CA - Elliot Rodger kills 6, injures 13 in Isla Vista, Near UC Santa Barbara, #2

[CARIIS]

Attempting to save his life, Hopper made a shocking discovery.


“I was giving him CPR, looked down and recognized his face,” Hopper said. “He was the first person I met at freshman orientation.”


http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/is...e-isla-vista-victim-saw-familiar-face-n114581

 

[lawstudent]

The fact that he has had difficulties with his stepmom and raged about her recently doesn't mean they had an obvious hatred for each other. There may have been times they seemed to get along pretty well - his recent perceptions were clearly colored by rage and mental deterioration. The media will describe people as detesting each other when they had fairly normal fights and difficulties.

 

[Flutterby80]

Oh thanks about that I hv not bn able to read all of the manifesto as on iPad it keeps jumping back to page one. Thanks for the answer so he wasn't pent up sexually, as i was very curious about that.

I had lots of issues on my Nook too, but someone helped me out with a link and I downloaded it from there and had no issues.

Sorry I don't remember the link, but if you go to my page and scroll back a couple of days through my posts (statistics) look for where I ask if anyone has a different link, then a few posts after that is the reply.

Hope that helps.

 

[CARIIS]

They had a mass shooting in Santa Barbara the year before, and it was one that had many crime scenes and shooting from a car

Santa Monica College Shooting Leaves Five Dead Including Suspect, Several Others Wounded


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/07/santa-monica-college-shooting_n_3404689.html#slide=2553990

 

[Bernina]

Anyone out there watch "Game of Thrones" or read "A Song of Ice and Fire" series? Wondering if there's a connection to ER's attitude about women and the "alleged" misogyny, the portrayal of women, and the gender distribution of the readership and viewership that started a heated critical response with HBO's adaptation of the books.

Never watched or read either myself.

 

[CARIIS]

He struck me as schizoaffective, then I saw more stuff by him

 

[Bernina]

The fact that he has had difficulties with his stepmom and raged about her recently doesn't mean they had an obvious hatred for each other. There may have been times they seemed to get along pretty well - his recent perceptions were clearly colored by rage and mental deterioration. The media will describe people as detesting each other when they had fairly normal fights and difficulties.

He had "issues" with his step mom. It's all over his manifesto. She took the decision making out of his father's hands and ER couldn't manipulate her. ER's father also backed up step mom's actions. ER get's extremely enraged when she kicks him out of his father's house and "forbade" him from visiting....."NO! I am the eldest son! This house should be MY house before hers!"........"This b***h must be really good to him in bed, I figured. What a weak man." Pg 62.

I think he actually hated her from day one because he thought she had replaced him as the center of his father's world.:twocents:

 

[CARIIS]

I just go that part last night at his "deescription of his life coach (my gues he was told that, he was oriented enough to probably have a issue with another title), but that it the out pt approach with the autistic popylation

Take them out in public, with a trusted person, He himself referred to many dialogs regarding "socialization" so all the folks questioning his illiness seem confirmed.
By that I mean it appears, thata for a long peroid of time (years) that was the working diagnosis, in and of itself different providers seeing him through time (years) is confirmation.
The med Rx has recently been found to be helpful withthis population as well . It was used for Schiz and Bipolar and Pyschosis mainly in the beginning .

It is horrible, most of my folks folks hated it and non compliance was HIGH.

THey said it made them "foggy" and draggy.

 

[Bernina]

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/my-life-aspergers/201212/asperger-s-autism-and-mass-murder
Article written after the Connecticut shootings.

One day we may have a hard medical test for autism – including Asperger’s. Until then, it’s diagnosed by observation – a process that is unfortunately more prone to error than we would like. The Asperger diagnosis attributed to Adam might even have been a mistake; sociopathy can masquerade as mild autism or Asperger’s.

It’s easy to see how the two conditions might be confused. After all, one is characterized by a weak ability to show feelings, while the other is founded on an absence of feeling within, and a lack of innate moral foundation. Those two conditions may look very similar, but the outcomes are not. One leads to anxiety, depression, and social failure. The other may lead to evil, and a much darker place.

 

[CARIIS]

This was my question also. All three asleep and not one wake from the sounds. Wonder if ER somehow spiked their drinks. Jmo

ciao

I am really starting to wonder if he did not start killing his roomates like maybe even a day before or something. When I read the part about luring people in and then one of the victims being a visitor it became more scary for me. And (hey sorry) just the way LE has really not said much, I fear, if we ever know (autopsies anyone!) that if he did one at a time he could well I am just going to say maybe more than decapation.

 

[CARIIS]

Astaire recalled an interaction with Elliot at a Christmas party a few years ago in which Astaire went out to get a breath of fresh air and Elliot was outside by himself, gazing at the stars. ....


"As I walked away from him, I turned around to see him, and he had gone back to looking up at the stars, and I have to tell you, I thought he was the loneliest person I've ever seen in my life, I felt that at the time and now (with) what has happened, I absolutely see it more clearly..."

