Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #8

[Kubirai]

See, now this makes sense to me now. They only got $20 gas, because maybe they didn't actually need gas but had to stop for gas now because that's what they said they were doing.... and they ask the clerk for confirmation about no alcohol because they probably were so scared/nervous they didn't hear the constables lol

Yes, even their burning of the RAV4 makes sense after that encounter. They didn't want to risk being stopped again, and searched thoroughly. RAV4 probably had items from all 3 victims, and maybe the murder weapons too.

 

[MassGuy]

What an interesting observation. Of course, in real life, tracking the course of an investigation requires the collection of bits and pieces of verifiable evidence but then, equally importantly, that evidence needs to be interpreted within the reasonable possibilities for their relevance. Wouldn't you agree? And, in determining that relevance, a number of imaginative scenarios must be considered. In many situations, there are actually only a limited number of potential alternatives. It is up to the imaginative scenario builder to establish if the facts support it and, if so, if a suspect should be specifically examined on that basis. MOO of course, but a knowledgeable one.

Absolutely. But if these “imaginative scenarios” have no basis in fact, or require ridiculous assumptions, then that’s a problem.

Unless the RCMP is completely incompetent, doesn’t follow best practices, makes up evidence, and files charges without merit, I think some of these theories are ridiculous.

Got a theory? Back it up with facts.

 

[Deleted member 248860]

I don't think Lucas Fowler's status in Canada would have allowed him to obtain a long gun.

That’s an interesting question. There are questions on the application that would be a problem for a visitor. It may be that one has to have immigrant status, haven’t checked it.

 

[scrappinkat]

What are they supposed to do, put out milk and cookies? Their children are fugitives from the law, I don't think "come home, everything will be alright" is going to cut it.

No. But they could make a public plea to their kids telling them that whatever happened happened but it’s time to give up, come back and deal with it, no matter how dire the consequences will be that they will try and support them as best as possible though it.

 

[sleuth3000]

I don't recall seeing an RCMP warning that the suspects are armed. I just recall seeing a statement to not approach and to call 911. I'm not certain RCMP knows if the 2 suspects presently have a firearm.

"considered armed and dangerous" has been a frequent by-line. I mean, IDK if thats something they just say about any fugitives but evidence seems to suggest they at least had a gun, if not have. Evidence that we dont have seems to suggest it strongly

 

[Danaya]

I think they might be dead. Insects, wolves, hunger, desperation. What are the chances their remains are never discovered and this turns into an unsolved mystery?

 

[afitzy]

It would be a slimmest of all chances if Lucas Fowler was armed. His upbringing, essentially, would be of a gun free zone, particularly since his father was a copper in NSW. That's how it works.. they are the most rabid and stringent anti gun folks of all. NSW coppers haven't been carrying guns for that long, either, only about 20 years.. before that, they dealt with stuff by a stern look and a verbal bollocking.

And they still do, out of preference. Something about NSW coppers, they love the shirtfront approach, and they have it down to a fine art. This is what Lucas would have been exposed to most of his life.

for example. ….

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Curious @Trooper if you are from Australia how a similar case might play out there with the NSW coppers?

We have seen so many differences in things but its mainly been a US/Canada back and forth with a huge learning curve for non canadians.

I'm curious if most Commonwealth countries would have similar policing styles?

But based on the NSW video you posted I don't think I could imagine that happening in Canada! So, maybe there are differences. Curious.

 

[Trooper]

Thanks for posting that video! Wonder how the NSW police are faring? Haven't heard a peep from them and would be ever so curious to know what they are thinking about hashtag Canadamanhunt?

Bearing in mind, the two NSW detectives, there with the Western Division of the RCMP are there as a courtesy to Mr Fowler and the Australian Police community at large, and not in any investigatory position whatsoever, having no jurisdiction, but they would be in constant communication with the Fowler family. I very much doubt if they would see their remit as one of disclosing one iota of info to any Australian news agency, except, and it would be a big exception, to the ABC.. the AU equivalent of the CBC and the BBC. No other news agency would be considered.

I have looked on the NSW POL website, and there isn't anything … not surprisingly. It is not exactly an official exchange of personnel, but a gesture of good will and international harmony.

As an aside.. a young Canadian woman was murdered by a stupid Sydney Australian man, horribly, and the NSW arranged for two RCMP chaps to accompany her mother, and brother ( I think ) in Sydney for the trial, and to be her spokesperson and the go-for for the bereaved family. It isn't unusual for this kind of exchange and reciprocated stuff going on , especially, between the UK, NZ, AU, Canada.

 

[Kubirai]

Tunnels? Where did that come from?
I highly doubt out there in the swampy muskeg e Bush that the electric company has built tunnels. I'm just throwing it out there really don't think that there are tunnels.

Tunnels may carry the diverted river flow to the turbines, but they would be buried underground, like in Niagara.

