CA - Elliot Rodger kills 6, injures 13 in Isla Vista, Near UC Santa Barbara, #1

[Archangel7]

Check out the reimbersment for us, for children, govt funded intervention.

By the time you are done with the session 45 min , the treatment plan 15, the progress note 5, scheduling 5, billing 5, consulting with colleages 15 on each suffering child and divide the time by the payment for the session your at $9.45 cents clear, and putting in60 hour weeks

The Social Worker caseloads are ugh

Anyone working in govt programs (cept VA) Medicare was not bad but they are slashing that now, do it because they care

you are at average 90 minutes per one session

far more than just placate him:

If you did look at the videos, with these kind of disorders, when they aggitated, and you have learned that there behavior is a result of an illiness, then you only goal is to keep everyone safe in the moment

when the first parents engaged him , with all sorts of s"stuff" consequences etc, all that happens is everyhthing escalates, Watch her aggressive behavoirs when dad first tried ttypical parenting for a child not suffering wiht the illiness.

She became more aggressive.But the parents that chose not to understand what is happening and parent the same way as one would do for normative child , which as you can see in the video benefits noone, prolongs the event, increases change of someont getting hurt and does nothing to prevent the next event when their world becomes overwhelming

- its like punishing a amputee for not running like they did before they lost there leg!

I will respectfully respond and then I'll likely be outta here as we are going down the same road as I said was the problem to start with.

I know how unprofessional Children's Aid is here and ridiculous they are with their tactics, abuse of people and funding and NO oversight. I see it EVERYday. They enable worse than the parents do.

Little Johnny throws his money away on alcohol, pot and video games, and includes his "friends to join in" now he has no money, no bus pass, yada yada oh, to the tune of just over 2500 CAD. Some was "given" to him towards his, get this...college, cough, cough. What did the case worker do after setting down, being shown the proof and him admitting to it in person to her?

She gives him 3500 CAD more and upon the crap storm that followed said and if he throws that away I'll replace it too. THAT's TAX MONEY, MY TAX MONEY, YOUR TAX MONEY. Please don't waste time trying to dispel my reality and replace it with "yours", I see this abortion of CAS waste and abuse almost ALL day EVERY day here.

 

[Paladine]

Oh, he was very racist! Although he was half-Asian himself... he hated fully Asian men. He really hated Black and Hispanic men. Ya'll have read it, so I don't have to repeat the horrible things he said about them... especially if he found out that had slept with tall, hot blondes.

No worries, I read it, and agree...it took over 8 hours, yesterday. My BF was totally ignored the entire day, lol.

 

[katydid23]

Right....what appropriate actions is the question.

I can't claim to have the answers but I do know this about me: I am very hyper-focused about my responsibilities to society in regards parenting. Maybe that's a tad odd, maybe not?

ER exhibited some really weird and dangerous behavior from a very young age. He was all-consuming to a parent and yet, the irony is that it seemed he was left dangling on his own in the end. There was no real care going on and he was not taking medications although he had been prescribed some in the past. He didnt suddenly spiral---it was always there, festering and exhibiting itself frequently and in many ways.

Personally, any child of mine that poses threatening actions/demeanor like in the Asperger meltdown video that a WS poster put up here is off to intensive counseling (and perhaps living in a clinical setting) and probably going on meds. Professional mental evaluations, treatment plans, and interventions, STAT. I wouldn't expose myself, spouse, and siblings to a child that screams incessantly, breaks things, cries and rants, and makes no distinction between cause and effect and right from wrong (especially if they haven't learned this by pre-puberty). I would not be in denial; I'd be proactive. I know this would need to be done while this child is young.

