Bosma Murder Trial - Weekend Discussion #7

[flipflop]

Why didn't DM choose CN to be his partner in this? Can she drive? I believe she conspired in at least one of the three murders. JMO

She did not have the criminal past like MS to blame everything on. IMO

 

[Inspector_North]

billandrew, :tyou:

Sorry about that. The PPK 380 spent casing seemed to be a focus for awhile. Not sure why, the shell would most likely end up in the back of the truck even if DM did the shooting from the front.

Here is the shell ejecting from a PPK in slow motion. You decide.

[video=youtube;6uSwBUzWl5I]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uSwBUzWl5I[/video]

 

[musicaljoke]

Why didn't DM choose CN to be his partner in this? Can she drive? I believe she conspired in at least one of the three murders. JMO

Because there was some heavy lifting in the plans.

 

[brightii]

Just thinking aloud again - sorry, if I'm annoying anyone!

I'm thinking about the alleged chop shop and previously stolen vehicles stored at the hangar. Someone would have had to have stolen them and DM would have had some awareness of these thefts if not direct involvement (as in physically being present at the scene of the thefts), IMO. Until TB's murder any of this alleged activity remained under LE's radar, IMO. Perhaps MS was involved in these previous vehicle thefts directly or he may have had contacts that were, IMO. If so, it would make sense that MS went along with DM to get TB's truck, IMO. DM may have been paying someone for the stolen vehicles previously which I presume would be “chopped” and parts sold quickly, but this one (TB’s truck) would be driven by him and sticking around so he decided to go get it himself and take someone (MS) who had experience with vehicle thefts, IMO, and also someone (MS) who looked more suspicious in appearance and demeanour than DM (as SB/WdB/IT all testified). This is all just me wondering aloud.

I wonder if the Crown will make mention of other stolen vehicles at the hangar, as that, IMO, would show a pattern that is relevant to the TB crimes.

It makes sense to me that DM and perhaps MS too felt they wouldn't get caught for yet another vehicle theft since they had not yet been caught to date (May 2013), and as MsSherlock mentioned in her post above, DM, and perhaps MS too, had prior experience with getting away with murder(s) allegedly, (LB, both charged; and WM, DM charged) so in that light, perhaps neither DM or MS felt that the risk of being detected was too great, IMO. The very thought of taking such a terrible risk boggles my mind, but then again, I am neither a thief nor a murderer.

Neither defendant is particularly smart or intelligent, IMO, and so far the facts of the case bear out that opinion, with the evidence trail for LE making them seem more like a cruel and callous version of Hansel and Gretel. I do think DM is a very dangerous and powerful leader of misfits, and MS was among some pathetic losers looking for somewhere to fit in, IMO, and likely willing to steal in order to do so, IMO. By following DM's direction, MS indeed got himself into very deep trouble, but I suspect MS somehow never expected it would all lead to murder or covering up murder(s), IMO.

And from what I observe, DM always involves someone in everything he does which makes me think he is actually quite needy and dependent on others and without a following, he feels completely out of control, powerless, impotent, empty and alone, IMO.

At least that's how I see things today. As the testimony continues, I reserve the right to change my mind.

All MOO.

 

[mskrisc]

It seems the presented evidence answers all the speculation questions along the way. Can't wait for CN and MM to testify, will they stick handle in a phone both to defend their men, or will they start the bus, and put it in drive. RE: the wash down of TB truck and the garden hose evidence yet to be presented, a picture tells a thousand words when I see TB's truck parked on a green tarp at the hangar. All MOO

Puzzled by the garden hose testimony. Any thoughts or theories on the relevance?

 

[mskrisc]

When I saw this picture of SS's home made incinerator, this statement from DM's jail house interview popped into my mind and made me chuckle. “I didn’t do it … They might as well accuse me of having been to the moon.”

This reminds me of some young 'uns half finished school project on building a rocket hahaha. Apparently SS completed the rocket and DM has been to the moon. :secret:

View attachment 91016

Lol! It does look like some elementary school science fair project! Lol! Idk I'd want him working on my car. [emoji12]

 

[MsSherlock]

I gotta quote that jailhouse letter because I'm just loving it now:



http://news.nationalpost.com/news/c...rn-to-world-of-fast-cars-and-exotic-adventure

That letter really struck a chord with some of DM's defenders on the site. Is it a wild plea to ask why no one is looking at the Columbian contractors?

