Deceased/Not Found Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 Jun 2014 - #16

[Krystine]

Do you think it's emotion or anger or ego/inferiority complex? I thought if he did do it he's probably a psychopathic personality, and this has been my opinion thus far, but your point is quite valid. You would almost think this is a crime of passion. Very hard to tell.

I agree, the crime of passion theory is one I have been entertaining too, since someone suggested it recently (Tinkerbel?)
It seems very clear to me, as I follow the threads on here, and the news headlines, that the motivating factors for 'murders' these days seem to be either jealousy and passion, or drugs.

 

[LoisLane]

I wonder if the 2 vehicles stolen nearby the Liknes' on June 30th have ever been recovered? And if so, were they checked for any sign of the victims DNA?

I wonder that as well. The vehicles were stolen the morning of June 29th and JO discovered the missing and called the police the morning of June 30th. I was reading earlier articles to see if it was mentioned but all I can find was that they were investigating other leads.

 

[Lalalacasbah]

I agree and think somehow he STILL blames the victims for their actions and his alleged subsequent re-action.

I FULLY believe that NO was the catalyst to his capture. I believe that he planned the murders and NO threw the wrench in the plan that led to his downfall. Had the amber alert and subsequent media coverage not been a factor, he may have gotten away with this crime.

So true, bless NO, his death was not in vain. I feel weird typing or thinking that, because it's easy to say when I'm not the family it happened to. I hope that doesn't sound offensive or callous to anyone reading this. Like I said yesterday I have to think about it this way to not get very mad about these crimes and our laws.

 

[Lalalacasbah]

I think we'd all agree he likely wasn't calm or detached at the time the murders were committed. I think the calm versus detached comments are based more on reading his demeanour in photos and reports about his demeanour in his court appearances.


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He must be nervy or cool as a cucumber to take two people to court while being a wanted man. Who does that??? I almost think he'd pass a lie detector test. All these things we're discussing, doesn't sound like suffering from ADHD to me…JMO.

I read a comment in another forum where someone mentioned the Thanksgiving dinner DG supposedly attended with AL/PG and the poster said he heard DG's behavior was 'somewhat removed', maybe he's just uncomfortable around group situations though, so I take it as gossip.

 

[Lalalacasbah]

I agree, the crime of passion theory is one I have been entertaining too, since someone suggested it recently (Tinkerbel?)
It seems very clear to me, as I follow the threads on here, and the news headlines, that the motivating factors for 'murders' these days seem to be either jealousy and passion, or drugs and drug money...or both.

I think it was Tinkerbel who mentioned a crime of passion.

And don't forget the inferiority complex! My family member who worked in maximum security prisons and interviewed violent offenders said SO many crimes happen because of a belittling or snubbing remark (to the wrong person). I.E: a bartender tells a guy he won't serve him, guy gets embarrassed, pissed off, mutters under his breath, leaves the bar but sits outside for hours brewing over it (who the heck does that guy think he is to tell me what to do, I'll show him), waits for the bartender to leave work and violently kills him. All over being 'told' no or what to do (it wasn't about the drink, but the humiliating remark more).

My family member says crimes like this happens all the time and that you never know who you're talking to or how they'll react which is quite scary. Very interesting how people tick.

 

[Krystine]

I wonder if the 2 vehicles stolen nearby the Liknes' on June 30th have ever been recovered? And if so, were they checked for any sign of the victims DNA?

I see where you're going, but why would it be important that the vehicles were stolen near the Liknes home? If the accused planned to steal the vehicle he used to transport them a day later, he could have stolen them from anywhere.

 

[Lalalacasbah]

I wonder that as well. The vehicles were stolen the morning of June 29th and JO discovered the missing and called the police the morning of June 30th. I was reading earlier articles to see if it was mentioned but all I can find was that they were investigating other leads.

I wish there was a way we could find out!

 

[OutOfTheDarkness]

I think Tinkerbel was referring to the present day, post crime. If DG is on suicide watch, it is quite likely that he is depressed, and detachment is a symptom of that.
It might be a stretch to presume we know anything about his state of mental health, all we have seen of him so far is the 'perp walk'. He looked furious to me, but controlled and dignified. Who knows, he could be a whimpering bundle of unmyelenated nerve fibres by now.

Yes, my apologies, I wasn't thorough enough with the information.

The fact KR said initially that DG was anxious to see the disclosure, and then that ultimately his client would decide how to proceed hints that DG is engaged, and actively involved in his defence. Given the court history, it is something familiar to him, and only makes sense that he would be.

On another note, did anyone ever verify the small claims cases was actually him, and not someone else with the same name?

 

[Lalalacasbah]

Yes, my apologies, I wasn't thorough enough with the information.

The fact KR said initially that DG was anxious to see the disclosure, and then that ultimately his client would decide how to proceed hints that DG is engaged, and actively involved in his defence. Given the court history, it is something familiar to him, and only makes sense that he would be.

On another note, did anyone ever verify the small claims cases was actually him, and not someone else with the same name?

The small claims were filed by Matthew Hartley, we're assuming it's him, but might not be.