Hydro corridors are below the high voltage power lines, visible in Google maps satellite view.

 

[Zella]

RE split lake search and firearms

From the report I read didn't seem like an exhaustive search, and even implied there were boxes that werent checked. I'm not really picturing them going through with a fine tooth comb, prolly just a quick look see to make sure the trunk wasnt full of liquor. I dont even imagine they would have had to get out of the car.

And I mean IDK about y'all but seems to make perfect sense they would take some elementary precautions to hide their alleged murder weapon.

This was my impression, too. The constables had a specific focus and once they ascertained there was no obvious liquor, the two were on their way, with a lecture about stopping for roadblocks next time. That's not a criticism of the constables--they certainly had no idea who they were dealing with. They did their job and moved on.

I've found it interesting their comment that BS was especially nervous. I'm getting the impression he might be the squirrelly one of the pair.

 

[afitzy]

"considered armed and dangerous" has been a frequent by-line. I mean, IDK if thats something they just say about any fugitives but evidence seems to suggest they at least had a gun, if not have. Evidence that we dont have seems to suggest it strongly

IDK but the alert put out for the escaped US murder suspect made him sound more frightening and more dangerous than the 2 suspects in this case.

 

[scrappinkat]

Here in Canada we're not allowed to just throw a gun into the truck and drive down the road. So to speak. There's a lot of rules and regulations about guns in Canada. Transporting them, the lock mechanisms, storage, where you're going with them Etc.

Firearms regulation in Canada - Wikipedia

There’s a difference in guns though. Restricted guns, as in any handgun and any other gun listed as restricted, are very controlled with definite rules to follow. You can’t just drive around them, has to be a lawful reason. Either going to a competition, moving to a new place or going to the range would be examples, and that’s only after you’ve called into the CFO and obtained permission for going to those specific places. Even then you are supposed to take the most direct route to your destination and guns must be in a locked container and guns themselves must be trigger locked in that container.

Non-restricted rifles are a little easier to carry around. As long as they are unloaded in the vehicle it’s legal. Edited to add that that I forgot to account that rules for non-restricted are provincial (I’m in BC) There are provinces with different laws for non-restricted.

 

[JudgeJudi]

The midday ABC news in Sydney played a short clip of a reporter speaking to a young woman who told RCMP that she thought she saw the two suspects. She saw two very tall men at York Landing but she only saw them from the rear.

 

[Kiantra]

I think LF had been working on a ranch in BC for several months, hadn't he? Long enough to legally aquire a long gun for a trip into the far north where self reliance is essential.

Perhaps. But he may not have obtained a license. A friend/acquaintance could have said, ‘Hey, if your heading into the back country there are bears there etc’. ‘ Hey. Take my gun’. I don’t think that’s unreasonable

 

[afitzy]

This was my impression, too. The constables had a specific focus and once they ascertained there was no obvious liquor, the two were on their way, with a lecture about stopping for roadblocks next time. That's not a criticism of the constables--they certainly had no idea who they were dealing with. They did their job and moved on.

I've found it interesting their comment that BS was especially nervous. I'm getting the impression he might be the squirrelly one of the pair.

Or he is squirming because he is in withdrawl from Ritalin....it sounds like a painful process and he wouldn't be able to sit still...could also be mistaken for a tweeker/tweaker which would certainly have him standing out in a crowd at 6'4".

 

[Danaya]

So who thinks the alleged garbage dump sighting was them and who thinks it was a case of mistaken identity?

What I don't understand is if it was them, surely they couldn't outrun the law, that desperate and hungry?

 

[Zella]

Or he is squirming because he is in withdrawl from Ritalin....it sounds like a painful process and he wouldn't be able to sit still...could also be mistaken for a tweeker/tweaker which would certainly have him standing out in a crowd at 6'4".

That's very true, too! He certainly does seem to be more of a fidgeter and more visibly nervous.

Edit: should probably clarify, I'm a nervous fidgeter by nature, too. So, I know some folks are just naturally that way, but it's been a recurring theme with him.

 

[scrappinkat]

That’s an interesting question. There are questions on the application that would be a problem for a visitor. It may be that one has to have immigrant status, haven’t checked it.

If he took the course and passed he would have been allowed to apply for PAL.

 

[Kubirai]

Non-restricted rifles are a little easier to carry around. As long as they are unloaded in the vehicle it’s legal.

Unloaded, in a case, and you are actually going hunting or returning home. Then locked in a proper gun cabinet.

 

[missy1974]

Yes, even their burning of the RAV4 makes sense after that encounter. They didn't want to risk being stopped again, and searched thoroughly. RAV4 probably had items from all 3 victims, and maybe the murder weapons too.

hmm possibly, but I'm not convinced that they didn't have another vehicle before they lit the RAV4 on fire. They easily could have driven it into the bush and it would have taken much longer to find.