Bosma Murder Trial - Weekend Discussion #2

[cansleuther]

This was my very first interpretation. Maybe some bit of wisdom or prepping his lawyer imparted to him.

If it's a personal mantra or message to himself, then why write it on both shoes for the entire court to see? Why not just write it on his hand or his notepad? It certainly seems like it could be a message to someone following the case - not necessarily gang members, but possibly his former girlfriend, friends, or family?

JMO.

 

[dar107]

Considering that both of these other cases happened less than a year prior to the TB case, and LE finally started actually investigating the WM and LB deaths when DM was arrested for the TB murder, I would think that it is likely these types of cell records would still have been available to them. While there is probably a maximum time period that this information is stored, I would hope that it would be kept for at least a year or two.

I would also think that cell phone records showing DM's phone, MS's phone and LB's phone pinging from the same tower in an area where DM owned a property right before LB and her phone went off the radar forever, might be one of the reasons why they have also been charged with her murder and there is another direct indictment in that case.

MOO

Totally agree. Makes total sense as to the two of them being charged in LB's case. I found this, it is not really that clear as it just says bills, but I will keep digging.

https://www.rogers.com/cms/images/en/S35635 Rogers-2013-Transparency-Report-EN.pdf
6.
How long do you keep customer information?
We only keep information for as long as it’s required for business purposes or as required by law. For example, we are required by law to keep customer bills for seven years. We don’t keep our customers’ communications like text messages and emails because our customers’ privacy is important and we don’t need this information"

 

[Tealgrove]

Just some thoughts on the GUN.

I don't think the same gun was used for WM and TB. WM''s death was initially ruled a suicide. A suicide by a shot to the head. I am assuming that to infer a suicide the gun MUST have been present when WM was found and therefore the police would have knowledge of it and perhaps even have it in their possession. I am also guessing that this gun was obtained illegally and therefore no permits to own it would be in place. I think the gun that killed WM would either have been confiscated at the time as being illegal or just as part of their investigation. As such, DM would not have had access to it to use in the TB murder. LEGAL Handguns in Canada are restricted weapons and are subject to many more regulations than shotguns or rifles. Handguns are a big deal here in Canada and no one has the "right" to carry them.

As for LB's phone records, I recall reading an article last night and I know that I'm not going to be able to find it, but I believe it is common knowledge that the last calls made from LB's phone were to Dellen Millard. If they know that, then I believe they will have all the data on those calls, pings and towers too.

After witnessing the "goods" LE have on DM with respect to cell phones and towers and pings and his movements, he might reconsider defending himself in the LB murder trial. He's gonna need a lot of help I think.

MOO

 

[ArianeEmory]

If it's a personal mantra or message to himself, then why write it on both shoes for the entire court to see? Why not just write it on his hand or his notepad? It certainly seems like it could be a message to someone following the case - not necessarily gang members, but possibly his former girlfriend, friends, or family?

JMO.

There have to be easier ways to get messages out. I understand there are no-contact lists, but he has a lawyer and I assume he is allowed visits from family.

 

[Gumshew]

I dunno, "calm blue ocean" is a mantra for those soothing themselves, and Pacific literally means calm and at peace.

Maybe it is just a reminder for him to keep his cool and take it one day at a time?

It could be, I'm not discounting anything. It's just that it meaning something like a "calm blue ocean" mantra was not at all what popped into my head when I first saw it. I mean, we're speculating about a person who is known to LE, chilled on and off with gang members, seems(ed) to get a kick out of acting in a very very gory video and is now on trial for murder with dismemberment and incineration sprinkled in.

 

[SnooperDuper]

It could be, I'm not discounting anything. It's just that it meaning something like a "calm blue ocean" mantra was not at all what popped into my head when I first saw it. I mean, we're speculating about a person who is known to LE, chilled on and off with gang members, seems(ed) to get a kick out of acting in a very very gory video and is now on trial for murder with dismemberment and incineration sprinkled in.

But are these gang members or showmen with a side business in guns and drugs? MWJ is a performer and you don't have to look to far these days to see guys who are literally covered in tats from head to, well waist who work in the entertainment industry.

Careful not to give MWJ more credit than he deserves.

Although with the cocaine, he has to be connected to somebody in gangland...but that doesn't mean he's a gangster, just that he's known to and accepted by one.

 

[Gumshew]

But are these gang members or showmen with a side business in guns and drugs? MWJ is a performer and you don't have to look to far these days to see guys who are literally covered in tats from head to, well waist who work in the entertainment industry.

Careful not to give MWJ more credit than he deserves.

Although with the cocaine, he has to be connected to somebody in gangland...but that doesn't mean he's a gangster, just that he's known to and accepted by one.

You can be covered with tattoos from head to toe and not be a gangster. There are wannabe rapper tattoos and there are real gangster tattoos. He's not a wannabe.

Side businesses in guns, drugs, prostitution-- are run by organization.

