Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, NSW, 12 Sep 2014 - #71

[SouthAussie]

I think you are 100% accurate on this, my bad.

i would still lime to know if this problematic behaviour was a well known thing or something the foster parents came up with? Cos I still stand by it could be a defence mechanism by the fosters to account for their actions. imo

edit to remove a care the/emoji that somehow made its way onto my comment

Yes, I don't know.

That is why I am wondering about the psychologist mentioned in the article. What psychologist? Did a psychologist release some details to the media ... because the article says that the psychologist report was used to try to lift the suppression order.

 

[T-dawg420]

Yes, I don't know.

That is why I am wondering about the psychologist mentioned in the article. What psychologist? Did a psychologist release some details to the media ... because the article says that the psychologist report was used to try to lift the suppression order.

Great question, just like everything else in regards to this case it can be a proverbial dumpster fire to try and get your head around it.

 

[PrimeSuspect]

Surely a person would be assessed to become a foster carer? If they had mental difficulties, they would not be suitable carers...... especially when there are 2 very young children involved. IMHO

These links don't mention mental health checks for prospective foster carers, we don't have it for bio parents either.
Mental health issues can appear suddenly for us all.
There are police checks and everyone in the household needs to be assessed. It's come a long way but will it ever be perfect?
Children are harmed by their own parents, grandparents, step parents, relatives who have guardianship and foster parents.

...........

Not that I'm sold on the idea the FPs are responsible for WT's disappearance, if the last sign of life proves to be false, FF and FM are responsible, but it doesn't look that way as FF not a POI, so how did FM manage to fool everyone and in a incredibly tight time frame?

Unfortunately, children suffer in many ways when a sibling has disappeared or died. The parents (bio, foster, adoptive) can become overly protective, paranoid, clingy or distant, provide inconsistent discipline because of fear, and the child, naturally, acts out.

The home is effectively in a permanent state of mourning, in limbo, unable to move on. Cracks will appear. No excuse for abuse though. JMO

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[Curiouser+Curiouser]

People are supposed to discern that they would take William away from his known address and hide him from FACS, but they wouldn't take him from the FACS appointed carers and hide him?

They're very different things. One is quickly taking your own son to hide him. The other is taking him from a different person's house and involves planning and forethought.

 

[SouthAussie]

Yes, like that . . . but if she's handed it back to police, will we get to read her report before charges are laid and heard? And if they can't get the evidence, if they do cold the case and wait for something to turn up or forensic technology to improve by a few decades, what then? Will the inquest remain adjourned and the coroner's analysis a secret?

The coroner hasn't handed the case back to the police. They were searching under Coronial Orders in November.

imo

 

[JLZ]

IMO it’s now in the FPs best interests to have one or both of them deemed mentally/emotionally unfit which will then provide an insanity plee to both cases, and once they know they can’t be prosecuted, the truth about William will be revealed because they have an out to tell the truth without punishment.

They would not want an insanity verdict because then they could be locked up as long as the Crown should please. It would be better to undergo a term of imprisonment even because then you have a release date.

 

[seekingjustice**]

Paraphrasing from the article "FF is reported to have 'grabbed' the victim about the neck and 'physically restrained her to sit back down".

The article also said that the child screamed out in pain and the FM then forced the child to sit on the floor for a prolonged amount of time before allegedly kicking the child and causing her pain and bruising. They stated in the article that the child tried to get up a number of times but the FM forced her to sit down. It also mentions that the child pleaded with the FM to stop while both the FM and FF allegedly subjected the child to a barrage of verbal abuse lasting 15 minutes. bbm

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/nation/william-tyrrell-foster-parents-face-explosive-allegations-of-abuse/news-story/406658f89db36d76ca0a289f14ef4147

 

[Awakening]

"The plaintiffs, which are four major media networks, Nationwide News, Nine Network, the ABC and Network Ten, jointly seek a variation of orders made by a magistrate in the Local Court at Hornsbyunder the Courts Suppression and Non-publication Orders Act 2010 (NSW) (“Suppression Orders Act”). The orders, made on 17 December 2021, restrict publication of information concerning charges of assault and an application for an apprehended violence order (AVO) brought by police against the former foster parents of the boy William Tyrrell who disappeared on the Central Coast in 2014. The charges do not relate to William Tyrrell, who is presumed to have died"

In this Court, the second defendant, SD, read an affidavit of her solicitor annexing a copy of the court attendance notice and a statement of facts in relation to a further offence of knowingly giving false or misleading evidence to the New South Wales Crime Commission. That evidence involved answers to questions denying the assault which was the subject of the charge laid against her in the Local Court.

