CA CA - Bob Harrod, 81, Orange County, 27 July 2009 - #11

[Oriah]

I'd say it sounds like there was a 'heated exchange' over someone putting the trash out too early, with maybe animals getting into it. Those sort of minor neighbourly disputes can really escalate - I remember seeing one of our WSers' stories about her brother and his wife being shot dead in a dispute over - now I can't think of the name; one of those ditches in the earth to channel floods. The word was there and now it's gone. Sorry about that.

Are you thinking of a storm drain?

 

[Oriah]

Yes, that just sounds like someone with no respect for authority and/or the neighbours. Unless the garden was filled with junk or something?

ETA: Maybe like a fine for each week the junk was left there?

Perhaps a local could weigh in on this? I would be really curious to know. Perhaps they were out of town during that time period and were just being re-fined?
But that's a pretty extended period of time.

 

[zwiebel]

Are you thinking of a storm drain?

Thanks, yes I am, but I was sure there was another, single word description for it. That will annoy me for hours now.

 

[believe09]

Now I am lost, lol-are we talking about AH and his family putting garbage out early and animals dragged it into storm drains?

I must have the wrong end of the stick here.

 

[believe09]

Yes, that just sounds like someone with no respect for authority and/or the neighbours. Unless the garden was filled with junk or something?

ETA: Maybe like a fine for each week the junk was left there?

Ah ha-maybe so. Perhaps it was construction waste.

 

[zwiebel]

I wanted to get back to this-of course Mrs Harrod's attorney couldnt represent AH as a criminal attorney because he isnt. It appears to me that AH had already been represented by a criminal attorney-perhaps he didnt like the representation he received. David Medina seems pretty learned. At least, he doesnt have any bar violations unlike AH's current civil atty.

With just a few noble exceptions, nothing and no-one in this case seems to be upright or straightforward. There seems to be a veneer of doing things 'correctly', in line with peoples' 'wishes', then when you get under the surface just a little........

 

[Oriah]

Now I am lost, lol-are we talking about AH and his family putting garbage out early and animals dragged it into storm drains?

I must have the wrong end of the stick here.

I will investigate the trash situation. Cause now I am really curious! Personally I have some experience with (where I am, it's black bears) who know when trash days are, and will visit residences the night before, when many people put their trash out for pickup. They have it down to a science, lol. But the Harrod residence was located in a much different environment.

And I still think it's odd that the first date of that complaint coincided with a disturbing the peace plea. :waitasec:

 

[zwiebel]

I will investigate the trash situation. Cause now I am really curious! Personally I have some experience with (where I am, it's black bears) who know when trash days are, and will visit residences the night before, when many people put their trash out for pickup. They have it down to a science, lol. But the Harrod residence was located in a much different environment.

And I still think it's odd that the first date of that complaint coincided with a disturbing the peace plea. :waitasec:

It is odd. But there does seem to be a sort of vengeful streak running through this case as well.

By the way, bears!!!!! I had a seagull problem once and thought that was bad enough!

 

[believe09]

I love how critters adapt...I think we have had some feeding of black bears discussion on these threads before...that was another misdemeanor situation for another Harrod family member, iirc.

It could be as simple as mean spirited neighbors picking on the AH's. Over and Over-that might cause me to disturb the peace as well.

 

[GrainneDhu]

I always thought that was a very strange thing to do. Just a quick search tells me there doesn't seem to be any shortage of criminal attorneys in CA. In AH's position I would have thought straight away there were strong reasons why FH's attorney wouldn't be able to represent/assist us both.
It has crossed my mind it may have been something of a fishing expedition too?
If that's the case, I bet he didn't catch even a tiddler......

His enquiry to Mr Algorri was actually not that uncommon. The whole conflict of interest thing is something a lot of people don't even think about. Plus, I have read in many cases where someone teetering on the brink of a confession asks someone whose position is rather odd (such as a policeman) whether they should get a lawyer.

I do not understand it, all I know is that I have observed this in other cases.

 

[mikkismom]

Yes, thanks mikkismom. It looked to me like there was a $100 fine for each infraction, and perhaps those were paid off and that's why they were dismissed?
The disturbing the peace issue coincides with the first trash complaint. Do you know if they would have fined all owners of the residence? Or how that works? TIA if you know.