Gang tattoos are a beacon to other members and a very personal sort of artwork to the wearer. No regular tattoo artist is going to agree to tattoo a no. 14 with homage to Santa Muerte below it, on your face, or SIG, or an area code on the top of your head.

 

[Sphinx]

Where is the evidence that says MS carried a backpack? Unless I am confused, I thought it was testified by witnesses in cross that they did not see him carrying a backpack. I don't think a hoodie and a backpack would be very exclusive to MS. And Ancaster is out of MS usual area on his own. He relied on others to get places.

Picture of DM with MS, who is wearing a black backpack type of bag slung over his shoulder. I could not copy and post the picture directly, but here is the url for the article from 2013 that appeared in The Calgary Sun . You have to go through almost all the pictures to 33 out of 34 to see DM and SM near a blue car, at the end of a driveway. If someone else can post the picture, that would be great.

http://www.calgarysun.com/2013/05/23/tim-bosma-case-mark-smich-charged-with

This link may not work, so here is the title of the article and you can search it on google. I am sorry this is so awkward. It appeared in The Calgary Sun, and was first reported in The Toronto Sun.


Tim Bosma case: Mark Smich charged with first-degree murder

By Michele Mandel, Toronto Sun

First posted: Thursday, May 23, 2013 07:50 AM MDT | Updated: Thursday, May 23, 2013 08:03 AM MDT




I also went through old posts and on May 22, 2013 on Websleuth this post appeared :

meadsipper
05-22-2013, 02:24 PM
Was this yesterday?

FWIW, this location is about 5 minutes from where Audrey Gleave lived. I hate to flog a dead horse, but things related to her just keep popping up...

Keep flogging. Does anyone else think that her case might become hot again?

The above post was referencing other posts about the graffiti that MS put on an overpass, and he was arrested for that. I think that Meadsipper was saying that the overpass is only about 5 min. drive away from where Audrey lived.

I hope this helps. Maybe this picture, and the fact that Audrey's killer might have been the man a neighbour saw walking down her driveway wearing a black backpack about the time of her death in the rural area of Ancaster, where Tim Bosma also lived, caused one lawyer ( sorry I cannot remember who ) to ask a witness ( again I cannot remember who ) and no more time to search today -- if MS was wearing a backpack when he came for a testdrive. Two deaths in the same area, and Audrey's nice, fast, white Camero might have had a similar attraction to car thieves as the powerful Black Dodge Ram truck owned by TB. I know it is only a remote possibility, but it is attention to the little details that often leads Le to solving crimes.

 

[canadiangirl]

The box cutter would have been introduced by prosecution as a murder weapon if this were the scenario. They would also have presented testing for blood residue on and inside the box cutter.

His body was burned. Can it actually proven what the murder weapon was? Can they introduce something as a murder weapon if they have no proof? All I've read right now was that they found one. Are they done all the blood part of the trial at this point or is there more to come? Likely I'm thinking a blood expert will be called in I'm sure

 

[SnooperDuper]

His body was burned. Can it actually proven what the murder weapon was? Can they introduce something as a murder weapon if they have no proof? All I've read right now was that they found one. Are they done all the blood part of the trial at this point or is there more to come? Likely I'm thinking a blood expert will be called in I'm sure

The same witness that was documenting evidence in the truck will continue on Tuesday. After that we can expect to hear from someone from Toronto's Centre of Forensic Sciences (CFS) to give the results of lab testing of the evidence.

Any juror who is a fan of "CSI" would have found McLellan's evidence riveting. (She returns to the stand Tuesday.) It will be up to CFS scientists to testify to the lab results for all those samples that were collected.

http://www.thespec.com/news-story/6...idence-in-the-bosma-case-and-the-csi-effect-/

 

[canadiangirl]

Anyone notice that the Dee Em facebook page is now kaput?

I haven't looked in years. Was it up and running for a while after his arrest? Figured LE would've shut it all down?

 

[Tamarind]

I think some people may be in denial about DM and MS's circle of associations, hence it's hard for them to picture DM, especially, as capable of having a sinister side.

The word "PACIFIC" that MS wrote on his sneakers, visible at trial, is an association. He is showing he is loyal to it. Whether guilty or not, in my opinion, there is a dynamic going on at the trial, between DM and MS, in opposing loyalties. Perhaps this dynamic is giving the impression that DM might be not guilty. But consider the obvious, if faced with life in prison, wouldn't anyone try to put their best face on and grasp at any straw?

I also think some people are in denial, in that the evidence to date has not put forth anything that seals a guilty verdict for either accused. It also hasn't ruled out any associations that MS may be protecting. IMO

 

[jash]

Picture of DM with MS, who is wearing a black backpack type of bag slung over his shoulder. I could not copy and post the picture directly, but here is the url for the article from 2013 that appeared in The Calgary Sun . You have to go through almost all the pictures to 33 out of 34 to see DM and SM near a blue car, at the end of a driveway. If someone else can post the picture, that would be great.

http://www.calgarysun.com/2013/05/23/tim-bosma-case-mark-smich-charged-with

This link may not work, so here is the title of the article and you can search it on google. I am sorry this is so awkward. It appeared in The Calgary Sun, and was first reported in The Toronto Sun.