ETA - No middle initial is provided on the civil records, so might no even be him, however, when I looked up HU he works in the chemicals industry.

https://eservice.ag.gov.bc.ca/cso/esearch/civil/searchPartyResult.do?serviceId=23092641

HARTLEY, MATTHEW
HARTLEY, MATTHEW v NAKATA, RICHARD Provincial
Small Claims Robson Square Provincial Court 9409872 12Dec1994 18Apr1995

HARTLEY, Matthew
HARTLEY, Matthew v UNGER, Hartmut Provincial
Small Claims Robson Square Provincial Court 9841542 08Jan1998 23Jan1998

 

[OutOfTheDarkness]

And again I wasn't thorough enough...

If hypothetically, LE has the right man, I just don't see detachment. Targeting, executing, planning to try to get away with it, no confession, engaged in the defence...

When it comes to suicide watch, I would assume LE would have to err on the side of caution if it was something as simple as him saying "Crap. I wish I were dead." Like someone said earlier, there is no way to determine his mental state. If he had any choice between appearing on CCTV or being there in person, choosing to be there in person knowing family members may be there can be read as pretty confident.

Like virtually everything about this, you can read it from either ends of the extremes. Am I driving anyone nuts yet?

 

[LoisLane]

And again I wasn't thorough enough...

If hypothetically, LE has the right man, I just don't see detachment. Targeting, executing, planning to try to get away with it, no confession, engaged in the defence...

When it comes to suicide watch, I would assume LE would have to err on the side of caution if it was something as simple as him saying "Crap. I wish I were dead." Like someone said earlier, there is no way to determine his mental state. If he had any choice between appearing on CCTV or being there in person, choosing to be there in person knowing family members may be there can be read as pretty confident.

Like virtually everything about this, you can read it from either ends of the extremes. Am I driving anyone nuts yet?

I was wondering if the suicide watch is a precaution taken to ensure the accused doesn't die while in the early stages of the court proceedings and ongoing investigation. That would be pretty damaging if the accused was killed or took his own life while in custody. Maybe DG wasn't suicidal but they were not going to take any chances. If that makes sense?

 

[stan laurel]

I see where you're going, but why would it be important that the vehicles were stolen near the Liknes home? If the accused planned to steal the vehicle he used to transport them a day later, he could have stolen them from anywhere.

He may have stolen them to give the impression that thieves were at work in the neighbourhood,, part of a plan to lead police elsewhere in other directions,,, but no, that damn cctv camera was there to foil everything.

 

[LoisLane]

I see where you're going, but why would it be important that the vehicles were stolen near the Liknes home? If the accused planned to steal the vehicle he used to transport them a day later, he could have stolen them from anywhere.

Maybe they weren't stolen to transport bodies but to create a decoy. Possibly DG planned to enter the Liknes home much earlier that day and did not realize the estate sale would be taking place and the extra people at the residence.

 

[LoisLane]

He may have stolen them to give the impression that thieves were at work in the neighbourhood,, part of a plan to lead police elsewhere in other directions,,, but no, that damn cctv camera was there to foil everything.

I like it when we reply to posts at the same time! Hi nose picker

ETA... Another point

If it was DG involved in the vehicle thefts that means another person assisted him. 2 cars, 1 residential break-in, the map shows 1 (same) location.

 

[Cherchri]

I'm interested to know how many here think more than one person committed this crime? If you don't think DG did this alone, how many people do you think were involved? If you are going with more than one, who do you suspect?

 

[stan laurel]

I'm interested to know how many here think more than one person committed this crime? If you don't think DG did this alone, how many people do you think were involved? If you are going with more than one, who do you suspect?

I'm of the accomplice camp.

2

Who is DG looking for in the courtroom when he was on Video feed and as you mentioned - him glancing - the other day while being escorted out of court?

 

[LoisLane]

I think DG could have an accomplice and I think he has access to another property. I think if we use names we will be snipped...

ETA... Possibly he could have engaged another persons' assistance or resources without them knowing the extent of the final plan.

 

[Cherchri]

I think DG could have an accomplice and I think he has access to another property. I think if we use names we will be snipped...

ETA... Possibly he could have engaged another persons' assistance or resources without them knowing the extent of the final plan.

Or someone could have engaged DG's assistance? I ask for reasons I won't share right now. Having seen DG up close and personal and bearing in mind we have discussed this at length..... One of the reasons is his physicality. He is literally my size. I am strong and have managed to figure out ways to move very heavy objects over the years but with stress and the risk of being caught, I just can't imagine how he could have managed alone. We are given to believe there are no other POI's but I'm scratching my head.

 

[LoisLane]

Or someone could have engaged DG's assistance?

Yes, definetly!

ETA... But why would DG be willing to sit in jail for it? Couldn't he have presented compelling testimony to LE that would have given them reasonable doubt?

 

[Cherchri]

Yes, definetly!

ETA... But why would DG be willing to sit in jail for it? Couldn't he have presented compelling testimony to LE that would have given them reasonable doubt?

Of course so why am I even thinking this way. I just amended my post while you were quoting I am having trouble picturing him physically managing. He is a little guy.