CANADA Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #18

[ldlager]

Good point, why did BS leave work early, did HS take out a large amount of cash from the bank, if so- were they possibly meeting somebody at home they had to pay in cash, could that be why the architect meeting was switched from home to Apotex?

Dec 19 2021 speculation, imo. rbbm.
Grudges and gossip: A rocky start in the search for Barry and Honey Sherman killers | The Star
''As previously reported, Barry and Honey met with builders of their new home at the Apotex offices at 5 p.m. The meeting was to have been at Old Colony, but for some unknown reason was changed to Apotex. Builder Joe Brennan recalled to police that while Barry normally worked late, he commented that he had a reason to be home earlier than usual''

''Honey left Apotex before 6:30 p.m., in her champagne-coloured Lexus SUV, and the three builders left in another vehicle. Honey “pocket dialed” one builder by mistake and he heard her “giggling for about 20 seconds” before she ended the call. While Barry stayed at work until about 8:30 p.m., Honey drove to Bayview Village shopping centre. The documents indicate she went to a CIBC branch between 7 p.m. and 8 p.m. and also to the MAC Cosmetics store inside the mall. It was not until four months after the murders that the police went to Bayview Village looking for security video. Most of the video had been overwritten but they were able to obtain footage of Honey at the CIBC branch. This part of the police documents is heavily redacted, but given that the branch would be long closed by the time Honey arrived it is possible the video police have shows Honey taking out cash from the ATM.
Police have continued to seal any information regarding what time the Shermans arrived home. The Star’s previous reporting suggests Honey was home by 8:30 p.m. (the Bayview mall is less than a 10-minute drive from Old Colony) and Barry shortly after.''

Thanks Dotr, I am always amazed you are able to put your hands on these earlier articles and postings.

 

[JayFriend]

Murder, missteps and the ‘elephant in the room’ in the Barry and Honey Sherman case

 

[Lexiintoronto]

I have never understood this. He stayed and worked until 8:30 pm that night, isn't that pretty much his normal or even a bit later? If he had to get home early, it doesn't seem like he followed through.

It sounds late to me as well, but KD believes Honey was home by about 8:30 pm. At 8:13 pm, Barry composed a routine email at his desktop computer at Apotex, then left at 8:30 (according to KD.) So home by 8:50-ish.

So they were both home within about 20 minutes of each other. Barry was close. If she wanted him home early, maybe she meant by 9:00pm for some reason?

 

[newclues]

Are JS, KW and FDA the three main potential suspects that LE has looked into?

 

[Lexiintoronto]

Are JS, KW and FDA the three main potential suspects that LE has looked into?

LE has only mentioned one suspect: the person walking on CCTV video. No POIs have been named.

KD wants blacked-out sections of police records that regard KW, JS and FDA to be unredacted.

 

[juli99]

It sounds late to me as well, but KD believes Honey was home by about 8:30 pm. At 8:13 pm, Barry composed a routine email at his desktop computer at Apotex, then left at 8:30 (according to KD.) So home by 8:50-ish.

So they were both home within about 20 minutes of each other. Barry was close. If she wanted him home early, maybe she meant by 9:00pm for some reason?

It sounds like 10-8 was his regular work schedule. Maybe she just meant don't stop anywhere on the way home? Still confusing to me.

"When she did gripe, it was in a half-joking way about her husband’s work schedule: seven days a week, 10 to eight."

Endless court battles, angry relatives and shady players: the truth about Barry Sherman

 

[Lexiintoronto]

It sounds like 10-8 was his regular work schedule. Maybe she just meant don't stop anywhere on the way home? Still confusing to me.

"When she did gripe, it was in a half-joking way about her husband’s work schedule: seven days a week, 10 to eight."

Endless court battles, angry relatives and shady players: the truth about Barry Sherman

Thank you for finding his normal schedule, I was looking for that.

If she made it home by 8:30 herself (per KD), why ask Barry to arrive earlier than usual? She wouldn’t be there. Unless someone else was expected?

 

[juli99]

Thank you for finding his normal schedule, I was looking for that.

If she made it home by 8:30 herself (per KD), why ask Barry to arrive earlier than usual? She wouldn’t be there. Unless someone else was expected?

It sure sounds like that. But who would be coming at 9 at night on a weekday?

 

[juli99]

It sure sounds like that. But who would be coming at 9 at night on a weekday?

Just a thought. We know Honey missed her meeting at Baycrest the night before. Is it possible something spooked Honey that night? Was she afraid to be alone at the house the next night and asking Barry to come home early for that reason? Maybe he wasn't cooperating, and so she stopped at the mall to make sure they would be home around the same time?

 

[Betty P]

LE has only mentioned one suspect: the person walking on CCTV video. No POIs have been named.

