Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #23

[srper2]

It’s another one of our Aussie kids killed over there. I’m hurting as well.

Lucas Fowler, Justine Ruszczyk and now Brenton Estorffe.
All three too trusting. I guess the only way their ‘involved parents’ might have seen them survive is to keep them at home here in Aus but let’s face you can’t keep them wrapped in cotton wool.
One child ventures out with wonderment and another with a gun.
Go figure.

Also the random shooting murder of Chris lane They said they tried to shoot other people but kept missing. The way Chris Lane's cowardly killers made a game out of driving around shooting people (trying to shoot more people) reminds me a lot of the cowardly, cold and detached attitude also seen in BS and KM's murder spree.

 

[they'll get you]

Also the random shooting murder of Chris lane They said they tried to shoot other people but kept missing. The way Chris Lane's cowardly killers made a game out of driving around shooting people (trying to shoot more people) reminds me a lot of the cowardly, cold and detached attitude also seen in BS and KM's murder spree.

Yes Chris Lane.
Bastards!

I just don’t get it.

 

[MistyWaters]

Ok so if you have no interest in knowing more about them, then what is your motivation for continuing to follow this case? (Again, I am asking this question out of genuine curiosity.)

The same question could be asked of anyone still discussing this case because it’s over.

Isn’t this what we wanted to know? What more is there?

“Police said it appeared the pair decided to kill themselves after getting trapped in an area of the woods they couldn’t escape from. RCMP also said they couldn’t determine if the killings were planned or not, but there was no clear leader of the two. Police described the pair in a “partnership.”

The RCMP said its Behavioural Analysis Unit believes the videos may inspire copycat killers and that releasing them would be seen as disrespectful to the victims and their families. Therefore, police are not releasing the videos.

Based on the evidence, police say no other suspects are responsible for the three homicides....”
Port Alberni suspects confessed to northern B.C. murders in recorded videos but showed no remorse: police

 

[NJSleuth91]

The same question could be asked of anyone still discussing this case because it’s over.

Isn’t this what we wanted to know? What more is there?

I think most people who are still here, are probably still here because they want to know more information on the background of these guys, warning signs, what events led up to them deciding to take this trip, etc. And maybe answers to some of the things that are still unclear in the case, of which there are many.

But you said you have no interest in knowing any of that. Moreover, you have posted articles indicating it is potentially dangerous to release any more information on these guys. So I'm wondering what your answer is to the question....

 

[Grouper]

The same question could be asked of anyone still discussing this case because it’s over.

Isn’t this what we wanted to know? What more is there?

“Police said it appeared the pair decided to kill themselves after getting trapped in an area of the woods they couldn’t escape from. RCMP also said they couldn’t determine if the killings were planned or not, but there was no clear leader of the two. Police described the pair in a “partnership.”

The RCMP said its Behavioural Analysis Unit believes the videos may inspire copycat killers and that releasing them would be seen as disrespectful to the victims and their families. Therefore, police are not releasing the videos.

Based on the evidence, police say no other suspects are responsible for the three homicides....”
Port Alberni suspects confessed to northern B.C. murders in recorded videos but showed no remorse: police

For many people, this case is not “over”.

Several people still have questions that may never be answered, such as what events in Kam and Bryer’s lives led up to these actions.

For the people who wanted to hear RCMP confirm whether or not Kam and Bryer confessed to the murders, it is “over” in that sense. Of course, some of these people are also still participating in discussions, which is interesting to me. Maybe out of habit, maybe out of an unconscious desire to know something more. I can’t speak to those other people so MOO.

EDIT: I meant I can’t speak *to the desires and motivations of* those other people

 

[CinNC]

OK I know there are several disparities between this case and the Beltway Shootings near DC in 2002. Not to mention the difference in age between the two perps; John Allen Muhammad (41) and Lee Boyd Malvo (17). Their motives were bizarrely improbable and completely different from one another's. Yet, they became a pair of killers who, despite their differences, found a way to feed off of each other and create a "team effort".

By the same token, the Beltway Shooters were similar to KM/BS in the sense that they randomly killed their victims on an opportunistic basis. They were hunting for victims, but it was only through the chance physical locations and activities paired with the victims' vulnerability that determined their fates. The killings took place over the course of ten months and were completely random.

My point is not to find a detailed parallel between the two cases, but it makes me wonder (in terms of different motives) whether BS was the one with the need to kill, and KM was simply the driver of the "getaway car". JMO

D.C. sniper attacks - Wikipedia

 

[CinNC]

Yes, that is definitely true. There's also entire regions of the country my husband and I can never travel to because it would be too risky due to my husband's ethnicity

Oh, wow...good thing you left. My MIL almost got hired by some financial company in the WTC (I forgot which one) but refused because she was scared to be in an office that high up. They lost a lot of employees in 9/11 including the guy who interviewed her.

My bro in law was a director for Marsh ... he lost 295 direct reports on 9/11. He and my sister went to 2 funerals per day for months afterwards. He wasn't in his 88th floor, corner office with floor to ceiling windows looking out on Manhattan Harbor that day, though - he was at a meeting in Midtown.

 

[MistyWaters]

If we’re looking for similarities, we don’t have to look any further than a high profile trial that occurred in Canada in 2016.

Bosma's accused murderers killed "for the thrill of it": Crown attorney
“They killed, stole and burned together," Leitch said.

"Pay attention to the facts. One, they murdered him for his truck, in his truck. Two, they burned and disposed of every piece of evidence they could. They accomplished their mission to kill and burn an innocent man."..”

