CO - Dylan Redwine, 13, Vallecito, 19 November 2012 - #39

[The Cheese]

The only "facts" we have are that Dylan was last physically accounted for at 7:22pm. He was with his father at this time. His communication device(s) were last accounted for at 9:37pm. His father reported him missing at 6pm the next day. He and everything that he brought with him to Bayfield are missing.

Nothing MR has said is considered fact.

These facts do not fit in with a stranger abduction. They indicate that something happened to Dylan after 9:37pm on the evening of Nov 18, 2012.

MOO

LE has all the facts. They fit with abduction for them. Whether they mean family abduction, non-family abduction, stereotypical kidnapping, or all the above, only they know. (I'm assuming by "stranger abduction" you mean stereotypical kidnapping.)

"He either left the house and someone abducted him or something happened while he was still at the house. I could not think of a 3rd possibility," said Dan Bender, spokesman from the La Plata County Sheriff's Office.

 

[mijamawi]

Hypothetically speaking... Dylan and his dad get into an argument on the way home. They first argued about Dylan not getting to go to his friends that night, then Dad is trying to talk to him about his new house and his new stepfather, and they argue about that too because Mark starts talking smack about them.

Dylan talks back to his dad and Marks not used to that, but Dylan has grown up since he is almost 14 now. Mark grabs D's cell because he has been texting and being rude. D gets mad about that and is seething.

They get back to the house, D stomps in and ignores his Dad...who is still angry about how 'ungrateful' his kid is acting. Dad goes to his room, MAYBE drinks a little to calm down. He stews for awhile, then decides to apologize. He goes to D and finds him texting from his i-pod. NOW Mark is angry, because he had taken the cell away and told him to stop texting his friends and there is D going behind his back. They argue, and D says " PEACE OUT--I'm out of here." And he grabs his stuff and leaves, intending to walk to his friends house or calling for a ride, but first he has to get his cell back from Dad. Maybe they tussle over it. OR maybe he just walks out angry and Dad follows, and the fight takes place down the road somewhere, when Mark catches up to him. All it takes is one angry punch.

So did he carry the body to the lake, which is what, 4 miles away? Did he drive the body to the lake? Would there be a scent in his truck if so?

I dont think he made it to the house.
I think they got out of the truck had a fight.
There is no crime scene.
I think he is in the lake back pack and cell phone.

JMO

There's always a crime scene if a crime was committed.

The only "facts" we have are that Dylan was last physically accounted for at 7:22pm. He was with his father at this time. His communication device(s) were last accounted for at 9:37pm. His father reported him missing at 6pm the next day. He and everything that he brought with him to Bayfield are missing.

Nothing MR has said is considered fact.

These facts do not fit in with a stranger abduction. They indicate that something happened to Dylan after 9:37pm on the evening of Nov 18, 2012.

MOO

I don't think we can use that blanket statement. His whereabouts on Monday morning were verified.

Respectfully since he was the parent that had physical custody he could probably be charged with something. The Skelton boys father was charged with custodial interference when they disappeared on a court ordered Thanksgiving visit with him. No bodies have ever been found but he got 15-20 years anyway.:twocents::moo:

In the Skelton case though, didn't he admit handing the kids off to someone? Big difference in this case.

 

[BeginnersLuck]

Court ordered visitation is standard terminology.

The media has sensationalized this by putting emphasis on it and people have taken it in wrong text.

Elaine was give primary custody when she moved. The court establishes parenting time, therefore it is termed court ordered.

The standard model the court uses is what I and someone else again posted up thread.

Parents typically split holidays. The non-custodial parent gets every other weekend and maybe one day during the week. But, because of distance between the parents sometimes it doesn't work out. MR's work schedule would also prevent him from being able to see Dylan according to a standard schedule.

So, why is there such a issue about the Thanksgiving holiday? Was it not a holiday that MR would have had Dylan as per court order? Did Dylan want to go, or was he being torn between two parents and what they wanted?

