CO- Dylan Redwine, 13, Vallecito, 19 November 2012 - #49

[SCHMAE]

Found this too, just through a google search:
http://www.coloradocollege.edu/other/staffcouncil/meetings/minutes/1-29-13.pdf

Another one, confirming the date ER returned to work:
http://www.gazette.com/articles/birthday-150446-dylan-vigil.html
"She was on her way to work Thursday morning — her first day back since Dylan disappeared."

Cold you are a ROCK STAR. i've been wondering forever if I really saw that.

 

[SCHMAE]

IIRC, Elaine went back to work the last week in January, and it was mid-week.

IIRC, Mark was back working on Dylan's birthday, I think in NM. He told M Blasius he wouldn't be able to get back in time for the events, but was going to pull over his truck and hold up a light for Dylan at 6:30, the time of the event. This came up in M Blasius' tweets.

:cow:

Right so ER went back late Jan and the article Cold put up said both parents ' recently' went back to work. So in an article on Jan 26 >>>
http://durangoherald.com/article/20130126/NEWS01/130129704/Demonstrators-call-out-Mark-Redwine--<< is where MR says he's been talking to other drivers every time he can. But according to the dates he had only been back to work a very few days a week or two TOPS , absolute tops. Agreed? I always wondered when he said that about the fliers because I knew he'd just gone back to work . See? So he's saying " oh i help, i give out the fliers to other truckers at work " ( paraphrasing) when in reality, he'd been sitting on his butt at home most of that time and not working at all, so if his " helping Dylan claim to fame" ( my words ) is handing out the flyers and talking to truckers about keeping them in their trucks, when he's out on the road, how much of that actually TOOK place between Dylans' disappearance and Jan 26 ? From what I can read, not that much.

SorryCheese, not directed at you , just attached to your post !

 

[ColdHands]

Right so ER went back late Jan and the article Cold put up said both parents ' recently' went back to work. So in an article on Jan 26 >>>
http://durangoherald.com/article/20130126/NEWS01/130129704/Demonstrators-call-out-Mark-Redwine--<< is where MR says he's been talking to other drivers every time he can. But according to the dates he had only been back to work a very few days a week or two TOPS , absolute tops. Agreed? I always wondered when he said that about the fliers because I knew he'd just gone back to work . See? So he's saying " oh i help, i give out the fliers to other truckers at work " ( paraphrasing) when in reality, he'd been sitting on his butt at home most of that time and not working at all, so if his " helping Dylan claim to fame" ( my words ) is handing out the flyers and talking to truckers about keeping them in their trucks, when he's out on the road, how much of that actually TOOK place between Dylans' disappearance and Jan 26 ? From what I can read, not that much.

SorryCheese, not directed at you , just attached to your post !

http://durangoherald.com/article/20130126/NEWS01/130129704/Demonstrators-call-out-Mark-Redwine
&#8220;I do a lot of things on my own,&#8221; said Redwine, a truck driver. Among his other activities, &#8220;every time I get (back) into Durango, I talk to other truck drivers&#8221; to have them keep fliers in their rigs, he said.

I'm not reading that as necessarily attached to his work. "Get back into Durango" could be interpreted as heading in to town (Durango) for errands, shopping, etc. IMO

I've looked and looked and can't find anything that specifically states his return to work date.

Quick edit to add: Isn't his payroll office in Durango? I'd think he might go in to his work every two weeks while he was on leave (payroll).

 

[SCHMAE]

http://durangoherald.com/article/20130126/NEWS01/130129704/Demonstrators-call-out-Mark-Redwine
“I do a lot of things on my own,” said Redwine, a truck driver. Among his other activities, “every time I get (back) into Durango, I talk to other truck drivers” to have them keep fliers in their rigs, he said.

I'm not reading that as necessarily attached to his work. "Get back into Durango" could be interpreted as heading in to town (Durango) for errands, shopping, etc. IMO

I've looked and looked and can't find anything that specifically states his return to work date.

Quick edit to add: Isn't his payroll office in Durango? I'd think he might go in to his work every two weeks while he was on leave (payroll).