….. got an email from Peter and it was heart-(wrenching), and he talked. He said to me in his email that his son had been shot dead but he had taken others with him.

……, Astaire said, were "very much on top of things" — trying to get him help, and putting him in therapy at age 9. They had called the police two weeks before the shooting, Astaire said, "because they were alarmed at what he might do."

………from what I understand, Elliot had been living another life for a number of years,'' Astaire said. "Again this is what I understand — his manifesto he started to write three years ago, and this was a different person than even I met."

http://www.today.com/news/elliot-ro...ing-victims-ucsb-shooting-more-son-2D79730882

He is very dignified. My sense here is he is not going to reveal to the world his friends son diagnosis - feeling that is there choice.


Astaire said Rodger’s parents were concerned about their son every day.
“I think their fears fundamentally, deep down, was that he was going to take his own life,” Astaire said.
Astaire thinks back to his encounters with Rodger. The boy was wrapped up within himself, Astaire said, distant and removed, even at dinners and parties.



“He was an odd child, didn’t quite fit into his skin.



http://abcnews.go.com/US/parents-santa-barbara-killer-distraught-speech-stuttered/story?id=23908059

 

[jjenny]

He had "issues" with his step mom. It's all over his manifesto. She took the decision making out of his father's hands and ER couldn't manipulate her. ER's father also backed up step mom's actions. ER get's extremely enraged when she kicks him out of his father's house and "forbade" him from visiting....."NO! I am the eldest son! This house should be MY house before hers!"........"This b***h must be really good to him in bed, I figured. What a weak man." Pg 62.

I think he actually hated her from day one because he thought she had replaced him as the center of his father's world.:twocents:

He was planning to kill both his half-brother and his step mother. I am sure she feels they had a lucky escape.

 

[Salem]

Guys - ER has not been officially diagnosed that I am aware of? Is there a link to the official diagnoses?

Also - if you are posting as a professional, you need to be verified. If you do not wish to be verified, then you need to link your statements.

To become a verified poster, please see the thread here: Verification Process for Professional or Insider Posters - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

Salem

 

[Isabelle]

They had a mass shooting in Santa Barbara the year before, and it was one that had many crime scenes and shooting from a car

Santa Monica College Shooting Leaves Five Dead Including Suspect, Several Others Wounded


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/07/santa-monica-college-shooting_n_3404689.html#slide=2553990

I don't remember this either. It really is bad that these incident are becoming so common that they have little impact on our conscious mind.

 

[momrids6]

In some of the posts I see the word “issues”! And I understand it is hard to understand. It is not like “issues” like we all mean. They don’t have issues with people they have a pervasive inability to form a bond or attachment to anyone – that is the illness. That is what it is
One can’t parent an autistic child in same way as one that does suffer from it.



Another child Pizza. Just pizza . Now we can all get into how it is not good to eat pizza pretty much all the time. This is true. <snip>
Again it is about surviving. Mom just worked 9 hours, has another child (who gets stressed when brother is screaming) has to cook for the rest of the family, has three loads of clothes to do, has to get ready for work tom. One has to make choices, is not serving pizza in the big picture worth what could possibly be a 2-3 hour explosion, or is it best for everyone in the household to give him pizza. You decide!

rsbm:

Respectfully- Many types of dev delays, disorders, etc have socialization problems- and are treated the same way.

As for parenting an autistic child- one may have to explain things differently, or more often- but expectations for appropriate behavior of affected child and siblings should be the same. There is only 1 world- and they all have to live in it.

Indulging inappropriate behaviors teaches child that the behavior is 1. acceptable and 2. gets them what they want. It is harder to deal with the tantrum- but it must be done; it is not about surviving- it is about parenting. In the end, it is better for the entire family.

It is my responsibility to have high expectations for all my children; as expecting too little gets too little.

I am a special needs parent- my opinion only

 

[mrsobrien]

Conflicting media reports have complicated this. I've seen a handful of articles stating he *was* diagnosed and just as many saying he had *not* been formally diagnosed. :-/

Guys - ER has not been officially diagnosed that I am aware of? Is there a link to the official diagnoses?

Also - if you are posting as a professional, you need to be verified. If you do not wish to be verified, then you need to link your statements.

To become a verified poster, please see the thread here: Verification Process for Professional or Insider Posters - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

Salem

 

[CARIIS]

*Snipped, snipped, snipped by me*


No............the family attorney clarified his statement:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/emilywillingham/2014/05/30/elliot-rodger-didnt-have-autism-he-had-anger/

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-frantic-parents-isla-vista-shootings-20140525-story.html

"Astaire said Elliot had not been diagnosed with Asperger&#8217;s but the family suspected he was on the spectrum, and had been in therapy for years. He said he knew of no other mental illnesses, but Elliot truly had no friends, as he said in his videos and writings."

