Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #14 *Arrest*

[Megnut]

It reads like a MaryHigginsClark mystery, believable enough if you suspended critical thought for three hours, but not a well reasoned plan (if planned).

It's like, if this were a novel, the author forgot that the main characters would be alive and communicating, relating their experiences too.


Because this would make for a very bad book:

Five people get violently ill at their homes. They alert no one, go to no hospitals, they duscuss nothing with anyone, they die. No one investigates when they last ate, what they ate or where they ate it. Then there are funerals. The End.

After getting snippets of her testimony, I can't determine what her position is. If it was accidental, why all the hyperbole? If she accidentally used misidentified DC mushrooms, why not lead with that?

Eager for a verdict so we can discuss more freely.

JMO

 

[Kemug]

Jury research (in the USA) has shown that many jurors make up their minds very early in a trial, for example [bbm]:

Most juror consultants have found from their research in interviewing jurors after trial, that about 80-90 percent of jurors make up their minds about how they are going to vote at the conclusion of opening statements.

RSBM
Well, I had only 99% made up my mind before the trial. But once Erin was testifying, well IMO there was no more doubt. And it is not just that her personality, or character defect, or whatever it is that makes her appear (at least to me) so unlikeable, but (again IMO) there are so many things she has claimed as fact that simply don't add up. And I wouldn't be at all surprised if all the jurors feel the same. MOO

 

[Salah11]

You have to wonder if Simon Illnesses can be linked back to Erin then this was not her first rodeo and she seemingly got away with that which could have given her a false sense of security.

ETA - I am not claiming she is guilty it’s just a theory!

 

[Kemug]

Its probably something like Fat Reduction | Non Surgical | Sydney | Elite Body Contouring

Enrich definitely do not offer lipo: No longer performing Liposuction

Possibly just something for her chin?

 

[Woolly]

BBM
Hypothetically…

What if bad steak inadvertently exacerbated the initial DC symptoms?

A short time later, the jury saw, Ms Atkinson sent another message with a follow up question about when she purchased ingredients for the lunch.
“Hi Sally, I’m not sure exactly what time of day,” Ms Patterson responded.
“I went a few times last week and I know I got some of the ingredients on maybe Wednesday or Thursday (I know I bought some discounted eye fillet steaks one time on one of those two days) and then I went back on either Thursday or Friday and bought a couple more but they weren’t discounted just normal price.”
BBM

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/breaking-news/erin-patterson-online-searches-probed-in-mushroom-murder-trial/news-story/f17281bac800ec26b8768740e3236c1f

The ‘discounted’ steaks were purchased on the Thursday then not eaten until the Saturday/Sunday. Discounted can often mean at or very close to safe 'use by' date.

Could simple food poisoning have made the initial symptoms more intense or longer lasting, hence creating the situation where medical intervention was sought earlier than Erin might have anticipated, & before any other meals consumed which could have muddied the trail?

JMOO

I wonder if the steaks were actually discounted at all or if this was just a bit of early misdirection, Erin hoping that the illness would be chalked up to some old meat and no one would think to examine the mushrooms more carefully.

 

[Woolly]

If, in this case, deadly DCs were used, even accidentally, in say a rhubarb pie, would the hospital ever searched for and identified the DC toxin in time? Or just the severe organ damage, cause unknown?

In theory, the perfect crime. (DC toxin delivered via a nonmushroom meal, resulting in fatalities, with the toxin undetectable after 48 hours.) Which isn't what happened here.

JMO

Rsmb

I keep thinking about that too, Megnut. Would it have been better to hide the death caps in a non-mushroom meal? Maybe they were too pungent and people would have known something was off by the taste. Or maybe it was just too much of a gamble for Erin (if intentional). After all, you can claim accident if the meal calls for mushrooms. You can’t so easily explain away how deadly mushrooms were added to a rhubarb pie…

 

[Kemug]

However for anyone to think that relatives and police would not find the common link (i.e. the joint lunch) is beyond naive. IMO,

RSBM
Maybe she had the desire to kill them, and the idea of how to do it, and then just couldn't let go of it.

 

[JBowie]

RSBM
Maybe she had the desire to kill them, and the idea of how to do it, and then just couldn't let go of it.

Has to be something like that, I guess but, short of a full confession, I don't expect that we'll ever know for sure.

 

[Kemug]

This is what I mean about her being a compulsive gambler. I'll bet that her disease of addiction is manifesting in other areas.

JMO MOMOO

RSBM
We should be thankful that she quit being an Air Traffic Controller. MOO

 

[Jess D]

I wonder exactly what EP was planning to do if SP had attended and all five guests had died.

If SP had attended he would have certainly passed away as he's already so vulnerable.