When DM wrote that letter we didn't know about JV did we? There hadn't been any mention of the Columbian contractors and I don't even think they had CN yet.

"Millard wrote the letters from June 2013 through March 2014.

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/c...rn-to-world-of-fast-cars-and-exotic-adventure

Noudga was arrested in April 2014.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamil...tina-noudga-to-go-straight-to-trial-1.2961734

So exactly what would DM have been talking about? What had been published at that time? Background info on MS. Info about how wealthy DM was suppose to be. The fact that TB's remains were found on the farm. Where the truck was found? The incinerator.

BBM"but what I will say, is that “the facts” they keep repeating, don’t match the disclosure I am given. I thought by now some, even one, of those so called ‘investigative’ journalists would have picked up on some of discrepancies in what police are telling them. I thought the public might have noticed some of the things that are out of place in the news articles."

OK- MSM may have been insinuating the incinerator was used at the farm- but there was no way to know otherwise and yes, his disclosure would have indicated something different. I've racked my brains on this one trying to figure out what he was talking about. MSM published consistent info and LE had a tight seal on the investigation- I have no idea what was out of place. MOO

 

[deugirtni]

I gotta quote that jailhouse letter because I'm just loving it now:

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/c...rn-to-world-of-fast-cars-and-exotic-adventure

That letter really struck a chord with some of DM's defenders on the site. Is it a wild plea to ask why no one is looking at the Columbian contractors?

Wow, thanks for finding that. That was only what, 12 days after his arrest, and he was saying the 'disclosure' did not match what the newspapers were saying? I wonder how little disclosure he even had by then, if any at all? Disclosure took months. Wow, was he in for a shocker when he finally DID see ALLLLLLLLLLLL of the disclosure! Yes, eat your hat! He had no CLUE how much they had, and how much they were still in the process of getting and analyzing and visiting and interviewing and fetching statements.. OMG, incredible! Too bad he didn't do that interview!

ETA: Just realized I read the year wrong in the newspaper article (I can't find the text crossout feature here), so I guess we do not know the date when this was written or is there a copy of it somewhere? In any case, the investigation proceeded on and on even while the 2 were in prison awaiting their trial. Any new info could have arisen during that entire span of time. I recall the lawyer talking about having not yet received full disclosure, and it seemed like it was months after the arrests. I'm guessing CN's 'disclosure' would not have been available. Would be great if someone had the date on that jailhouse letter!

 

[MsSherlock]

Can anyone shed any light as to what this was all about? It's dated March 17th, 2016- that was just a week ago.

https://www.canlii.org/en/ca/scc-l/...AAQAORGVsbGVuIE1pbGxhcmQAAAAAAQ&resultIndex=1

 

[SnooperDuper]

Can anyone shed any light as to what this was all about? It's dated March 17th, 2016- that was just a week ago.

https://www.canlii.org/en/ca/scc-l/...AAQAORGVsbGVuIE1pbGxhcmQAAAAAAQ&resultIndex=1

It must go with this

http://www.scc-csc.ca/case-dossier/info/dock-regi-eng.aspx?cas=36766

Criminal law – Self-incrimination – Testimony – Whether the judge’s order compels the testimony of the Applicant pursuant to s. 527 of the Criminal Code

The Applicant seeks leave to appeal the orders of MacDonnell J. dated August 17, 2015 and Belobaba J. dated December 2, 2015.

http://www.scc-csc.ca/case-dossier/info/sum-som-eng.aspx?cas=36766

DM was being compelled to testimony, appealed, and won?

 

[MsSherlock]

It must go with this

http://www.scc-csc.ca/case-dossier/info/dock-regi-eng.aspx?cas=36766


http://www.scc-csc.ca/case-dossier/info/sum-som-eng.aspx?cas=36766

DM was being compelled to testimony, appealed, and won?

I read it that he has longer to file for the leave to appeal. Looks like it pertains to his self defence in the LB case? Busy boy.