ER has stated that Dylan was excited to go visit his friends and then she has indicated that he didn't want to go at all. So, I am confused. I don't know how Dylan felt, for the same reason a judge wouldn't know how a child feels and sometimes talks to them in private about these matters. The parents aren't privy to the private conversation.

The whole custody/visitation battle is just really sad for any child to have to go through, due to the parents disagreeing. At 13 I think a child should have a choice at that age.

I don't know what Dylan's choice was.

 

[aust amateur slueth]

Children don't grow up hating their father for no reason. It is quite often speculated that he is a cold-blooded killer, and there is no basis for that theory either, that I've seen.

I would just like to know what he did to deserve the hatred of two ex-wives. Other than one incident which happened several years ago, I don't see that he's been nearly deserving of the accusations that have been tossed around about how horrible a person he is. And we have yet to see any reasons why his older sons despise him and want nothing to do with him. How did they come to that decision? Maybe it's none of our business, but it sure would help ME to understand why so many people believe he could kill his son.

I am in no way accusing either ex-wife of alienating their children against him. But women have done this since the beginning of time, it's a natural defense for some women. If they can turn the kids against Daddy, then they are assured that the kids will love Mommy more and want to be with her. Or some have done it out of spite for various reasons.

Again...NOT SAYING THIS IS THE SITUATION IN THIS CASE!!!! But it could be a possibility, and every bit as possible as him killing his own son.

JMO, IMO, MOO, etc.

children are very observant, they take a lot in even from very young and they grow up hating a parent who hurts them emotionally or physically or if they see a parent being violent towards the other parent.

there may have been domestic violence where both ex wives were too afraid to report it or they may have tried to report it and been told there was nothing that could be done about it or they may have had the childrens wellbeing dangled over them as a threat (not stating this as a fact, although I have serious suspicions that DV is the case)

we know he has previously hidden their children from their Moms, refused the children contact with their Moms. IMO it was done to hurt the women for having the temerity to leave him, how dare they. there certainly doesn't seem to be any care or consideration from him about how that would effect the children long term.

 

[Eileen730]

How do you know he would be on his bike? What if the tires were flat? If he was going to fish, he wouldn't ride a bike, and especially if he thought he could get a ride.

Well IMO if he was going to go 20 miles he takes his bike.If he was going to fish why take his clothes?

 

[SuperMom1995]

The reporter's phone ringing inside Mark's house where he deems the signal to be spotty doesn't say anything to me. I think reception depends on the carrier. Inside my house I get a lovely signal on my cell phone, yet my sister has to walk out to the top of the driveway to get any signal at all. Different carriers.

Dylan's friend's comment about Dylan's propensity to show up randomly speaks volumes to me of the possibility that Dylan came to shortly after Mark left the home and decided to head out instead of waiting for his dad to return. ("show up randomly" also says to me "without calling first.") I sure wouldn't embark on a 20 mile journey walking or hitching or whatever without checking that there was someone at my destination expecting me, but I am not 13. It has been said many times here, and it's my own personal experience that we can't expect a 13 year old to make sense always.

I love that age group and think their unpredictability is part of their charm. One minute they are wise as Solomon and in the next breath they are clueless as a puppy. It's just the way they're wired.

But the showing up randomly could have been when he lived much closer to them and I would think by 13 you would have some concept of how far away you were from your destination but maybe not. JMO

 

[Ronald99]

I do not think he walked out that door to go to bayfield.
If he did he would be on his bike.
but no he grabbed a fishing pole!

JMO

it amazed me how MR noticed Dylan's Fishing Pole missing, Or was it ever missing !!

 

[Kamille]

Children don't grow up hating their father for no reason. It is quite often speculated that he is a cold-blooded killer, and there is no basis for that theory either, that I've seen.

I would just like to know what he did to deserve the hatred of two ex-wives. Other than one incident which happened several years ago, I don't see that he's been nearly deserving of the accusations that have been tossed around about how horrible a person he is. And we have yet to see any reasons why his older sons despise him and want nothing to do with him. How did they come to that decision? Maybe it's none of our business, but it sure would help ME to understand why so many people believe he could kill his son.

