/sleep/nutrition and does all the normal things? I dare say she might take a few days off after this one!

 

[lazymaiden07]

Via ABC
He says she'd initially told the court that the notion that Ms Patterson's children had eaten the leftovers was raised during the accused's first visit to the hospital and she'd discussed it with doctors.

But Ms Mandy tells the jury this was not a detail supported by evidence from the doctors and it would be "inconceivable" that they had known about the children at that time and not taken more urgent action.

Is Mandy serious here? Didn't the doctor testify he was on the verge of calling police to attend EP's home after leaving three voice mails to EP? Doesn't that suggest 'urgent action'?

 

[Detechtive]

Yes, agree with all the points above. It did jump around a little, and there were times were I wondered whether they drove the points home enough. But the closing was just brilliant, and suggested why she only engaged EP in yes/no type questions.

I'm sure she must be consumed by this case? I often wonder after the day's session has ended, how she attends to family/sleep/nutrition and does all the normal things? I dare say she might take a few days off after this one!

She's probably working around the clock on it, IMO. I imagine she would be utterly exhausted!

To get to the bottom of all of it she would have had to obsess over it, I think. I mean, in here, it seems easier to tease out detail because we have a lot of different minds coming up with different angles. For her to be so accurate with everything shows she has dug to the very bottom of it all, IMO.

And or she has been instructed expertly.

Even having known Erin, and myself and my friends having a lot of collective experience in the field, it has been difficult for myself and friends to piece it together.

 

[Detechtive]

Via ABC
He says she'd initially told the court that the notion that Ms Patterson's children had eaten the leftovers was raised during the accused's first visit to the hospital and she'd discussed it with doctors.

But Ms Mandy tells the jury this was not a detail supported by evidence from the doctors and it would be "inconceivable" that they had known about the children at that time and not taken more urgent action.

Is Mandy serious here? Didn't the doctor testify he was on the verge of calling police to attend EP's home after leaving three voice mails to EP? Doesn't that suggest 'urgent action'?

I don't even want to listen to it. I want to go to bed and wake up when it's done. It's borderline insulting, and also boring, IMO.

 

[Eloise]

I don't even want to listen to it. I want to go to bed and wake up when it's done. It's borderline insulting, and also boring, IMO.

I find it a little boring as well. All due respect to all the barristers involved in the defence, especially considering how I feel about everyone deserving and needing a robust defence etc etc, and that is true; but, JMO it feels like the intellectual equivalent of

 

[lazymaiden07]

I don't even want to listen to it. I want to go to bed and wake up when it's done. It's borderline insulting, and also boring, IMO.

It is insulting! The staff were begging her not to leave, repeated voice mails, contacting senior officials. What were they supposed to do? Drag a mentally competent adult from her home?
They very clearly said the police were the next course of action.

On a different note, the fact that EP missed those calls is very convenient. I don't know about anyone else, but after one missed call from a hospital/health worker, the ringer is set to LOUD and I have it with me at all times. There's no way you'd be missing such important phone calls when the situation is so dire.

 

[Detechtive]

I find it a little boring as well. All due respect to all the barristers involved in the defence, especially considering how I feel about everyone deserving and needing a robust defence etc etc, and that is true; but, JMO it feels like the intellectual equivalent of View attachment 595801

I do feel sorry for Mr Mandy. He inherited what I think is a pretty bad case to defend.
It's no slight on his obvious brilliance. I remember during his defence that I suddenly had doubts that the jury would find her culpable. He is clearly good at what he does. But he can only do so much with what he has.
Erin taking the stand was a death knell for him, IMO. And I am sure that was not his choosing!

 

[lazymaiden07]

Even having known Erin, and myself and my friends having a lot of collective experience in the field, it has been difficult for myself and friends to piece it together.

I know it's been said, but we've been so fortunate to have your insight

 

[Ellery84]

Erin was technically correct to say a week after the lunch that she did not own a dehydrator as by that time she had disposed of it

Yes, she’s very literal, isn’t she. When it suits her. Surely she can understand the meaning and context of questions in which she’s asked. Surely.

 

[Jess D]

One of my friends doesn't garden but uses it to make kale chips and zucchini chips as they are so expensive otherwise. She borrowed mine so often off and on for a year or so that she finally decided to purchase her own.

You could also do those in the air-fryer I think.

 

[iamshadow21]

Just occurred to me I don't know anyone who owns a dehydrator. Does anyone here own one?

I do, but it's a forty bucks one from Aldi. I can't imagine spending hundreds on one just to throw it away. But then, I'm not putting anything toxic in mine, either.

My partner has dried sliced tomatoes and kale, I've done a lot of zest of citrus. You take the zest off a citrus fruit with a vegetable peeler (careful not to get too much pith), snip or slice it into smaller pieces, then dehydrate them until they're leather hard. Then you put them in a jar. When you want to bake something citrusy out of season, blitz a spoonful or two of dried zest in a coffee grinder and add to your recipe. I've done it with lemons, limes, oranges, mandarins, and tangelos. Especially tangelos, they're my favourite and they're not available year round.

I've never tried dehydrating mushrooms, and I don't think I'm likely to in future, since my partner can't eat them any more. We used to eat button mushrooms, oyster, king oyster, and those big flat brown ones the size of your hand. We used to make burgers with those as the buns. Messy, but delicious.

Never foraged them. The potential for poisoning is too real.

MOO

 

[Jess D]

"@Eloise ... I've said all along and still believe now, the smoking gun (to me) is the fact she fed the food to her children and was unconcerned for their health. This only makes sense if she knew that food was uncontaminated and she knew they'd be fine - because her placement of DC was deliberate and focused. Nothing else accounts for those actions/behaviours. JMO."

Agree! "Scraped the mushrooms off" was the story early on. Then on the last day of being questioned by Dr Rogers, EP makes no mention of it, instead it's word salad about whether the leftovers were actually lunch leftovers and no mention of scraping off mushrooms.

Her defence would have advised her not to have mentioned it...

 

[Monstradamus]

I find it a little boring as well. All due respect to all the barristers involved in the defence, especially considering how I feel about everyone deserving and needing a robust defence etc etc, and that is true; but, JMO it feels like the intellectual equivalent of View attachment 595801

A narcissist's famous last words.

 

[Detechtive]

I know it's been said, but we've been so fortunate to have your insight

I haven't really given much yet. When the trial is over, I shall reveal all! (if there is a conviction).
Otherwise, we are all going into hiding! lol