 

[MsSherlock]

It must go with this

http://www.scc-csc.ca/case-dossier/info/dock-regi-eng.aspx?cas=36766


http://www.scc-csc.ca/case-dossier/info/sum-som-eng.aspx?cas=36766

DM was being compelled to testimony, appealed, and won?

Can someone refresh me- have we seen these Counsel names before?
http://www.scc-csc.ca/case-dossier/info/counsel-procureurs-eng.aspx?cas=36766

 

[CJPRINCESS]

Can someone refresh me- have we seen these Counsel names before?
http://www.scc-csc.ca/case-dossier/info/counsel-procureurs-eng.aspx?cas=36766

There is a publication ban, so could be for LB or WM's case. That lawyer has a long list what he defends. So if it is pertainingto LB case, then it looks like he decided to retain council.
Thats If it's NOT linked to the next part of my post.

I read it that he has longer to file for the leave to appeal. Looks like it pertains to his self defence in the LB case? Busy boy.

From what I understand you can only appeal something that's already been tried and lost in the courts. Whatever case he lost he is now asking to take to a higher court to overturn that ruling. So I doubt it's for the LB case as he hasn't been tried for it yet.

 

[Kamille]

Just thinking aloud again - sorry, if I'm annoying anyone!

I'm thinking about the alleged chop shop and previously stolen vehicles stored at the hangar. Someone would have had to have stolen them and DM would have had some awareness of these thefts if not direct involvement (as in physically being present at the scene of the thefts), IMO. Until TB's murder any of this alleged activity remained under LE's radar, IMO. Perhaps MS was involved in these previous vehicle thefts directly or he may have had contacts that were, IMO. If so, it would make sense that MS went along with DM to get TB's truck, IMO. DM may have been paying someone for the stolen vehicles previously which I presume would be “chopped” and parts sold quickly, but this one (TB’s truck) would be driven by him and sticking around so he decided to go get it himself and take someone (MS) who had experience with vehicle thefts, IMO, and also someone (MS) who looked more suspicious in appearance and demeanour than DM (as SB/WdB/IT all testified). This is all just me wondering aloud.

I wonder if the Crown will make mention of other stolen vehicles at the hangar, as that, IMO, would show a pattern that is relevant to the TB crimes.

It makes sense to me that DM and perhaps MS too felt they wouldn't get caught for yet another vehicle theft since they had not yet been caught to date (May 2013), and as MsSherlock mentioned in her post above, DM, and perhaps MS too, had prior experience with getting away with murder(s) allegedly, (LB, both charged; and WM, DM charged) so in that light, perhaps neither DM or MS felt that the risk of being detected was too great, IMO. The very thought of taking such a terrible risk boggles my mind, but then again, I am neither a thief nor a murderer.

Neither defendant is particularly smart or intelligent, IMO, and so far the facts of the case bear out that opinion, with the evidence trail for LE making them seem more like a cruel and callous version of Hansel and Gretel. I do think DM is a very dangerous and powerful leader of misfits, and MS was among some pathetic losers looking for somewhere to fit in, IMO, and likely willing to steal in order to do so, IMO. By following DM's direction, MS indeed got himself into very deep trouble, but I suspect MS somehow never expected it would all lead to murder or covering up murder(s), IMO.

And from what I observe, DM always involves someone in everything he does which makes me think he is actually quite needy and dependent on others and without a following, he feels completely out of control, powerless, impotent, empty and alone, IMO.

At least that's how I see things today. As the testimony continues, I reserve the right to change my mind.

All MOO.

To date there has been no evidence that (other than MM's trailer and motorcycle) there were any stolen vehicles in the hangar. In fact, we've had an officer give testimony that there were at least 30 vehicles active or inactive that were registered to DM or one of the Millard companies. So I do not believe, despite what the media initially reported, that there were any stolen vehicles in the hangar that would indicate any type of vehicle theft/chop shop type "business". Trailer thefts? Yes, I'd imagine there were a few of them. We know of at least one. Maybe even some other odd things that do not belong in an airplane hangar like perhaps a wood chipper? Things that can be hooked up to a trailer hitch and just towed away from their rightful owner. Did we ever see any of those types of things being sold off by SS after DM's arrest?