Just wanted to answer this... There would be one fine for each infraction not each owner. If not paid, they can add it to your property taxes (at least here.) It could be something like trash left out front for a long time, junk in yard (hoarding type situation), junk sitting on porch, car on blocks etc. Usually it doesn't go to court unless previous letters or visits are ignored. Here, they get called into Mayor's Court - if they want a trial, it goes to the County Court.

Most places are pretty lenient about this. It has to be an obvious issue for them to take it to court - visible from off of the property, health issue and/or safety issue.

jmo - hth

 

[GrainneDhu]

Thanks, yes I am, but I was sure there was another, single word description for it. That will annoy me for hours now.

A swale or an arroyo? Both of those are low places on the ground that occasionally have water flowing through them but are usually dry.

ETA: or could you be thinking of a ditch?

 

[zwiebel]

A swale or an arroyo? Both of those are low places on the ground that occasionally have water flowing through them but are usually dry.

ETA: or could you be thinking of a ditch?

That's what it was but not the name I saw in the post. I'm dreading having to go back and find it, but will have to If I don't remember soon.

 

[zwiebel]

Just wanted to answer this... There would be one fine for each infraction not each owner. If not paid, they can add it to your property taxes (at least here.) It could be something like trash left out front for a long time, junk in yard (hoarding type situation), junk sitting on porch, car on blocks etc. Usually it doesn't go to court unless previous letters or visits are ignored. Here, they get called into Mayor's Court - if they want a trial, it goes to the County Court.

Most places are pretty lenient about this. It has to be an obvious issue for them to take it to court - visible from off of the property, health issue and/or safety issue.

jmo - hth

Thanks for that. It does seem an odd series of events for that area - all the pictures I've seen, the houses and gardens look as neat as a new pin.

 

[Oriah]

Just wanted to answer this... There would be one fine for each infraction not each owner. If not paid, they can add it to your property taxes (at least here.) It could be something like trash left out front for a long time, junk in yard (hoarding type situation), junk sitting on porch, car on blocks etc. Usually it doesn't go to court unless previous letters or visits are ignored. Here, they get called into Mayor's Court - if they want a trial, it goes to the County Court.

Most places are pretty lenient about this. It has to be an obvious issue for them to take it to court - visible from off of the property, health issue and/or safety issue.

jmo - hth

Thank you, mikkismom! So just for the address, then- not the owners or resident tenants? Correct?

Gosh, I am tired, sorry ya'll! Just trying to figure this out. Seems like it's really important to figure out what was going on in the neighborhood prior to Mr. Harrods disappearance. I feel like we can't ignore that, even if it was prior to. Maybe even more so, kwim?

 

[mikkismom]

Thank you, mikkismom! So just for the address, then- not the owners or resident tenants? Correct?

Gosh, I am tired, sorry ya'll! Just trying to figure this out. Seems like it's really important to figure out what was going on in the neighborhood prior to Mr. Harrods disappearance. I feel like we can't ignore that, even if it was prior to. Maybe even more so, kwim?

bbm - Correct. Here, it is actually the Owner's responsibility. A letter is sent to the owner and the tenant (if different). If fines are involved, it is the owner who is fined. In my experience, repeat violators (in general) have a lack of respect for authority and/or their neighbors. Kind of a 'no-one can tell me what to do' attitude. Really, who wants to live next to a bunch of garbage or cars in pieces?

jmo

 

[believe09]

bbm - Correct. Here, it is actually the Owner's responsibility. A letter is sent to the owner and the tenant (if different). If fines are involved, it is the owner who is fined. In my experience, repeat violators (in general) have a lack of respect for authority and/or their neighbors. Kind of a 'no-one can tell me what to do' attitude. Really, who wants to live next to a bunch of garbage or cars in pieces?

jmo

Thank you for your perspective-perhaps this is the springboard for the disturbing the peace charge that was pled guilty to.

 

[Cubby]

A swale or an arroyo? Both of those are low places on the ground that occasionally have water flowing through them but are usually dry.

ETA: or could you be thinking of a ditch?

Hee, hee, I thought canal or sewer. Those were the first two to come to mind for me.

 

[zwiebel]

Am I right in thinking AH and partner were always officially the owners of that property, not Bob?

 

[zwiebel]

Hee, hee, I thought canal or sewer. Those were the first two to come to mind for me.

Not them either. But by some twist of fate I remembered the location, have found the poster and am now wading through 48 pages of posts to find a single word. I hate myself sometimes, I really do.