But what’s different is both of the above were arrested and convicted of 1st degree murder. I don’t recall any great public outpouring by caring citizens wanting to know more about them or why this duo might’ve felt they were required to experience a so-called “thrill” by causing the death of an innocent stranger. The public consensus was total satisfaction when both were convicted. The trial provided no answers as each pled not guilty and pointed the finger at the other.

In this case I also suspect, had the two been convicted, they’d have proven far less interesting. All it takes is the media capturing a smirk during the perp walk.

 

[NJSleuth91]

@MistyWaters

I don't think they were that similar. Those guys intended to get away with their crimes and continue normal life in between. For Kam and Bryer, the evidence indicates it was probably always intended to be an extinction burst ending in suicide. If anything it seems like they led the police to themselves on several occasions. Plus Kam and Bryer said they did it and these guys still deny it to this day.

Those guys also committed escalating crimes over a period of a few years. So far, there's no evidence Kam and Bryer committed any crimes before this.

Also there are fewer unanswered questions in that case because those guys are still alive and have been questioned, and there was a trial where all the information was publicly released. Not so in this case.

 

[MistyWaters]

@MistyWaters

I don't think they were that similar. Those guys intended to get away with their crimes and continue normal life in between. For Kam and Bryer, the evidence indicates it was probably always intended to be an extinction burst ending in suicide. If anything it seems like they led the police to themselves on several occasions. Plus Kam and Bryer said they did it and these guys still deny it to this day.

Those guys also committed escalating crimes over a period of a few years. So far, there's no evidence Kam and Bryer committed any crimes before this.

Also there are fewer unanswered questions in that case because those guys are still alive and have been questioned, and there was a trial where all the information was publicly released. Not so in this case.

I mentioned the high profile Canadian case only because of the similarities. But there’s never going to be two identical situations because even though murderers have killing in common, their personal situations differ. I think it’s possible B&K only took their lives rather than starve to death or get eaten alive by bugs after they found themselves trapped down a slippery slope. Nobody knows for sure.

But the similarities to DM and MS are -
Thrill killing of total strangers.
The needless theft of a vehicle was involved.
Burning, incineration.
Two killers working in tandem.

But I’m not comparing the above with any insinuation it was a copycat killing. My point is what B&K did, the manner and style of killing is not totally unheard of. It’s sounds like something common to psychopaths - to destroy lives just because they can, never thinking they’ll get caught. That’s the reason for no motive, no answers to be found. JMO

 

[NJSleuth91]

never thinking they’ll get caught.

SBM

Kam and Bryer knew they would get caught when they burned their vehicle right next to their murder victim, and stole his vehicle. In fact, I think that was kind of the point...they wanted people to know they did it.

Their subsequent actions indicated they knew that was a point of no return. Clearly they knew there was no returning to normal life. They didn't attempt to do so. And, since they bought the gas can days beforehand, and presumably filled it up at some point, it's most likely that burning their vehicle and stealing the next victim's vehicle was part of their plan since the 15th.

Since notoriety was one of their motives (as stated in the report), I think they did things like burning the vehicles to get the police on their trail, but a few steps behind. Almost like they were trolling the police.

(Also, that's another difference between them and Millard/Smich...Millard/Smich did not have notoriety as a motive. Quite the opposite -- they never wanted anyone to find out it was them, and even now they don't admit to it.)

It would have been very easy to get away with murder in such a remote area. There would be so many places to hide the victims' bodies so it would take a while for them to be found, if ever. Millard and Smich took many steps to cover up what they did. But Kam and Bryer didn't do that at all. They did the exact opposite. That's probably because they never intended to get away with it.

From the description of the videos, they also didn't seem bothered at all by the prospect of killing themselves. That indicates to me that was probably in the plan all along, too.

 

[Satchie]

If we’re looking for similarities, we don’t have to look any further than a high profile trial that occurred in Canada in 2016.

Bosma's accused murderers killed "for the thrill of it": Crown attorney
“They killed, stole and burned together," Leitch said.

"Pay attention to the facts. One, they murdered him for his truck, in his truck. Two, they burned and disposed of every piece of evidence they could. They accomplished their mission to kill and burn an innocent man."..”

But what’s different is both of the above were arrested and convicted of 1st degree murder. I don’t recall any great public outpouring by caring citizens wanting to know more about them or why this duo might’ve felt they were required to experience a so-called “thrill” by causing the death of an innocent stranger. The public consensus was total satisfaction when both were convicted. The trial provided no answers as each pled not guilty and pointed the finger at the other.

In this case I also suspect, had the two been convicted, they’d have proven far less interesting. All it takes is the media capturing a smirk during the perp walk.

IMO the trials and the motives were big headlines. 'Steal the truck' seemed just a thrill, but there had previously been 'get rid of Dellen's troublesome ex-girlfriend', and 'get control of the airport project and inherit his father's wealth'. By the time the final verdict was given, many years had passed and we were thoroughly familiar with and sick of them.

 

[Lalalacasbah]

I have a close family member whose career was interviewing psychopaths in prisons. In the past I've always him "why do they do that?"

There's textbook patterns/answers for certain personality disorders and he also mentioned even if you ask a murderer or psychopath why he/she did it, you can't believe them most times as they've been seasoned pretenders/liars their whole life. They will play you too and can make whatever up.

I'm sure there's a few who may be truthful, but the professionals probably know what information is legit or not.

So even the Columbine guys and B&K may have "their" reasons, who really knows if that's what it is or if they just wanted to see what it was like (probably falls under one of the personality disorders). JMO JMO

 

[Sillybilly]

Thread is closed folks.

If there are any new MSM articles, please post them to the Media, Maps, Timeline *NO DISCUSSION* thread.