And I also know that no matter how wonderful it may seem to relish in the joy of getting rid of an unbalanced, non-coping young adult when they turned 18 and was an "adult" (and let's admit, it's true)......I wouldn't want a person that sick living out amongst the unsuspecting general population (such as roommates at college). It is not fair, it is not right and I think that parent who documented historical actions and psychological evaluations would help ensure the courts that would not allow it. But you would've had to have been the type of parent that was vested, involved, pro-active, committed, resolved and fully aware of what they were dealing with. ER's parents were divorced, father remarried, and lived in Hollywood. Maybe they gave a fairly good effort, maybe.....maybe?

I'm sure we'll hear more.

What's the solution? It's probably multi-faceted. But with any child that exhibits symptoms of a mental illness---I'd keep them away from violent video games.

moo

BBm

"...is off to intensive counseling (and perhaps living in a clinical setting) and probably going on meds. Professional mental evaluations, treatment plans, and interventions, STAT."

THat ^^^ is the key difficulty, right there. We looked high and low for some way to get my brother into a clinical setting. It is not possible unless the patient is VERY severely mentally unstable. And even then, it is usually only for 3 to 6 wks at a a time. And insurance does not pay.

From what we heard, ER WAS getting intensive counseling. He began at age 8, and in middle school was going EVERY SINGLE DAY for treatment. How much more intensive can you get?

We tried the interventions route. It does not help if there are NO places that you can send the patient. Sad but true.

ER would not have been deemed 'insane' enough for mandatory intake. And he cannot be taken in without his consent unless he was severely out of touch with reality.




"I wouldn't want a person that sick living out amongst the unsuspecting general population (such as roommates at college]"


He was an adult and wanted to attend college. He had never done anything violent or aggressive, that they knew about at the time. They thought he was severely depressed and isolated and so the idea of him going to community college was a proper plan, given what they knew. I cannot blame the parents for allowing him to attend college. I am sure he talked a good game and convinced them it was the ideal cure for what ailed him.


"But with any child that exhibits symptoms of a mental illness---I'd keep them away from violent video games"


I agree, ideally. But when Mom is at work, how does she prevent a teenager from playing video games? Thats like preventing your dog from scratching himself.

There is only so much one can do when a child has mental health issues. It is not an easy fix. You cannot change their attitude, their automatic reactions to stimuli, their maladaptive behaviors. You just run around try to put out fires and pray for some semblance of peace. anic:

 

[gngr~snap]

It's not that easy. I believe the family lived in San Jose and it's not easy to get moved because all the rooms are full mid-semester. Even ER had to stick it out with two of the roommates (of many) he hated and he comes from money. I am not sure if the family of the victim had the means to move him into a private apartment? I think if they did... they would have.

The parents also had to sign the lease as guarantors. I don't know when the lease began but it looks like they would have to continue to pay if the son left.


Parental Guaranty
Have your Guarantor complete and sign a Guaranty of Lessee’s Obligations & Guarantor Application online.


http://capriiv.com/lease-now

All posts are my opinion only. Sent via Tapatalk

 

[katydid23]

It's not that easy. I believe the family lived in San Jose and it's not easy to get moved because all the rooms are full mid-semester. Even ER had to stick it out with two of the roommates (of many) he hated and he comes from money. I am not sure if the family of the victim had the means to move him into a private apartment? I think if they did... they would have.

I understand. I certainly dont want to lay any blame on that poor family. Just saying it is sad that the poor kid moved back in there. We had a weird 'emergency' in my DD's freshman yr, and she was physically assaaulted by her female roomie, and the cops came, and the girl said my DD shoved her first and the cops were going to take both in, so my DD dropped her complaint. She called me from the street, in an ambulance after being hit three times in the face by her drunken roomie. My DD had yelled at her for coming home loud and drunk at 3 am, and getting them in trouble with the landlord. [ who lived next door.] So the girl punched her in the face three times.

We pulled her out of the apt. and it was hard finding a change in the middle of the semester. She had to crash at another friends dorm for a week before we found a room to rent. I know it is hard. Just saying I wish they could have seen the bright red flags...