We should not forget that Asperger&#8217; was connected with this family system since 1999. It&#8217;s just hard to imagine that the theme of Asperger&#8217;s throughout was not an issue. Elliot refers on more than one occasion to his discussion regarding &#8220;socialization&#8221; with a multitude of professionals. The notion that Asperger&#8217;s had not cast its dark shadows on all involved , for years, just&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;.makes no sense!


Our society is going to have to accept that the lack of resources this country is allocating to mental illness, is woefully inadequate. If this was a rare thing I could grasp the dialog going on in the media. . For everyone who has not concluded this is untreated mental illness- fine- what are those folks explanation for what is going on in this country?


As you all know, I am quit fond of dialog and differing opinions! All things have causation. If we want to use slang (makes one feel better?) we can say he was just a &#8220;psycho &#8220;&#8211; fine that is mental illness. If we want to say he was a &#8220;lunatic&#8221; &#8211; fine that is mental illness. If we want to say he was just &#8220;crazy&#8221; &#8211; fine that is a mental illness. If we want to say he was a &#8220;madman&#8221; &#8211; fine that is mental illness. If we want to say he was &#8220;insane&#8221; fine that is mental illness.


For some reason autism is a personal choice?. Does anyone chose to be a lunatic,psyco,or insane. Same thing here. His parents did everything they could. Why was there no dialog about Lanzas mom before he murdered her? How come Holmes parents were not mauled in the media? Where was the rage at Luka&#8217; family? I do not recall an uproar regarding Laoughner&#8217; parents either.


What has been so mind numbing in this case is mom tried two times in three weeks to make sure he was not falling down. What else could she have done? It is the system (our system) that failed here, not mom, not dad, not Elliot,not the cops (per the system).


So now what do we do?



It&#8217;s like toaster ovens with a red wire in them keep catching on fire, but our society says the red wire is not the issue. If we do not address the red wire, and toaster ovens with red wires have a tendency to catch fire it is logical to conclude that toasters with red wires will continue to catch fire! WOW that was a sentence!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Conflicting media reports have complicated this. I've seen a handful of articles stating he *was* diagnosed and just as many saying he had *not* been formally diagnosed. :-/

Do you know what the latest official LE statement is about ER's mental health status?

I think that is what we need to know.

MOO.

 

[CARIIS]

rsbm:

Respectfully- Many types of dev delays, disorders, etc have socialization problems- and are treated the same way.

As for parenting an autistic child- one may have to explain things differently, or more often- but expectations for appropriate behavior of affected child and siblings should be the same. There is only 1 world- and they all have to live in it.

Indulging inappropriate behaviors teaches child that the behavior is 1. acceptable and 2. gets them what they want. It is harder to deal with the tantrum- but it must be done; it is not about surviving- it is about parenting. In the end, it is better for the entire family.

It is my responsibility to have high expectations for all my children; as expecting too little gets too little.

I am a special needs parent- my opinion only

There are choices that need to be made here. If the child , in public is groping people that needs to addressed. If dropping pants and defecating on the street ....your with me.

But parental "expectations" do need to be modified when we are talking about the "capacity" as a result of an inability (key word here) to do what most expect others to do.

Certainly was not suggesting one let children run wild (!) I was however, pointing out that it is vital for the parent to understand the reasons for the behaviors and modify expectations if the consequence is less stress for child suffering and those around them.

The child, who expiries a tantrum is in a very distressed, miserable "state".

As I sure you know, there are realities here wherein the choice has to be serve the Pizza or let him touch his clothes.

I am confident that you have to make some accommodations for one child if that child has different capacities

It also depends on which "special needs" (a huge classification with many varieties) we are talking about I was directly referring to Autism disorders.. In some deficit areas explaining differently or more often is helpful. With the autistic population "explain" some things is not going to register - that’s the illness in and of itself.


It also depends on which "special needs" (a huge classification with many varieties) we are talking about I was directly referring to Autism disorders.. In some deficit areas explaining differently or more often is helpful. With the autistic population "explain" some things is not going to register - that’s the illness in and of itself.

 

[momrids6]

[FONT=&quot]There are choices that need to be made here. If the child , in public is groping people that needs to addressed. If dropping pants and defecating on the street ....your with me.

But parental "expectations" do need to be modified when we are talking about the "capacity" as a result of an inability (key word here) to do what most expect others to do.

Certainly was not suggesting one let children run wild (!) I was however, pointing out that it is vital for the parent to understand the reasons for the behaviors and modify expectations if the consequence is less stress for child suffering and those around them.

The child, who expiries a tantrum is in a very distressed, miserable "state".

As I sure you know, there are realities here wherein the choice has to be serve the Pizza or let him touch his clothes.

I am confident that you have to make some accommodations for one child if that child has different capacities[/FONT]

bbm: Nope. Not when it comes to behavior. The teaching method was different- but same outcome. My brother in law has an 11q deletion with an IQ roughly of 30. He knows the meaning of the word "no". I can take him anywhere and his behavior is appropriate. Same for my son. "Because I said so" works when comprehension is not there when teaching. Indulging an inappropriate behavior is not a consequence to said child- it is a cop out, imo.