If SP hadn't alerted everyone to the concept of poisoning then all four of them would have certainly passed away.

Five dead people all passed away at the same time, that's what would have been the result of Plan A.

I still wonder if EP was hoping they'd be recorded as Covid deaths as a result of the pandemic?

JMO MOO

But Simon didn't alert anyone to the concept of poisoning. I don't follow what you mean.

 

[Jess D]

Eewwwwww

Forget the DC mushrooms for a second.

Truth in advertising!!!!!! If I'm having lunch at someone's house, I would want to know that the filet I'm being served was already discounted on Wednesday and it's being served to me on Saturday. I'm out!!!

Thrifty EP, did she buy day-old filets, freeze them, to extend their life a bit, then thaw and serve them?

Dehydrated mushrooms in brownies.

That kitchen should be shut down.

JMO

Bad steak would cause food poisoning, but surely not liver failure...

 

[Jess D]

It reads like a MaryHigginsClark mystery, believable enough if you suspended critical thought for three hours, but not a well reasoned plan (if planned).

It's like, if this were a novel, the author forgot that the main characters would be alive and communicating, relating their experiences too.


Because this would make for a very bad book:

Five people get violently ill at their homes. They alert no one, go to no hospitals, they duscuss nothing with anyone, they die. No one investigates when they last ate, what they ate or where they ate it. Then there are funerals. The End.

After getting snippets of her testimony, I can't determine what her position is. If it was accidental, why all the hyperbole? If she accidentally used misidentified DC mushrooms, why not lead with that?

Eager for a verdict so we can discuss more freely.

JMO

Apparently Erin was a fan of Agatha Christie novels...

 

[JBowie]

What if the in-laws were the type to never go to the doctor. Never complain, and what if Erin didn’t anticipate the violence of the symptoms?

Even when you google the symptoms it just indicates symptoms like a food bug, but it doesn’t explain the severity - like vomiting 30 times in one night.

If it wasn’t for Simon, none of the 4 would have gone to hospital. He insisted.

Does that change your theory? If so I’d love to hear it. Love your logic in this case.

I think you (or someone who knows her) may have mentioned that she's an avid researcher, in which case my expectation is that she'd know full well the result for anyone who has ingested death caps. Again, the name alone indicates fatality.

If, for some perverted reason, she 'simply' wanted to make then all very ill, then I think she could have found other ingredients -- ask Simon!

Another factor to this is that these were elderly people whose systems would not necessarily be strong enough to fight off illness associated with some form of poisoning.

Even had they survived, they would have worked out that they became very ill as the result of that meal and, when you add that to Simon's previous experiences, she risked legal consequences.

 

[Megnut]

Bad steak would cause food poisoning, but surely not liver failure...

No, I just wouldn't want to eat it!

I don't recall EP's words to SP when he said he wasn't coming to lunch, but I seem to recall EP bemoaning her great effort. Did she also indicate great expense?

When in fact it was a lot of neither?

Pre-made pastries, store-bought gravy, foraged mushrooms, day old filets....

Bargain lunch...

Well, unless you had to eat it.

JMO

 

[Kemug]

If we're being really suspicious, did she consider that this would account for why people thought they were ill initially?

I shouldn't think so, although it might have been a good excuse for her to say "Oh my goodness, the steaks were near their use buy date, I wonder if . . .!" But as far as we know, she never tried that one. Still, this is Erin, I really don't understand how her mind works.

 

[Kemug]

A great deal of evidence in this case came from Ian.

RSBM
She probably wants to kill him!

MOO

 

[JBowie]

RSBM
She probably wants to kill him!

MOO

The police and State Prosecutor do too, hence the attempted murder charges (which were dropped).

 

[Kemug]

Eewwwwww

Forget the DC mushrooms for a second.

Truth in advertising!!!!!! If I'm having lunch at someone's house, I would want to know that the filet I'm being served was already discounted on Wednesday and it's being served to me on Saturday. I'm out!!!

RSBM
Oh you're so picky

 

[HoneyBunOne]

Eewwwwww

Forget the DC mushrooms for a second.

Truth in advertising!!!!!! If I'm having lunch at someone's house, I would want to know that the filet I'm being served was already discounted on Wednesday and it's being served to me on Saturday. I'm out!!!

Thrifty EP, did she buy day-old filets, freeze them, to extend their life a bit, then thaw and serve them?

Dehydrated mushrooms in brownies.

That kitchen should be shut down.

JMO

I'd also want to know if someone foraged mushrooms. It would be a hard no from me.

 

[Kemug]

I think Erin's children are her Achilles Heel. I think she really does love them, and genuinely didn't want them to be alarmed by being tested for poison. But by objecting to that, it just raised more suspicion, and was another dot to connect. MOO