Full judgement here:

Nationwide News Pty Ltd v JS and SD - NSW Caselaw

www.caselaw.nsw.gov.au

 

[SouthAussie]

"The plaintiffs, which are four major media networks, Nationwide News, Nine Network, the ABC and Network Ten, jointly seek a variation of orders made by a magistrate in the Local Court at Hornsbyunder the Courts Suppression and Non-publication Orders Act 2010 (NSW) (“Suppression Orders Act”). The orders, made on 17 December 2021, restrict publication of information concerning charges of assault and an application for an apprehended violence order (AVO) brought by police against the former foster parents of the boy William Tyrrell who disappeared on the Central Coast in 2014. The charges do not relate to William Tyrrell, who is presumed to have died"

In this Court, the second defendant, SD, read an affidavit of her solicitor annexing a copy of the court attendance notice and a statement of facts in relation to a further offence of knowingly giving false or misleading evidence to the New South Wales Crime Commission. That evidence involved answers to questions denying the assault which was the subject of the charge laid against her in the Local Court.

Full judgement here:

Nationwide News Pty Ltd v JS and SD - NSW Caselaw

www.caselaw.nsw.gov.au

So, it sounds like the bottom line is ...

- no identifying the child, pursuant to all the usual protection for children
- no identifying the FP for 3 years or until their hearings are over, whichever comes first

But that the court can still revoke or vary the above order in the future, presumably if someone successfully applies for that.

Interesting that the Crime Commission charges seem to be about the same matter (the alleged assault).

imo

 

[katydid23]

Such a sad and dire situation for the the child….You never know what goes on behind closed doors…. IMO

From this type of parental behaviour one could suggest that a “fit of rage“ type incident is possible in William’s case….

Good on the media for challenging the suppression orders and finally getting somewhere!

imo

Does the article say when the incident happened?

 

[SLouTh]

"The plaintiffs, which are four major media networks, Nationwide News, Nine Network, the ABC and Network Ten, jointly seek a variation of orders made by a magistrate in the Local Court at Hornsbyunder the Courts Suppression and Non-publication Orders Act 2010 (NSW) (“Suppression Orders Act”). The orders, made on 17 December 2021, restrict publication of information concerning charges of assault and an application for an apprehended violence order (AVO) brought by police against the former foster parents of the boy William Tyrrell who disappeared on the Central Coast in 2014. The charges do not relate to William Tyrrell, who is presumed to have died"

In this Court, the second defendant, SD, read an affidavit of her solicitor annexing a copy of the court attendance notice and a statement of facts in relation to a further offence of knowingly giving false or misleading evidence to the New South Wales Crime Commission. That evidence involved answers to questions denying the assault which was the subject of the charge laid against her in the Local Court.

Full judgement here:

Nationwide News Pty Ltd v JS and SD - NSW Caselaw

www.caselaw.nsw.gov.au

Section 34 is most interesting.....

In this Court, the second defendant, SD, read an affidavit of her solicitor annexing a copy of the court attendance notice and a statement of facts in relation to a further offence of knowingly giving false or misleading evidence to the New South Wales Crime Commission. That evidence involved answers to questions denying the assault which was the subject of the charge laid against her in the Local Court.

Nationwide News Pty Ltd v JS and SD - NSW Caselaw

www.caselaw.nsw.gov.au

Ooops sorry Awakening I didn't see your edit before I posted ....

 

[SLouTh]

Does the article say when the incident happened?

No...... but we can take an educated guess that it was just prior to the Fosters having the children removed from their home...
imo

 

[Awakening]

Section 34 is most interesting.....

In this Court, the second defendant, SD, read an affidavit of her solicitor annexing a copy of the court attendance notice and a statement of facts in relation to a further offence of knowingly giving false or misleading evidence to the New South Wales Crime Commission. That evidence involved answers to questions denying the assault which was the subject of the charge laid against her in the Local Court.