It appears that even LE, in the beginning, could not believe that DM would have a collection of vehicles like that in an airplane hangar just for his own personal use/hobby. So their initial reaction was "looks like a hangar full of stolen vehicles and parts. Might be a chop shop".

MOO

 

[matou]

Seems like DM is spending a lot of time in court against the Her Majesty the Queen for some reason(s).

 

[Kamille]

Seems like DM is spending a lot of time in court against the Her Majesty the Queen for some reason(s).

It'll be his new career for many years to come. I'm thinking he's rather enjoying it myself.

MOO

 

[Elisabeth]

Might he be appealing the direct indictment? (no preliminary hearing). Did i get that right? His charges are going straight to trial?

supreme court of canada. surely it isn't the tenant case?

 

[tinkr]

I've been following these threads since May 2013, but this is my first post. I'm hope I'm doing it right! First a huge thank you to everyone here. I love reading all your theories, thoughts and how good your memories are when it comes to evidence in this case!

Just for my own curiosity - can anyone confirm if this is the Riverside unit DM and CN had JV show them? And he wasn't sure if they had entered the bathroom or not?

http://www.homefinder.ca/m-listings/5310709-307-riverside-dr-unit-2-toronto-ontario-w3430107

 

[Kamille]

I've been following these threads since May 2013, but this is my first post. I'm hope I'm doing it right! First a huge thank you to everyone here. I love reading all your theories, thoughts and how good your memories are when it comes to evidence in this case!

Just for my own curiosity - can anyone confirm if this is the Riverside unit DM and CN had JV show them? And he wasn't sure if they had entered the bathroom or not?

http://www.homefinder.ca/m-listings/5310709-307-riverside-dr-unit-2-toronto-ontario-w3430107

Welcome tinkr :welcome:

Yes that does appear to be the Riverside Dr complex that is now under new ownership. Interesting that Unit 2, which is supposed to have been the one JV was renovating for DM and that he and CN checked out that week, is up for rent now when it was just mentioned in the trial. Thanks for posting the link.

MOO

ETA: On May 4th, DM had asked JV, in a text, for him to bring the key to Unit 2 because he and CN wanted to go and check out the renovations. From what I understood from the tweets, JV opened the apt for them while they checked it out and then locked it behind them. But he did say that there were other keys to the apt and that maybe DM had one. (perhaps he just didn't have one with him at that time?) He didn't specify that they had entered the bathroom but the Crown did elicit testimony that even though the unit was under renovation, the bath and shower were operational. Not sure why they wanted to make that clear but I have a feeling we're going to find out.

 

[tinkr]

Welcome tinkr :welcome:

Yes that does appear to be the Riverside Dr complex that is now under new ownership. Interesting that Unit 2, which is supposed to have been the one JV was renovating for DM and that he and CN checked out that week, is up for rent now when it was just mentioned in the trial. Thanks for posting the link.

MOO

ETA: On May 4th, DM had asked JV, in a text, for him to bring the key to Unit 2 because he and CN wanted to go and check out the renovations. From what I understood from the tweets, JV opened the apt for them while they checked it out and then locked it behind them. But he did say that there were other keys to the apt and that maybe DM had one. (perhaps he just didn't have one with him at that time?) He didn't specify that they had entered the bathroom but the Crown did elicit testimony that even though the unit was under renovation, the bath and shower were operational. Not sure why they wanted to make that clear but I have a feeling we're going to find out.

Thank you!

The place definitely looks to be much better taken care of now from the outside (as opposed to previous photos I have seen).

Based on the fact Unit 2 was being renovated for DM to live in, I'm going to assume it was one of the "fancier" units. Another of the units is at this link and from the kitchen you can see it is much less upscale: http://www.rentcompass.com/Rentals/Toronto/Apartment/307-Riverside-Dr/L29561

Unit 2 is currently listed for just under $3000/month. DM's lawyer made such a big deal about the rent JV paid being such a great deal. But in my opinion, if his unit was under renovation and no where near as fancy as Unit 2 (as seen in the other unit's link) he really wasn't getting a crazy deal paying $1700/month. Yes $1000 was low, but again who knows what condition it was in at the time.

I'm definitely looking forward to next week and finding out more about what possibly took place at Riverside.