I am in no way accusing either ex-wife of alienating their children against him. But women have done this since the beginning of time, it's a natural defense for some women. If they can turn the kids against Daddy, then they are assured that the kids will love Mommy more and want to be with her. Or some have done it out of spite for various reasons.

Again...NOT SAYING THIS IS THE SITUATION IN THIS CASE!!!! But it could be a possibility, and every bit as possible as him killing his own son.

JMO, IMO, MOO, etc.

According to MR Dylan never hated his father, in fact it was quite the opposite. MR claims that they were very close. I also don't believe anyone here has accused him of being a cold blooded killer? If anything, I see most people who think he is involved either considering an argument gone tragically wrong or a possible attempt at hiding him from his mother.

I believe we have a verified insider AZgrandma, MR's first ex-wife, who has graciously given us some insight as to why she has had issue with MR as a husband and a father in the past and we've seen some interviews with ER, the other ex-wife that have shed some light on her feelings on the matter. I think we might see more of that on the Dr Phil show.

Two of his older sons came to town right after the disappearance to talk with him and get some answers regarding their little brother. Neither of them appear to have gotten those answers nor wanted to meet with him again according to MR. They are grown men. Logic would indicate that they are making their own decisions based on what they see and know.

We are likely never going to know the intricate details of MR's relationships with these people as well as we have no business to. We have been fortunate to have gotten the information that we have. It's enough for me to know that MR perhaps hasn't conducted himself in the best possible way as an ex husband or father. Now whether that has any bearing on what has happened to Dylan is yet to be seen I suppose.

MOO

 

[BeginnersLuck]

children are very observant, they take a lot in even from very young and they grow up hating a parent who hurts them emotionally or physically or if they see a parent being violent towards the other parent.

there may have been domestic violence where both ex wives were too afraid to report it or they may have tried to report it and been told there was nothing that could be done about it or they may have had the childrens wellbeing dangled over them as a threat (not stating this as a fact, although I have serious suspicions that this is the case)

we know he has previously hidden their children from their Moms, refused the children contact with their Moms. IMO it was done to hurt the women for having the temerity to leave him, how dare they. there certainly doesn't seem to be any care or consideration from him about how that would effect the children long term.

But there is no indication that MR was mentally, emotionally or physically abusive towards Dylan at anytime in his life. Even ER hasn't indicated this. Dylan could have told a judge and CPS could have gotten involved if this were the case. Do parents that don't get along do stupid stuff when they are fighting and going through a divorce? Every couple that I know in that situation has.

Do a lot of adults get drunk and do really stupid stuff. Yes, unfortunately it happens all the time. Most adults have skeletons in their closet. In this case MR's are being exposed due to Dylan's disappearance. If ER and her fiance weren't so far away at the time, their dirty laundry would be brought out also.

 

[SuperMom1995]

Circumstantial evidence is most often employed in criminal trials. Many circumstances can create inferences about an accused's guilt in a criminal matter, including the accused's resistance to arrest; the presence of a motive or opportunity to commit the crime; the accused's presence at the time and place of the crime; any denials, evasions, or contradictions on the part of the accused; and the general conduct of the accused. In addition, much Scientific Evidence is circumstantial, because it requires a jury to make a connection between the circumstance and the fact in issue. For example, with fingerprint evidence, a jury must make a connection between this evidence that the accused handled some object tied to the crime and the commission of the crime itself.

Link: http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Circumstantial+Evidence

In many cases, circumstantial evidence is the only evidence linking an accused to a crime; direct evidence may simply not exist. As a result, the jury may have only circumstantial evidence to consider in determining whether to convict or acquit a person charged with a crime. In fact, the U.S. Supreme Court has stated that "circumstantial evidence is intrinsically no different from testimonial [direct] evidence"(Holland v. United States, 348 U.S. 121, 75 S. Ct. 127, 99 L. Ed. 150 [1954]).