Nationwide News Pty Ltd v JS and SD - NSW Caselaw

www.caselaw.nsw.gov.au

It makes me wonder if they were under surveillance and they've got recordings of the alleged assault?

I seem to remember a reference to there being lots of evidence including recordings?

 

[katydid23]

I was thinking along the lines of a “snap” behaviour…. Losing control for an instant, rather than prolonged sustained abuse ….. but with possible dire consequences……????? Would a history of such “possible snaps “ in loss of control predispose one to longer more sustained periods as you describe it???

I don’t want this to be the answer for William, that his demise was from someone who was to love and care for him and who he would have had trust in ….but we need to consider the possibility…..

imo

My question is when did it happen? Was it around Dec of 2021?

I wonder because it may have coincided with the foster mother being named the suspect in William's disappearance.

How would the 12 yr old respond to finding out that news? I can imagine she would be very angry, upset and would likely be very confrontational as it would be shocking.

And her saying I HATE YOU would fit right in.

IF FM IS INNOCENT in William's case, and is being falsely accused, then I feel sympathetic towards her because of the horrid situation.

If she is innocent and all of this is now happening, the public seeing her as a possible child killer, and now the child she has raised as an infant thinks she is guilty as well? That could make anyone fall apart, in my opinion.

Maybe I am wrong and she is a coldblooded killer. I have been fooled before for sure.

 

[SouthAussie]

It makes me wonder if they were under surveillance and they've got recordings of the alleged assault?

I seem to remember a reference to there being lots of evidence including recordings?

I think we established a bit earlier that the recordings were the recordings of the Crime Commission hearing, and 500 pages of transcript also?

I think it was due to the wording in an ABC article perhaps.

Here's the link.

Australia - Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, NSW, 12 Sep 2014 - #71

There doesn't seem to be a date mentioned for FFC's trial. " ..... November 3 and 4 were chosen as dates the hearing would take place." William Tyrrells foster mother to fight false or misleading charge So we will probably hear more about FD's charges before we hear more about FM's. I...

www.websleuths.com

 

[katydid23]

No...... but we can take an educated guess that it was just prior to the Fosters having the children removed from their home...
imo

Right, so it probably coincided with the girl being told her parents were now the prime suspects in William's disappearance?

I can only imagine how volatile, chaotic and emotional that would have been for all involved.

If the foster patents are guilty then I have no sympathy whatsoever. But if they are not, and FM had a meltdown because of all the stress from being falsely accused, then I do have compassion for her situation.

 

[katydid23]

But we don't know that the child had any problematic behaviour. This is the defence of a person who has been accused of abuse.

But even if the child did have problematic behaviour I think the allegations if proven to be true do indicate that the FM possibly has anger issues and inability to appropriately manage a child with difficult behaviours.

And I think, if true, it's likely that this has always been her style of parenting. It goes towards a pattern of behaviour IMO, as opposed to a one off heated exchange.

The magistrates comments were in reference to the media's interest in this case. Why were the media interested in this child abuse case when it's at the low end of the child abuse cases that the court sees.

Of course the magistrate knew why the interest - WT. But imo she was making the point that there is horrific child abuse happening everyday that's never reported on by the media. And perhaps it should be.

But just because there are more horrible cases, doesn't make this case less horrible IMO.

I think it is interesting that there have not been any teachers coming forward in the past years, seeing bruises etc.

It seems possible that this came about right at same time that parents were named as new suspects in William's case.

Could that have been the catalyst for the family turmoil?

Maybe there were never any incidents of abuse until this family meltdown?

 

[Doesitmakesense]

It makes me wonder if they were under surveillance and they've got recordings of the alleged assault?

I seem to remember a reference to there being lots of evidence including recordings?

If they do have recordings, and then listened to the FM lie about the incident. If I was LE I would be comparing this current statement to WT statements

 

[SLouTh]

My question is when did it happen? Was it around Dec of 2021?

The Australian reported that the FP's had been charged with alleged assault on Nov 17, 2021.
So prior to that date.

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/nation/william-tyrrell-foster-parents-charged-with-assault/news-story/aa50404777b4bd42f5a73038e3d4dfbf

 

[SLouTh]

New Free Article and video here

New details revealed about assault allegations against William Tyrrell's foster parents after suppression lifted

www.9news.com.au