 

[katydid23]

The parents also had to sign the lease as guarantors. I don't know when the lease began but it looks like they would have to continue to pay if the son left.


Parental Guaranty
Have your Guarantor complete and sign a Guaranty of Lessee’s Obligations & Guarantor Application online.


http://capriiv.com/lease-now

All posts are my opinion only. Sent via Tapatalk

it is possible to break the lease under circumstances like the boy endured. Having a roommate arrest you is cause to break the lease, I believe.

 

[jjenny]

I understand. I certainly dont want to lay any blame on that poor family. Just saying it is sad that the poor kid moved back in there. We had a weird 'emergency' in my DD's freshman yr, and she was physically assaaulted by her female roomie, and the cops came, and the girl said my DD shoved her first and the cops were going to take both in, so my DD dropped her complaint. She called me from the street, in an ambulance after being hit three times in the face by her drunken roomie. My DD had yelled at her for coming home loud and drunk at 3 am, and getting them in trouble with the landlord. [ who lived next door.] So the girl punched her in the face three times.

We pulled her out of the apt. and it was hard finding a change in the middle of the semester. She had to crash at another friends dorm for a week before we found a room to rent. I know it is hard. Just saying I wish they could have seen the bright red flags...

That's assuming he told anything to the family. He could have been too embarrassed. He comes from a different culture.

 

[Dmacky]

That's assuming he told anything to the family. He could have been too embarrassed. He comes from a different culture.

My goodness jjenny, I was just about to say the same exact thing :smile:

 

[LolaMoon08]

That's assuming he told anything to the family. He could have been too embarrassed. He comes from a different culture.

Even if he was completely innocent (which I believe), it is still a very big deal to even think about disappointing your parents in any way. He wasn't a minor, so the police would have not even contacted them. It is very likely that they didn't even know anything about it. Not saying they didn't... but, I could see that being the case.

 

[zoey]

I'm sorry to bring up this topic, but ...

I wonder if ER ever had a pet?

Iirc his dad got a dog. There was also mention of an igania

 

[BigCat]

Oh, he was very racist! Although he was half-Asian himself... he hated fully Asian men. He really hated Black and Hispanic men. Ya'll have read it, so I don't have to repeat the horrible things he said about them... especially if he found out that had slept with tall, hot blondes.

"I will slaughter every single blonde I see." It's pretty clear that he hated EVERYONE.

 

[ATasteOfHoney]

BBm

"...is off to intensive counseling (and perhaps living in a clinical setting) and probably going on meds. Professional mental evaluations, treatment plans, and interventions, STAT."

THat ^^^ is the key difficulty, right there. We looked high and low for some way to get my brother into a clinical setting. It is not possible unless the patient is VERY severely mentally unstable. And even then, it is usually only for 3 to 6 wks at a a time. And insurance does not pay.

From what we heard, ER WAS getting intensive counseling. He began at age 8, and in middle school was going EVERY SINGLE DAY for treatment. How much more intensive can you get?

We tried the interventions route. It does not help if there are NO places that you can send the patient. Sad but true.

ER would not have been deemed 'insane' enough for mandatory intake. And he cannot be taken in without his consent unless he was severely out of touch with reality.




"I wouldn't want a person that sick living out amongst the unsuspecting general population (such as roommates at college]"


He was an adult and wanted to attend college. He had never done anything violent or aggressive, that they knew about at the time. They thought he was severely depressed and isolated and so the idea of him going to community college was a proper plan, given what they knew. I cannot blame the parents for allowing him to attend college. I am sure he talked a good game and convinced them it was the ideal cure for what ailed him.


"But with any child that exhibits symptoms of a mental illness---I'd keep them away from violent video games"


I agree, ideally. But when Mom is at work, how does she prevent a teenager from playing video games? Thats like preventing your dog from scratching himself.