THANK YOU ! I see now I've been in error all this time. I assumed ( yes i know i know ) that he meant when he was out on the road WORKING , but he's just saying he went into town and talked to the truckers, unrelated to work possibly. Wow , did I spend a lot of time and much of some of ya'lls barking up a dead end tree. That never happens............ :blushing:

 

[azgrandma]

So based on this information that you all are putting up (amazes me - ask and you shall receive) that we at least know that from November 19 to January 30th both parents were not working. Right? That would be 11 weeks which IMO would be covered under FMLA so neither parent was risking employment.

 

[azgrandma]

http://www.pinerivertimes.com/

 

[azgrandma]

IMO the article from Pine River Times indicates that the earlier reports of dogs hitting on the lake recently was not a mistake from the reporter.

 

[ColdHands]

http://www.pinerivertimes.com/news.asp?artid=1162

Wow, that's a highly detailed article! I'm thankful for all that information.

And it's great that the searches started, and didn't wait until mid-May.

&#8220;We aren&#8217;t disappointed in the work that was done at all. We know there&#8217;s a body in the lake (not necessarily Dylan), somewhere in or around the lake in a water source feeding the lake. I have no doubt after watching that dog (from Illinois) work.&#8221;

BBM: Wouldn't they be able to clear the possibility of a body in an incoming water source by taking the dogs to the inbound sources?

 

[Money Girl]

http://www.pinerivertimes.com/news.asp?artid=1162

Wow, that's a highly detailed article! I'm thankful for all that information.

And it's great that the searches started, and didn't wait until mid-May.

“We aren’t disappointed in the work that was done at all. We know there’s a body in the lake (not necessarily Dylan), somewhere in or around the lake in a water source feeding the lake. I have no doubt after watching that dog (from Illinois) work.”

BBM: Wouldn't they be able to clear the possibility of a body in an incoming water source by taking the dogs to the inbound sources?

But, doesn't it indicate the dogs were wrong yet again (as Bender said previously)? Are there any recommendations for fresh, highly trained dogs that could be brought in?

 

[katydid23]

The moment of death begins the process of decomposition. I'm no expert but I would expect within moments of death, the scent would be apparent to a dog trained to find it.

We discussed this extensively in the Lisa Irwin thread, after a cadaver dog hit in the master bedroom. IIRC, there is no clear consensus that it is in fact just a few moments before a dead body would be able to leave a scent for cadaver dogs. Some said that if a body is moved immediately upon death, if there is no remnants of a bloody struggle, there might not be anything for a dog to find later on. Some disagree, some agreed.

 

[ColdHands]

But, doesn't it indicate the dogs were wrong yet again (as Bender said previously)? Are there any recommendations for fresh, highly trained dogs that could be brought in?

I think this time it was new dog(s) from Illinois:

Hess said Hope for Dylan Redwine contacted the cadaver dog team best suited for their needs and flew in a handler and her dog that is specifically trained and certified on cadavers, but especially recognizes the scent of human remains on water.
The canine team arrived Tuesday, April 16....

I don't know how they could ever "clear" the entire lake, but it is intriguing that even with the dogs helping to pinpoint where to search they keep coming up empty handed.

 

[catswhiskers]

http://www.pinerivertimes.com/news.asp?artid=1162

Wow, that's a highly detailed article! I'm thankful for all that information.

And it's great that the searches started, and didn't wait until mid-May.

&#8220;We aren&#8217;t disappointed in the work that was done at all. We know there&#8217;s a body in the lake (not necessarily Dylan), somewhere in or around the lake in a water source feeding the lake. I have no doubt after watching that dog (from Illinois) work.&#8221;

BBM: Wouldn't they be able to clear the possibility of a body in an incoming water source by taking the dogs to the inbound sources?

There sure is a lot of info to take in there. I'm glad they were able to achieve so much over the past week without being impeded by lots of public or media scrutiny as well. I wish they could find and if possible eliminate the source of the repeated hits from all the dogs.

 

[The Cheese]

But, doesn't it indicate the dogs were wrong yet again (as Bender said previously)? Are there any recommendations for fresh, highly trained dogs that could be brought in?

Elaine brought in a new cadaver dog team from Illinois this time, and then that local guy Vreeland brought out his dog. Vreeland also worked the lake in November IIRC.

:cow:

 

[Money Girl]

We discussed this extensively in the Lisa Irwin thread, after a cadaver dog hit in the master bedroom. IIRC, there is no clear consensus that it is in fact just a few moments before a dead body would be able to leave a scent for cadaver dogs. Some said that if a body is moved immediately upon death, if there is no remnants of a bloody struggle, there might not be anything for a dog to find later on. Some disagree, some agreed.