 

[Kamille]

I don't think we can use that blanket statement. His whereabouts on Monday morning were verified.

Respectfully snipped

Yes you are correct. I missed those facts. MR was in the Durango area at approximately 8:30am until approximately 10:30am. He was also in the Bayfield area at approximately 4pm.

 

[SuperMom1995]

Once again, I am having an easier time finding motives for someone closer to the situation than the actual parents.

This must be one of the most bizarre cases in some time.

Spousal Revenge, cut off child support, change in custody (control), ex wife re-marrying.

 

[nursebeeme]

ILL delete it but yes its true
She said he didnt contact him.

and Ill find the link if it tAKES me all day!

don't break your eye balls looking Eileen! I just didn't recall hearing that before. It is all good!

 

[mijamawi]

Do we know when Elaine and Mike got back together?

 

[SuperMom1995]

I have no interest in convincing anyone of anything lol. With LE releasing very little facts, there is no proof of abduction, hitchhicking, MR being responsible etc. The whole case is all speculation, except Dylan is missing.

I am going to keep an open mind going into the Dr. Phil shows, although darn it, I don't think LE will spoon feed us any new information. It will give us a further opportunity to hear from MR, etc., evaluate & exercise our own common sense in speculating what happened to Dylan IMO.

I agree but we have a lot more circumstancial evidence surrounding Mark than we have other theories.

 

[Ronald99]

I am trying to think of what kind of leverage could be used against Mr. Redwine to compel him to reveal the truth. Question: What does he value the most? What could be taken away from him - or threatened to be taken away from him - that would rock him to his foundation?

I would say his freedom, but we know that does not always work (see Skelton case). I am afraid that punishing Elaine means more to this individual than even his freedom. And, that goal has been spectacurately accomplished.

Of course, the answer for most folks is his/her kids. But, well, there's no need to elaborate on that in this case. There's no leverage there.

Honestly, I am afraid there is nothing to use 'against' him, and this makes me very, very sad...

Intense hours of being interrogated.

First starting the interrogation in Reverse, and working towards the time he picked Dylan up at the airport.

 

[Eileen730]

it amazed me how MR noticed Dylan's Fishing Pole missing, Or was it ever missing !!

I personally believe its the pole that was found at the lake!
But thats JMO

 

[aust amateur slueth]

But there is no indication that MR was mentally, emotionally or physically abusive towards Dylan at anytime in his life. Even ER hasn't indicated this. Dylan could have told a judge and CPS could have gotten involved if this were the case. Do parents that don't get along do stupid stuff when they are fighting and going through a divorce? Every couple that I know in that situation has.

Do a lot of adults get drunk and do really stupid stuff. Yes, unfortunately it happens all the time. Most adults have skeletons in their closet. In this case MR's are being exposed due to Dylan's disappearance. If ER and her fiance weren't so far away at the time, their dirty laundry would be brought out also.

I belive I said children, I was speaking in general terms, I've met people who are still traumatised by things a parent did to them as children, or that they saw a parent do to the other parent. My half brother (much younger than me) when he was in his teens mentioned about seeing his dad throwing a coffe table at our Mom, no one knew he'd seen it happen, he was 4 years old when it happened.

IMO hiding children, keeping them confined and refusing them contact with their Mom is abusive, emotionally and psychologically to both the children and the Mom, its not acceptable behaviour on any level EVER.

 

[Eileen730]

don't break your eye balls looking Eileen! I just didn't recall hearing that before. It is all good!

LOL im looking.
I have someone else looking too cause she saw it also its wayyyy back in the early days.

 

[dlc]

LE has all the facts. They fit with abduction for them. Whether they mean family abduction, non-family abduction, stereotypical kidnapping, or all the above, only they know. (I'm assuming by "stranger abduction" you mean stereotypical kidnapping.)

"He either left the house and someone abducted him or something happened while he was still at the house. I could not think of a 3rd possibility," said Dan Bender, spokesman from the La Plata County Sheriff's Office.

And they also fit, apparently, with "something happened while he was still at the house."

JMO