KD wants blacked-out sections of police records that regard KW, JS and FDA to be unredacted.

My impression was he's viewing the man walking on their street as having been hired by KW, JS or FDA. The outlier theory they mentioned was the possibility of the murders being related to anti-Semitism. It would help if there had been video gathered from the nearby synagouge to see if the killer came from there or walked by it with some interest.

The big question is, if they're able to determine the killer and person(s) who hired them, do they have enough evidence to convict?

 

[Lexiintoronto]

Just a thought. We know Honey missed her meeting at Baycrest the night before. Is it possible something spooked Honey that night? Was she afraid to be alone at the house the next night and asking Barry to come home early for that reason? Maybe he wasn't cooperating, and so she stopped at the mall to make sure they would be home around the same time?

This is what I wrote previously about the timeline on Tuesday:

• Honey uncharacteristically misses a board meeting as she was ‘dealing with some stuff’
• The meeting with the architects scheduled for noon that day is switched to Wednesday
• This was the day of FDA’s annual lunch that Barry normally attended. Barry previously canceled due to the meeting with the architects, which was moved.
• Barry had lunch with Alex’s husband Brad, who is also a Sherfam employee. I believe it was a business lunch as they were scheduled to have dinner together at Alex’s and Brad’s home to celebrate Hanukkah.
• 2:39 p.m. Honey cancels the Hanukkah dinner set for that evening, texting Alex, “cld we have Hannukah on fri?”
  
• Jonathon arrives home from his trip to Japan at approximately 7:00 pm (no indication of when his flight arrived).
• This was the first night of Hannukah. Honey was observant of her faith.

(Something seemed to be wrong with Honey, imo.)

Their home had been broken into a year prior to the murders, just before Honey arrived home. So I can see her not wanting to be home alone and spending time at the mall until she knew Barry would be home.

 

[Betty P]

This is what I wrote previously about the timeline on Tuesday:

• Honey uncharacteristically misses a board meeting as she was ‘dealing with some stuff’
• The meeting with the architects scheduled for noon that day is switched to Wednesday
• This was the day of FDA’s annual lunch that Barry normally attended. Barry previously canceled due to the meeting with the architects, which was moved.
• Barry had lunch with Alex’s husband Brad, who is also a Sherfam employee. I believe it was a business lunch as they were scheduled to have dinner together at Alex’s and Brad’s home to celebrate Hanukkah.
• 2:39 p.m. Honey cancels the Hanukkah dinner set for that evening, texting Alex, “cld we have Hannukah on fri?”
  
• Jonathon arrives home from his trip to Japan at approximately 7:00 pm (no indication of when his flight arrived).
• This was the first night of Hannukah. Honey was observant of her faith.

(Something seemed to be wrong with Honey, imo.)

Their home had been broken into a year prior to the murders, just before Honey arrived home. So I can see her not wanting to be home alone and spending time at the mall until she knew Barry would be home.

My overall feeling about their timeline is that they were very busy people. Not surprising, given their occupations, volunteer activities, etc. Whomever killed them (directly or indirectly) had to be very familiar with their schedules, especially for that particular day. While both kept to some kind of routine, there were always last minute changes.

Its more than just observing their activities for a week or two. The killer(s) almost needed some kind of inside information about their schedules that day. Who had that kind of access to their schedules? Who was in frequent contact with one of them to know of last minute changes? How much was just luck on the part of the killer(s)? JMO

 

[Lexiintoronto]

My impression was he's viewing the man walking on their street as having been hired by KW, JS or FDA. The outlier theory they mentioned was the possibility of the murders being related to anti-Semitism. It would help if there had been video gathered from the nearby synagouge to see if the killer came from there or walked by it with some interest.

The big question is, if they're able to determine the killer and person(s) who hired them, do they have enough evidence to convict?

KD’s argument to the court is that KW and FDA have spoken publicly about their police interviews, and KW definitely has, even here.

You mentioned a hired hit, and KW has said the TPS have as well:




Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #10

 

[SUSAN ANN]

<modnsip: Quoted post was removed>

Did Barry stop funding at any point for FDA?

 

[Betty P]

Did Barry stop funding at any point for FDA?

I'll have to go back and check. IIRC, he said he would have to stop and the loan to his son's company would need to be repaid.

 

[deugirtni]

It sure sounds like that. But who would be coming at 9 at night on a weekday?

What if it wasn't that someone was 'coming' to the house at that time of night on a weekday, but rather, a video-chat was to take place (facetime on H's iphone?), which H conceivably preferred B to be home for and participate in with her? Possibly someone who'd been away?

-The following evening (Thurs), JS was reported to have attended a dinner with old camp buddies;
-the night after that (Fri), B&H were scheduled to go to their daughter's for a Hannukah dinner;
-Saturday is the Sabbath for Jews, a day of rest, no electronic devices, no cash to be touched, etc. (How to Observe the Shabbat: 7 Steps (with Pictures) - wikiHow)
-on Sunday B&H were scheduled to have brunch with their daughter, her fiance, and his family, and then to later have dinner out with B's longtime friend and partner, Joel Ulster and his partner;
-Monday at some point, H was to depart for FL, to not return until January 12th.

I'm not sure if H observed the Jewish Sabbath on Saturdays, however if so, and considering electronic devices are to be set aside on the Sabbath, it seems like Wednesday later in the evening may have been the only time to get together with certain individual(s) before one or both of the couple were in FL for about one month?

 

[ldlager]

Good point, why did BS leave work early, did HS take out a large amount of cash from the bank, if so- were they possibly meeting somebody at home they had to pay in cash, could that be why the architect meeting was switched from home to Apotex?

Dec 19 2021 speculation, imo. rbbm.
Grudges and gossip: A rocky start in the search for Barry and Honey Sherman killers | The Star
''As previously reported, Barry and Honey met with builders of their new home at the Apotex offices at 5 p.m. The meeting was to have been at Old Colony, but for some unknown reason was changed to Apotex. Builder Joe Brennan recalled to police that while Barry normally worked late, he commented that he had a reason to be home earlier than usual''

''Honey left Apotex before 6:30 p.m., in her champagne-coloured Lexus SUV, and the three builders left in another vehicle. Honey “pocket dialed” one builder by mistake and he heard her “giggling for about 20 seconds” before she ended the call. While Barry stayed at work until about 8:30 p.m., Honey drove to Bayview Village shopping centre. The documents indicate she went to a CIBC branch between 7 p.m. and 8 p.m. and also to the MAC Cosmetics store inside the mall. It was not until four months after the murders that the police went to Bayview Village looking for security video. Most of the video had been overwritten but they were able to obtain footage of Honey at the CIBC branch. This part of the police documents is heavily redacted, but given that the branch would be long closed by the time Honey arrived it is possible the video police have shows Honey taking out cash from the ATM.
Police have continued to seal any information regarding what time the Shermans arrived home. The Star’s previous reporting suggests Honey was home by 8:30 p.m. (the Bayview mall is less than a 10-minute drive from Old Colony) and Barry shortly after.''[/QUOTE

Just a thought. We know Honey missed her meeting at Baycrest the night before. Is it possible something spooked Honey that night? Was she afraid to be alone at the house the next night and asking Barry to come home early for that reason? Maybe he wasn't cooperating, and so she stopped at the mall to make sure they would be home around the same time?

Just a small point but IIRC her meeting the day before was taking place in the daytime, not at night.

 

[dotr]

I have never understood this. He stayed and worked until 8:30 pm that night, isn't that pretty much his normal or even a bit later? If he had to get home early, it doesn't seem like he followed through.

Maybe BS was supposed to go home earlier that night because it was the start of Hanukkah, although it would have been later than sunset, the time when the first candle is usually lit, imo, speculation. rbbm.
The bit about giving to charity jumped out at me...

When Does Hanukkah 2017 Start and End? Dates and Facts About the Jewish Holiday (newsweek.com)
''In 2017, Hanukkah begins at sundown on Tuesday, December 12, and ends with nightfall on Wednesday, December 20. The candles are lit for eight consecutive nights starting on December 12 and continuing through December 19. In Judaism, each day begins at sundown the evening prior, which is why the first candle lighting takes place on the 12th and none takes place on the 20th.''
''Antiochus abolished Judaism—the penalty for refusing to convert was death—and the Syrians desecrated the Temple, putting up an altar to the Greek god Zeus in the Jews' holiest place''.

''The holiday in general is one where Jews are meant to give extra to charity''

 

[juli99]

One other possibility I've wondered about is if they needed to get the house ready on Tuesday night. There was a showing on the Wednesday at some point. It's a lot of work to keep a house looking good when it is up for sale.

 

[Bobbi Pearl]

My overall feeling about their timeline is that they were very busy people. Not surprising, given their occupations, volunteer activities, etc. Whomever killed them (directly or indirectly) had to be very familiar with their schedules, especially for that particular day. While both kept to some kind of routine, there were always last minute changes.

Its more than just observing their activities for a week or two. The killer(s) almost needed some kind of inside information about their schedules that day. Who had that kind of access to their schedules? Who was in frequent contact with one of them to know of last minute changes? How much was just luck on the part of the killer(s)? JMO

IMO, they could know little, all they needed to know was that most nights they were both home and in for the night by 8:30/9pm, and had no living onsite staff or other residents in the home. They would have hours through the dark of the night to accomplish whatever plan they had, long before the morning hours when potentially staff would arrive.