Tim Bosma case: Mark Smich charged with first-degree murder

By Michele Mandel, Toronto Sun

First posted: Thursday, May 23, 2013 07:50 AM MDT | Updated: Thursday, May 23, 2013 08:03 AM MDT




I also went through old posts and on May 22, 2013 on Websleuth this post appeared :

meadsipper
05-22-2013, 02:24 PM
Was this yesterday?

FWIW, this location is about 5 minutes from where Audrey Gleave lived. I hate to flog a dead horse, but things related to her just keep popping up...

Keep flogging. Does anyone else think that her case might become hot again?

The above post was referencing other posts about the graffiti that MS put on an overpass, and he was arrested for that. I think that Meadsipper was saying that the overpass is only about 5 min. drive away from where Audrey lived.

I hope this helps. Maybe this picture, and the fact that Audrey's killer might have been the man a neighbour saw walking down her driveway wearing a black backpack about the time of her death in the rural area of Ancaster, where Tim Bosma also lived, caused one lawyer ( sorry I cannot remember who ) to ask a witness ( again I cannot remember who ) and no more time to search today -- if MS was wearing a backpack when he came for a testdrive. Two deaths in the same area, and Audrey's nice, fast, white Camero might have had a similar attraction to car thieves as the powerful Black Dodge Ram truck owned by TB. I know it is only a remote possibility, but it is attention to the little details that often leads Le to solving crimes.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...ree-murder-in-tim-bosma-case/article12090623/

 

[Tamarind]

His body was burned. Can it actually proven what the murder weapon was? Can they introduce something as a murder weapon if they have no proof? All I've read right now was that they found one. Are they done all the blood part of the trial at this point or is there more to come? Likely I'm thinking a blood expert will be called in I'm sure

If a bullet is found lodged in a skull or other bone of fully identified remains, I guess they could prove it it had been shot. IMO. Then a bullet would need to match a gun, or gun residue which may or may not be harder to prove. Then they would have to prove who did it. A motive would be handy too if they are claiming 1st degree murder. Otherwise I think they would have to go to 2nd or manslaughter JMO.

 

[SnooperDuper]

I haven't looked in years. Was it up and running for a while after his arrest? Figured LE would've shut it all down?

It was a going concern until quite recently...perhaps the start of the trial...?

 

[canadiangirl]

I don't think there are many that actually believe Millard is innocent, but has the evidence presented thus far enough to say that he is 100% guilty?

As I said, I think he's guilty, we just haven't reached that defining piece of evidence yet. If I was on the jury I could almost convict him now, but I could probably convince a few jurors not to as well.

<rsbm> I couldn't bold what I wanted sorry. That's exactly the point. The fact you can put a doubt in someone's mind so far is the key point. Not something you want a jury member thinking. They need to believe they committed this crime to convict. If I can ask these questions why can't a jury member? I'm not saying he's innocent by raising questions, theories or opinion but is he guilty at this point in time? Not yet. In 4 months ..... different story. MOO

 

[Tamarind]

When MS took possession of the gun, he apparently tried to sell it. No doubt it was wiped down for that purpose. And since he was the last person who had the gun, out of the lockbox that DM supposedly put it in, it would be most likely that only his fingerprints, if any, are found on it. I think he's in a catch 22 position here. Would a jury believe that as the reason why only his fingerprints turn up on the gun?

I think the gun is going to stay buried in the forest.

MOO

I don't believe there has been any evidence presented that shows that DM put the gun in a tool box and locked it. For all we know MS or someone else at the hangar could have. Just an observation.

 

[cansleuther]

Picture of DM with MS, who is wearing a black backpack type of bag slung over his shoulder.

There are at least a couple of other pictures online of MS wearing a black backpack, although they are on FB and cannot be posted here. In one, he is playing with DM's dog, and in the other he is wearing a ski mask in the woods - and a black backpack is visible in both.

 

[canadiangirl]

It was a going concern until quite recently...perhaps the start of the trial...?

Wow I didn't start reading again until day one of the trial. Interesting thanks

 

[Tamarind]

Any way you can put that into English for me? That was waaaay too much legalese for this brain.....post-offence conduct is circumstantial, there can be more than one explanation for it, but doesn't need to be believed beyond a reasonable doubt (unlike the final verdict)? So looking at DM's conduct after the crime one would need to decide if his actions are "consistent with the conduct of a guilty person and inconsistent with the conduct of an innocent person"?

I think that would depend on what it is that he is claimed to be guilty of, and also what can be proven that he is guilty of? JMO