I remember from the Stacy Peterson thread that the cadaver dogs hit in the master bedroom and it was said that the dogs could pick up the scent immediately after death. I will see if I can still find a MSM link with the official / scientific data.

 

[Money Girl]

Elaine brought in a new cadaver dog team from Illinois this time, and then that local guy Vreeland brought out his dog. Vreeland also worked the lake in November IIRC.

:cow:

Thanks, Cheese. I had read recently about some cadaver dogs that were trained on pseudo-scents and they could hit on certain animals.

Glad to hear Elaine brought in a new cadaver dog team. It sounds like they reinforce the hits of the other cadaver dogs.

The most important information I read is that the bottom of the lake at the dam was viewed, and only debris was found. (If I am interpreting it correctly.)

 

[The Cheese]

That is a lot of info. If I'm understanding it right, they did the same as LE in November, with dogs and side scan sonar. Then what they did different was that they put a ROV down on a grate that the sonar showed an abnormality on or near, and they didn't use divers like LE did because they said divers are only used for recovery.

So some things the same, and some things different.

:cow:

 

[katydid23]

I remember from the Stacy Peterson thread that the cadaver dogs hit in the master bedroom and it was said that the dogs could pick up the scent immediately after death. I will see if I can still find a MSM link with the official / scientific data.

It has been shown, however, that the dogs do not always get it right. Cadaver dogs are trained to detect gases given off by decomposing bodies, but there are questions surrounding their use. For instance how soon after death can they recognise a body, and how long must a 'fresh' body remain in one place for the dog to detect that it has been there. In addition, the dogs are taught by a variety of trainers, with each trainer predictably believing their own method to be better than others. Some train their dogs using synthetic smells, while others use decomposing meat. This means there is increased opportunity for unreliability, which then casts doubt over the dog's effectiveness.
Using buried and unburied pig carcasses to record the gases given off over a three-month period Anna and Helena's research project looked for any association between the stage of decomposition and the odour profile given off, in order to increase the accuracy of the cadaver dogs detection. Decomposition scents change over time so the project was investigating which gases are produced at which stage of decomposition and how long after death. If it is know what gases are given off at a particular point in time, comparisons can be made with the smells that the dogs have been trained to detect, to make sure they are searching for the correct ones.
Although this was only a preliminary investigation, the research did find differences in the gases from the carcasses and does show there is potential for further investigations.

http://www.cranfield.ac.uk/cds/cfi/cadaver.html

=============================================

From what I learned previously, SOME dogs are trained to pick up on the scent of immediately produced gases, while others are trained on later types of decomposition. So it is not always possible to pick up on the scent in a crime scene, if the body was moved very quickly after the death.

 

[The Cheese]

Thanks, Cheese. I had read recently about some cadaver dogs that were trained on pseudo-scents and they could hit on certain animals.

Glad to hear Elaine brought in a new cadaver dog team. It sounds like they reinforce the hits of the other cadaver dogs.

The most important information I read is that the bottom of the lake at the dam was viewed, and only debris was found. (If I am interpreting it correctly.)

My understanding is that their side scan sonar picked up one abnormality on the bottom on the grate. They put down the ROV, and that showed "large logs, sticks and rocks" on top of the grate. If I'm interpreting it correctly lol.

:cow:

 

[The Cheese]

So now Denise thinks there's a body in the lake, or around the lake, or in a tributary to the lake. Is that right? How are they going to track that down? Because now the scope is expanded to around the lake and the tributaries. How many tributaries are there? 5? Or are they the main tributaries and there are even more?

That scope is really overwhelming. The lake alone was enormous.

 

[catswhiskers]

My understanding is that their side scan sonar picked up one abnormality on the bottom on the grate. They put down the ROV, and that showed "large logs, sticks and rocks" on top of the grate. If I'm interpreting it correctly lol.

:cow:

Reading snippets quickly when I get a chance here. I may be way off base, but the grate mentioned wasn't in the area surrounded by the coffer dam was it??
Someone mentioned whether or not the excavator was used or not earlier upthread - there were some sizeable tree stumps visible in the pics published over the last couple of days. I'd imagine the machinery would be needed to lift them out of the way of the searchers, and not necessarily used for digging at all.
:moo: