Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #3

[Doghairrules]

Aren't they supposed to have died on Thursday or Wednesday night?

And didn’t at least one of the early articles suggest staff was there working when the bodies were found? I tried to find it but there are so many articles at this point that I gave up.

 

[Tortoise]

And didn’t at least one of the early articles suggest staff was there working when the bodies were found? I tried to find it but there are so many articles at this point that I gave up.

There have been a few different stories about the purpose of the realtor's visit too. Early days it was to set up an open day and to attend an appointment with the Shermans. That seems to have turned into it being because they couldn't get hold of the Shermans. So few facts.

 

[minorone]

There have been a few different stories about the purpose of the realtor's visit too. Early days it was to set up an open day and to attend an appointment with the Shermans. That seems to have turned into it being because they couldn't get hold of the Shermans. So few facts.

Realtors always have an open house just for realtors & they are normally held during the week. Realtors always screen clients looking for a house carefully, especially when it is the higher end market. I suspect this was an open house only for realtors.

My realtor has told me some horror stories about accepting a client prematurely, only to find out they're an absolute nightmare. Realtors will check if clients are financially qualified, as thieves will engage realtors to get into a home to see the layout, check the security and look for valuables in the home.

 

[zencompass]

In my opinion, CBC news has a reputation for thoroughly vetting their information.

When CBC news posted the following statement in the article (below), I tend to believe that there were no security cameras at the home.


"However, CBC News has learned that the Shermans were found by the pool in their basement and that investigators have found no security cameras inside or outside the home."


http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/barry-sherman-honey-sherman-homicide-deaths-1.4456170

 

[JDG]

The Shermans home was quite modest if you're thinking about how 'regular rich people' live. As Honey said, 'we live a nice life, not a high life'.

They certainly were low key, not ostentatious by any stretch of the imagination.

Yes, you have to be well off to live on their street but you have to be much wealthier to live in the Bridle Path area.

To help put things into perspective, in Toronto, a regular run down house is $1M, more if the lot size is good.

The Shermans place was listed at ?? $7M approx. (getting tired, sorry),

Correction: As Honey said, "We live a nice life, not a LARGE life."

I knew it was incorrect but took me awhile to find it.

 

[JDG]

Realtors always have an open house just for realtors & they are normally held during the week. Realtors always screen clients looking for a house carefully, especially when it is the higher end market. I suspect this was an open house only for realtors.

My realtor has told me some horror stories about accepting a client prematurely, only to find out they're an absolute nightmare. Realtors will check if clients are financially qualified, as thieves will engage realtors to get into a home to see the layout, check the security and look for valuables in the home.

If a regular person turns up to a realtor open house, they aren't turned away in Toronto. A contact is a contact, Ive been to a few as I was driving by, stopped in. As for checking if you are financially qualified, I supposed they can 'ask' but one is EVER obligated to give out financial details.
They certainly do not ask for 'proof' before showing a home. Any open house is for the realtors to make new contacts, its not about selling one particular home.

When a home is for sale, there is often a feature sheet available to all, with floor plans and pertinent information.

Even for the 'appointment only' homes, one need only make an appointment to view the house.

I would not have an Open House if I were to list. Serious buyers could view the property or I might just give out my name, phone number etc to some builders working in the area. Pick a time and day when they can come over/call with offers and then, use a good real estate lawyer to do the fine print 'stuff'. In our area, the older homes are all being torn down for McMansions. My friend walked around the block and gave out eight cards with her number, took calls two nights later and saved all that commission.

 

[MistyWaters]

If a regular person turns up to a realtor open house, they aren't turned away in Toronto. A contact is a contact, Ive been to a few as I was driving by, stopped in. As for checking if you are financially qualified, I supposed they can 'ask' but one is NEVER obligated to give out financial details.
They certainly do not ask for 'proof' before showing a home. Any open house is for the realtors to make new contacts, its not about selling one particular home.

When a home is for sale, there is often a feature sheet available to all, with floor plans and pertinent information.

Even for the 'appointment only' homes, one need only make an appointment to view the house.

I would not have an Open House if I were to list. Serious buyers could view the property or I might just give out my name, phone number etc to some builders working in the area. Pick a time and day when they can come over/call with offers and then, use a good real estate lawyer to do the fine print 'stuff'. In our area, the older homes are all being torn down for McMansions. My friend walked around the block and gave out eight cards with her number, took calls two nights later and saved all that commission.

Just to clarify, a realtor open house is not the same as what you're referring to. It's definety not advertised to the public so nobody would just happen to show up, other than realtors. It's a preview for those interested MLS realtors in order to familiarize themselves with features and the layout so when they later show the home to clients they are professional in the showing of it.

 

[pamelado2]

If a regular person turns up to a realtor open house, they aren't turned away in Toronto. A contact is a contact, Ive been to a few as I was driving by, stopped in. As for checking if you are financially qualified, I supposed they can 'ask' but one is NEVER obligated to give out financial details.
They certainly do not ask for 'proof' before showing a home. Any open house is for the realtors to make new contacts, its not about selling one particular home.

When a home is for sale, there is often a feature sheet available to all, with floor plans and pertinent information.

Even for the 'appointment only' homes, one need only make an appointment to view the house.

I would not have an Open House if I were to list. Serious buyers could view the property or I might just give out my name, phone number etc to some builders working in the area. Pick a time and day when they can come over/call with offers and then, use a good real estate lawyer to do the fine print 'stuff'. In our area, the older homes are all being torn down for McMansions. My friend walked around the block and gave out eight cards with her number, took calls two nights later and saved all that commission.

No she's explaining that it was a realtor open house - that means all the Realtors in that office do a walk thru. The realtor that listed the home gives everyone a tour, explains pros and cons, discusses owners requests for showing (for example: no showings Tuesdays from 3-6pm). They also talk about clients they have that they feel may have interest. Out really office called them walk throughs though.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

 

[kay74]

If a regular person turns up to a realtor open house, they aren't turned away in Toronto. A contact is a contact, Ive been to a few as I was driving by, stopped in. As for checking if you are financially qualified, I supposed they can 'ask' but one is NEVER obligated to give out financial details.
They certainly do not ask for 'proof' before showing a home. Any open house is for the realtors to make new contacts, its not about selling one particular home.

When a home is for sale, there is often a feature sheet available to all, with floor plans and pertinent information.

Even for the 'appointment only' homes, one need only make an appointment to view the house.

I would not have an Open House if I were to list. Serious buyers could view the property or I might just give out my name, phone number etc to some builders working in the area. Pick a time and day when they can come over/call with offers and then, use a good real estate lawyer to do the fine print 'stuff'. In our area, the older homes are all being torn down for McMansions. My friend walked around the block and gave out eight cards with her number, took calls two nights later and saved all that commission.

You mean your friend went to houses that were NOT for sale? It's great she saved on the commission.

 

[kay74]

We have bought and sold homes many times and I never allowed an open house except for the realtors walk-thru.

 

[MistyWaters]

One thing I must admit that's throws a question mark for me is why the Shermans listed their family home before the new place was completed.

For us common non-billionaire folk typically it's a matter of necessity because the sale proceeds are required to finance the construction. But doing it that way, aside from the inconvenience of residing in a home that's for sale, after it's sold adds the additional hassle and stress of temporary living on the interim, possessions being placed in storage coupled with unknown construction delays and move in date, essentially putting life in limbo during the entire duration. I don't understand why anyone who could obviously afford to complete the construction first wouldn't just move once and then sell the emptied existing home after the new one was completed.

 

[JDG]

Just to clarify, a realtor open house is not the same as what you're referring to. It's definety not advertised to the public so nobody would just happen to show up, other than realtors. It's a preview for those interested MLS realtors in order to familiarize themselves with features and the layout so when they later show the home to clients they are professional in the showing of it.

Do you live in Toronto? The put the signs out an hour or so before the Open House and anyone can stop by. I have done it.
They often have coffee and sandwiches, cookies etc to entice their cronies to stay and chat. I am very familiar with how RE is conducted in TO.

 

[JDG]

You mean your friend went to houses that were NOT for sale? It's great she saved on the commission.

She was selling her home but only to builders. There were about 10 builders working in her area, so she walked around the block and handed out cards with her phone number, name etc. She told them that if they wished to make an offer, it would be 2 evenings later between 7-9.

She was very happy with what she got and yes, she saved a fortune. In a sellers market, one does NOT need a realtor. Not in TO.

Of course, all the rest was done by a real estate lawyer but you need them anyway. Its what I will be doing when I leave our current home, so long as its a sellers market.

 

[Tighthead]

One thing I must admit that's throws a question mark for me is why the Shermans listed their family home before the new place was completed.

