CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #15

[smr]

If CM is the killer he must feel incredibly lucky that his DNA was not found at the house or the gravesite. After being so lucky that LE hadn't found any trace of his DNA the last thing he would allow is his DT to hire an expert firm with a MVac to again search the crime scene for traces of DNA that could turn out to be his.

Good point! I recall a similar sentiment voiced in a comment by poster JMarsh a while ago, who said Chase's letting the investigators/prosecutors(?) access and investigate as much as possible about the case was contrary to what a guilty person would do.

 

[mothwings]

CMs DNA is on the steering wheel. The defense wants us to believe it got there via secondary touch. The DNA expert also testified there is no way to know how and when the DNA was deposited onto the steering wheel .

IMO, it is much more likely and much more reasonable his DNA got onto the steering wheel because he put his lying, thieving, murderous mitts onto the steering wheel. IMO, the two timed felon was wearing gloves when he drove the trooper, therefore only a limited amount of DNA was found.

The DNA expert can cite studies with 32 test subjects all she wants, I ain't buying it.

Bottom line is CMs DNA is on the steering wheel. Just one more unlucky coincidence for the gambling addict who didn't even care enough to keep his own family together.

I hope they ask the expert if the secondary transfer could occur when an individual puts on gloves, leaving a small amount of DNA on the outside of the gloves which then got onto the steering wheel.

MOO IMO etc etc

This makes sense. Thanks.

 

[Cricket28]

Agree, and not really sure why it was treated as if there was no urgency to the whole scenario, and have read of other family didn't seem too concerned initially either because it was not out of the ordinary for them to take off for a few days or something to that effect? Wasn't it about 11 days before they were reported missing to LE?

I have to remind myself that there were other things going on. Like CPS.
According to the search warrant for the house... Children/Sexual Behavior Documents were found.

IMO, one of the real reasons SB went into the home on Feb. 17th (wasn't it?), was to look for anything damaging to any of the McFaddens.

Wasn't there something about Summer reporting M. McFadden of abuse? I'm sure that didn't go over well. IMO MM and SB always remained much closer to Heather than they ever were to Summer.

I can see Heather and Susan ranting about how Summer has driven a huge wedge between Joey and his first born. Everything was Summer's fault (according to them). Of course this is all MOO, but I think MM and SB walked on eggshells around the McFadden's for fear of losing contact with Jonah. They seemed awfully concerned about making sure the child support for Jonah was paid. Why? Heather and M. McFadden took over her father's VERY lucrative and successful business, Rock Martin Custom Jewelry in Laguna Beach. I really don't think they were having money problems. And Joey was MISSING.

IIRC MM and SB chose to cut ties with Patrick McStay when they found out M. McFadden was on a very short list of PM's suspects.

Anyway...my point is... I don't think the family (MM and SB) were happy with Summer and was keeping their distance.

I'm sure if they could do it over.....

MOO

 

[missy1974]

Bingo! And with all the talk of secondary transfer, etc, why haven't we heard of Summer's DNA being in the car? What about McGyvers DNA. They were "associates" of Joey also. It is curious only CMs was identified.

Well, apparently you missed it then, because Summer's DNA was in the Trooper, and there was also unidentified DNA, maybe it was McG's? I wonder if he ever submitted a DNA sample so it could be compared, I don't think so, but that's JMO.

 

[Texas Red]

From what Merritt has said he was a frequent visitor at the McStay family home. So you would expect some of his DNA there anyway. And if he had planned the murders it could be his way of defending himself about being at the McStay family home that his DNA was there. You know like Joey was his best friend bs, or whatever his nonsense was.
I think Merritt was very shrewd and cunning, IMO. And had to be for all that he did to become a felon previously.

If he were as shrewd and cunning as you suggest he wouldn't have a rap sheet in the first place.

 

[Mony Mony]

So basically at this point, Suzanna has offered nothing useful to the trial with the exception of the hair which she did not test. Maybe CyberGenetics will provide the useful info. IMO MOO she is looking for research funding with this testimony. She made it explicitly clear studies do not exist on DNA studies on buried clothing and she would like to see such studies done.

 

[Karinna]

I have to remind myself that there were other things going on. Like CPS.
According to the search warrant for the house... Children/Sexual Behavior Documents were found.

IMO, one of the real reasons SB went into the home on Feb. 17th (wasn't it?), was to look for anything damaging to any of the McFaddens.

Wasn't there something about Summer reporting M. McFadden of abuse? I'm sure that didn't go over well. IMO MM and SB always remained much closer to Heather than they ever were to Summer.

I can see Heather and Susan ranting about how Summer has driven a huge wedge between Joey and his first born. Everything was Summer's fault (according to them). Of course this is all MOO, but I think MM and SB walked on eggshells around the McFadden's for fear of losing contact with Jonah. They seemed awfully concerned about making sure the child support for Jonah was paid. Why? Heather and M. McFadden took over her father's VERY lucrative and successful business, Rock Martin Custom Jewelry in Laguna Beach. I really don't think they were having money problems. And Joey was MISSING.

IIRC MM and SB chose to cut ties with Patrick McStay when they found out M. McFadden was on a very short list of PM's suspects.

Anyway...my point is... I don't think the family (MM and SB) were happy with Summer and was keeping their distance.

I'm sure if they could do it over.....

MOO

We don't know the family dynamic, and it hasn't come up in the investigation or at Trial, and there is only Merritt on Trial for the murders. The rest of it is irrelevant IMO.