There is only so much one can do when a child has mental health issues. It is not an easy fix. You cannot change their attitude, their automatic reactions to stimuli, their maladaptive behaviors. You just run around try to put out fires and pray for some semblance of peace. anic:

But Katy......that's what we've been doing as a society and it apparently isn't working. What's the solution?

 

[Suthrnqt]

I will respectfully respond and then I'll likely be outta here as we are going down the same road as I said was the problem to start with.

I know how unprofessional Children's Aid is here and ridiculous they are with their tactics, abuse of people and funding and NO oversight. I see it EVERYday. They enable worse than the parents do.

Little Johnny throws his money away on alcohol, pot and video games, and includes his "friends to join in" now he has no money, no bus pass, yada yada oh, to the tune of just over 2500 CAD. Some was "given" to him towards his, get this...college, cough, cough. What did the case worker do after setting down, being shown the proof and him admitting to it in person to her?

She gives him 3500 CAD more and upon the crap storm that followed said and if he throws that away I'll replace it too. THAT's TAX MONEY, MY TAX MONEY, YOUR TAX MONEY. Please don't waste time trying to dispel my reality and replace it with "yours", I see this abortion of CAS waste and abuse almost ALL day EVERY day here.

Sorry for my ignorance, but can you explain CAD and CAS?? And if you don't mind sharing, what state do you live in? TIA

 

[LolaMoon08]

"I will slaughter every single blonde I see." It's pretty clear that he hated EVERYONE.

I think that it is very clear that he hated everyone. We are allowed to discuss different aspects of his hate. We know that his hatred didn't just center around hot, tall blondes although even I have spoken about that more than anything.

I don't think there is anything wrong with discussing the other aspects of his hatred towards people. Which includes people of different races... including his own.

ETA: We are not the ones who brought race into it either. ER did.

 

[Quester]

CAD = Canadian Dollar

CAS = ?

Maybe:
The Children's Aid Societies (CAS) of Ontario, Canada, are independent organizations empowered by the Ontario government to perform child protection services. The declared goal is to "promote the best interests, protection and well being of children".
Children's Aid Society (Canada) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[jggordo]

I am still wondering if these roomates signed n agreement together from knowing each other prior to or if they were "roommate matched" by the complex where they were living?

There was obvious discord going on between them but no action on the complex part apparently. My question is how complicit the complex is as to the outcome in that they had due warning there were problems?

Also, IIRC he stated in his document that his parents paid $900 for his rent. But the complex website said that was the total rent for a 2 BRM apartment. Was he subletting to these guys and pocketing the money?

JMO's.

 

[Zuri]

It is my hope that further awareness, discourse and understanding of mental illness will start to come out of tragedies such as these, so that somehow we can help prevent them in the future. Unrealistic I know.

I would love to learn more about the victims, how they lived, what their hopes and dreams were, and make them the focal point rather than ER. Hopefully that will happen in the near future, once the families can if they choose to. The pics and videos of Mr. Martinez are heartbreaking and I am truly so sorry for his loss and the losses of the other families and friends.

 

[jjenny]

I am still wondering if these roomates signed n agreement together from knowing each other prior to or if they were "roommate matched" by the complex where they were living?

There was obvious discord going on between them but no action on the complex part apparently. My question is how complicit the complex is as to the outcome in that they had due warning there were problems?

Also, IIRC he stated in his document that his parents paid $900 for his rent. But the complex website said that was the total rent for a 2 BRM apartment. Was he subletting to these guys and pocketing the money?

JMO's.

I don't get the impression he was picking his roommates. I think the complex just assigned them to the apartment. 900$ seems very low for 2BRM apartment in CA.

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

Don't forget Unabomber, Ted Kaczynski 35,000 Manifesto.

And Dorner... Ex-LE who went on a shooting spree in Southern CA...

 

[Flutterby80]

Ugh. There are people...lots of them...on his blog calling ER a hero or saying they feel sorry for HIM and how HE was abused and misunderstood his whole life.

Feeling scared for humanity right now.