For us common non-billionaire folk typically it's a matter of necessity because the sale proceeds are required to finance the construction. But doing it that way, aside from the inconvenience of residing in a home that's for sale, after it's sold adds the additional hassle and stress of temporary living on the interim, possessions being placed in storage coupled with unknown construction delays and move in date, essentially putting life in limbo during the entire duration. I don't understand why anyone who could obviously afford to complete the construction first wouldn't just move once and then sell the emptied existing home after the new one was completed.

I do find it odd. Maybe the existing home had them up and down stairs too much, so they would live in a luxury condo in the interim (in addition to the One Bloor, the Shermans or Apotex may have owned one). Perhaps the new house would have them living entirely on the first floor, as many seniors prefer, with guest rooms upstairs, or an elevator.

 

[Grace.212]

You can also look up open houses for the Toronto area here: http://openhouses.torontomls.net/poh/regions/toronto/index.htm

 

[MistyWaters]

Do you live in Toronto? The put the signs out an hour or so before the Open House and anyone can stop by. I have done it.
They often have coffee and sandwiches, cookies etc to entice their cronies to stay and chat. I am very familiar with how RE is conducted in TO.

No I don't live in Toronto. But several of us here have explained the difference between realtor Open Houses and Advertised Open Houses inviting the public to attend. There's absolutely no indication that I've noticed suggesting Shermans' realtor intended to host a Open House for the general public.

 

[JDG]

No I don't live in Toronto. But several of us here have explained the difference between realtor Open Houses and Advertised Open Houses inviting the public to attend. There's absolutely no indication that I've noticed suggesting Shermans' realtor intended to host a Open House for the general public.

And as much as I appreciate all of the 'correcting', I understood exactly what you meant. In Toronto, you will not be turned away from a 'Realtors Open House' if you stop by. I do understand your posts, perhaps wait to see if one has questions about them.
Now, I going back to sleuthing.

 

[MistyWaters]

I do find it odd. Maybe the existing home had them up and down stairs too much, so they would live in a luxury condo in the interim (in addition to the One Bloor, the Shermans or Apotex may have owned one). Perhaps the new house would have them living entirely on the first floor, as many seniors prefer, with guest rooms upstairs, or an elevator.

Yes that's possible. But then again, if it were me, in that case I'd move prior to the listing of my home. The inconvenience of residing in a listed home imo is something to avod if at all possible. Which makes me wonder if they indeed had moved and if so, what brought them back there on that fatal day.

JMO

 

[minorone]

If a regular person turns up to a realtor open house, they aren't turned away in Toronto. A contact is a contact, Ive been to a few as I was driving by, stopped in. As for checking if you are financially qualified, I supposed they can 'ask' but one is EVER obligated to give out financial details.
They certainly do not ask for 'proof' before showing a home. Any open house is for the realtors to make new contacts, its not about selling one particular home.

When a home is for sale, there is often a feature sheet available to all, with floor plans and pertinent information.

Even for the 'appointment only' homes, one need only make an appointment to view the house.

I would not have an Open House if I were to list. Serious buyers could view the property or I might just give out my name, phone number etc to some builders working in the area. Pick a time and day when they can come over/call with offers and then, use a good real estate lawyer to do the fine print 'stuff'.

When an upscale house goes on the market in Alberta it has been the norm since the 80's to pre-screen anyone (who is not a realtor) wanting to see these expensive homes (especially if they are on an acreage). Open houses are held here on the weekend in houses that are not considered to be upscale. Many homes that have gone up for sale here get broken into and robbed.

All realtor lockboxes here record the times and dates that everyone opened it and closed. Realtors are not always the most ethical. People with expensive property are very selective about which realtor gets the listing.

 

[MistyWaters]

When an upscale house goes on the market in Alberta it has been the norm since the 80's to pre-screen anyone (who is not a realtor) wanting to see these expensive homes (especially if they are on an acreage). Open houses are held here on the weekend in houses that are not considered to be upscale. Many homes that have gone up for sale here get broken into and robbed.

All realtor lockboxes here record the times and dates that everyone opened it and closed. Realtors are not always the most ethical. People with expensive property are very selective about which realtor gets the listing.

The listing realtor also has control of the code on the lockbox and what realtor is given access for a viewing. Unless Alberta is atypical, which I doubt, it's become commonplace for realtors to prescreen clients who are interested in viewing high end homes. Aside from the safety and due diligence aspect that you've mentioned, another of the reasons is realtors are not interested in wasting time showing homes to curiosity seekers who are not in a financial position to afford.

My opinion only, if this was a double homicide the Shermans were personally targeted and the home's listing was immaterial to the motive.