 

[Mony Mony]

Well, apparently you missed it then, because Summer's DNA was in the Trooper, and there was also unidentified DNA, maybe it was McG's? I wonder if he ever submitted a DNA sample so it could be compared, I don't think so, but that's JMO.

Well I guess I did miss it. Do you recall who testified to it so I can go back? Why isn't the defense screaming from the rooftops to analyze all this DNA further?

 

[missy1974]

Wasn't there something about Summer reporting M. McFadden of abuse? I'm sure that didn't go over well. IMO MM and SB always remained much closer to Heather than they ever were to Summer.

RSBM

This comment reminded me of the clip of MM in the CNN interview where he said that Heather was the love of Joey's life.... I thought that was strange considering the circumstances and figure it was comments and thoughts like that one that probably made it harder for Summer to get along with his family.


KAYE: In his early 20's, Joseph married a woman named Heather. They had a son together.

M MCSTAY: She was the love of his life and when they broke up, it just broke his heart.


I don't know much about the other circumstances that you mention, but I have read the same.

 

[Texas Red]

Good point! I recall a similar sentiment voiced by a comment by poster JMarsh a while ago, who said Chase's letting the investigators/prosecutors(?) access and investigate as much as possible about the case was contrary to what a guilty person would do.

Absolutely, his behavior is in no way consistent with that of a guilty person. Out of all the usual suspects his criminal history caused him to stand out and this is why he became the patsy.

 

[missy1974]

Well I guess I did miss it. Do you recall who testified to it so I can go back? Why isn't the defense screaming from the rooftops to analyze all this DNA further?

It's in Jones' testimony. What more do you think the defense should do? Get warrants to get DNA from Dan or McG? Is that really there job or is that that the job of the State? If you listen to Jones' testimony, I know they asked him about running DNA in CODIS.... I don't think defense lawyers have access to that database.

 

[la2cabo]

If he were as shrewd and cunning as you suggest he wouldn't have a rap sheet in the first place.

Even the best criminals get cocky and sloppy.

 

[la2cabo]

Absolutely, his behavior is in no way consistent with that of a guilty person. Out of all the usual suspects his criminal history caused him to stand out and this is why he became the patsy.

He became the patsy for who though? If not Merritt, who murdered the McStay family? I haven't seen one shred of legitimate evidence that points to anyone else.

 

[missy1974]

So basically at this point, Suzanna has offered nothing useful to the trial with the exception of the hair which she did not test. Maybe CyberGenetics will provide the useful info. IMO MOO she is looking for research funding with this testimony. She made it explicitly clear studies do not exist on DNA studies on buried clothing and she would like to see such studies done.

Sorry @Mony Mony I disagree that she hasn't added anything useful. Without her doing the MVac collection, we wouldn't know there was DNA found in the graves. Isn't the goal here to make sure the right person is held accountable for these murders? Beyond any doubts?

We still don't know the complete results here because she said the samples were sent to Bode Cellmark, and the samples that didn't meet Bode's thresholds were sent to Cybergenetics to be analyzed with special software called TrueAllele. Because Ryan did the MVac, she had to testify before them to lay the foundation for their testimony.

I hope she does do some studies, it sounds like it's needed I looked everywhere for any relevant studies and couldn't find anything... I thought it was just me lol

 

[Texas Red]

Even the best criminals get cocky and sloppy.

That simply doesn't reconcile with cunning. He had previously been so careless that he has several burglary convictions that should have been easy to get away with. But in this instance he manages to kill 4 people without detection, transport their bodies without leaving a trace of DNA evidence and then move the Trooper to the border all while creating an elaborate ploy of planting google searches to entice LE into believing the family went to Mexico. And he supposedly accomplished all this by himself? I'm not buying it.

 

[Texas Red]

He became the patsy for who though? If not Merritt, who murdered the McStay family? I haven't seen one shred of legitimate evidence that points to anyone else.

A patsy for Ramos.

 

[Karinna]

Even the best criminals get cocky and sloppy.

And caught. A criminal will do their thing and get caught eventually, and Merritt has a history of it. A compulsive gambling addict, liar and thief, and now on trial for quadruple murder. That type usually don't stop until they get stopped.

 

[Mony Mony]

Sorry @Mony Mony I disagree that she hasn't added anything useful. Without her doing the MVac collection, we wouldn't know there was DNA found in the graves. Isn't the goal here to make sure the right person is held accountable for these murders? Beyond any doubts?

We still don't know the complete results here because she said the samples were sent to Bode Cellmark, and the samples that didn't meet Bode's thresholds were sent to Cybergenetics to be analyzed with special software called TrueAllele. Because Ryan did the MVac, she had to testify before them to lay the foundation for their testimony.

I hope she does do some studies, it sounds like it's needed I looked everywhere for any relevant studies and couldn't find anything... I thought it was just me lol

Was the DNA found in the graves useful? Maybe CyberGenetics will let us know, but so far what I have heard is partial or below the threshold. And what she said was above the threshold......what were the results?

 

[missy1974]

Was the DNA found in the graves useful? Maybe CyberGenetics will let us know, but so far what I have heard is partial or below the threshold. And what she said was above the threshold......what were the results?

BBM I'm guessing that someone from Bode labs will testify about that. But again, unless they have known samples they don't have the ability to compare it to anyone or run it in CODIS as far as I know, the State does though. They do have the McStay's DNA and they have Chase's DNA, so those could be compared IMO I don't recall hearing they had any other samples from anyone else.

 

[mom2chloe]

If he were as shrewd and cunning as you suggest he wouldn't have a rap sheet in the first place.

OMG is this “Reasonable Doubt” ? Do my eyes deceive me?!