CO- Dylan Redwine, 13, Vallecito, 19 November 2012 - #51

[Ghostwheel]

...respectfully snipped....


Ok, I didn't say anything about anyone exaggerating. I'm trying to hop on the bus and see how things went down according to others. So, let's get back to MR as having a violent temper. Rage killings, IMO, are usually pretty violent, no? Overkill? Someone mentioned earlier about MR having about 18 hours to cover up his crime. So, let's say he violently murdered Dylan at his house or outside the house. He's got 18 hours to clean up his mess. Does he drive Dylan's body as far as he can and still get back in time to make his errands? Doe he dump Dylan's body in the lake? Does he dig a shallow grave?

I think the lake is almost ruled out. If MR transported Dylan's dead body somewhere, then surely there would be hits on the truck, I would think anyway.

I'm rambling again.

I think it depends on the definition of "rage killing" (I cannot actually find one). To me, a rage killing could be as simple as getting angry enough to slap someone, they fall and hit their head on something hard and die. That is not, IMO, overkill or pretty violent, although violent enough. And that could happen anywhere: in a vehicle, outside of a vehicle, in a house, outside a house, at the side of the road, on a trail in the woods, next to a lake while fishing. So, if something like that happened to Dylan, his body could be in a lake, in the woods, off any road, etc and still there would be no HRD scent on a truck or in a house.

I am not saying any of that happened. Only that the above are some of many possibilities of what COULD have happened, and should not be ruled out unless proven impossible.

 

[aust amateur slueth]

Yes, I am saying there are degrees of abuse. I am not saying it is OK or alright, to slap someone once, but it is just a little 'less' violent. There is a big difference between an angry drunk who shoves someone or gives them a quick slap, imo, as opposed to someone who repeatedly punches someone in the face and kicks them over and over in the stomach, sending them to the emergency room. Shades of gray, imo. Night and day. All of it is abusive, but it is a matter of degree. And it is possible that someone can KILL a child with one quick punch, without leaving a bloody crime scene.

there are also different types of abuse

physical, emotional and psychological, all are extremely dangerous IMO and all leave scars that may not always be visible.

 

[Eileen730]

I didn't say anything about lying. <Mod Snip>...

I said that based on the violent tendencies that our verified insider has stated throughout these last 51 threads, IF MR went into a fit of rage, it was violent. Violent murders leave evidence. IMO

An assault on someone in anger is an act of violence. It does not necessarily have to leave evidence and we don't even really know where this all happened. Where is the crime scene.
A push a shove one hit to the head can cause death and leave nothing to know anything even happened. Personally I don't think MR was throwing things around I think he just got angry at his son and possibly Dylan said something to him and he blew a gasket. He could have grabbed him and shook him pushed him and he hit his head there are so many images we can come up with but in every one of them I see MR.

 

[TxLady2]

I think it depends on the definition of "rage killing" (I cannot actually find one). To me, a rage killing could be as simple as getting angry enough to slap someone, they fall and hit their head on something hard and die. That is not, IMO, overkill or pretty violent, although violent enough. And that could happen anywhere: in a vehicle, outside of a vehicle, in a house, outside a house, at the side of the road, on a trail in the woods, next to a lake while fishing. So, if something like that happened to Dylan, his body could be in a lake, in the woods, off any road, etc and still there would be no HRD scent on a truck or in a house.

I am not saying any of that happened. Only that the above are some of many possibilities of what COULD have happened, and should not be ruled out unless proven impossible.

I don't think what you described would be classified as a rage killing, it sounds more like accidental, like the person was angry enough to slap or punch someone but did not intend to kill them. If the victim fell and hit their head due to the slap or punch, it was not intentional. Most abusers don't set out to kill their victims, only to hurt and subdue them. It's a control thing, not an intent to kill.
My question is, why would he become so violently angry enough to kill Dylan? That kind of anger has to stem from something, it doesn't just happen for no reason. So what could Dylan have said or done that would cause him to be so out-of-control that he would do something to cause his son's death? That's where I have the problem with accepting that scenario. Intense anger has to have a starting point, there has to be some reason they go into that kind of rage, whether it's something someone said or did or failed to do. In my experience, it is usually something that has built up over time where one incident just sets it off. But I can't imagine anything that would cause that much anger towards his son, it doesn't make sense.

 

[Eileen730]

To me an accident is................ bumping into someone, Traffic accident.

Hitting someone is no accident hitting someone hard enuff to cause death could be an accident only because you didn't mean for them to die but its a crime.

Anger is a horrible thing I have seen its face way to many times. Alcohol does not help and clouds the vision!

JM thoughts

 

[Bayou Mistress]

IMO, Dylan left his father's house under his own power. He either met someone by design, stumbled into the wrong person, or was involved in an accident.

 

[mijamawi]

Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought you were implying that MR could not have done this, because if he did snap, and he he was a drunken, violent rageful person, he would lose control and would have left evidence at the crime scene.

I was not implying anything of the sort. I was stating that if MR is a violent abuser, I would think a sudden fit of rage killing would leave behind some evidence, as we were discussing premeditated vs. not.

Just as I have no proof MR did this, I also have no proof he didn't. I was discussing possibilities. <Mod Snip>.

 

[Money Girl]

BBM

I think there are shades of grey. He never previously brutally battered anyone enough to break bones or send them to the hospital, as far as I know. But he had a volatile temper and lashed out violently, slapping, punching, shoving people.

I wonder what MR would said about the others exhibiting his behavior to him.

 

[azgrandma]

I believe the term is "crime of passion" where someone commits a crime from a sudden impulse of rage, no premeditation. An example would be Hubby walks in, catches wife in bed with best friend, pulls his gun out and shots, someone ends up killed.

Premediation doesn't have to be hours, days, weeks or months. All you need is the forethought of the crime and reasonable time to have stopped the action.

 

[Dee10]

You're either a violent abuser or you're not. (General you)

According to our verified insider, MR was a violent abuser. If you couple that with drinking and specific confrontation, then you have a very angry, violent person.

Violent people don't tend to use restraint, especially when drinking and/or confronted with certain things. IF MR flew into a fit of rage, it was very violent based on the picture we have of MR. JMO

Not necessarily true, I had a very violent b/f when I was around 20. He was strangling me to the point I was almost passing out. Luckily, although he me pinned on the bed my head was hitting the wall & a neighbor in the next apt. came to do a wellness check & threatened to call police. Many times I was very injured and never was there blood, except once after he drove me off a deck, my head cement. Although, I had a head injury but only a couple drops of blood came out of my ear. I was very lucky to get rid of him!

ETA to add if I had died & he got rid of me their would have been no evidence of a crime.

 

[Bayou Mistress]

I believe the term is "crime of passion" where someone commits a crime from a sudden impulse of rage, no premeditation. An example would be Hubby walks in, catches wife in bed with best friend, pulls his gun out and shots, someone ends up killed.

Premediation doesn't have to be hours, days, weeks or months. All you need is the forethought of the crime and reasonable time to have stopped the action.

Yes, and why did hubby walk into the bedroom with a gun? Or did he fetch it from the nightstand drawer? That would have to be determined before premeditation was decided in your example.

I don't believe that MR killed Dylan, premeditated or as a crime of passion. I can not be convinced that Dylan stirred enough anger in his father for even an accidental attack.

 

[cluciano63]

Children who are killed by their parents are not responsible for "stirring" anger of the parent, yet it still happens, far too often. If a two-year old can "exasperate" a parent into violence, certainly a teenage boy could do so. JMO

 

[Bayou Mistress]

Children who are killed by their parents are not responsible for "stirring" anger of the parent, yet it still happens, far too often. If a two-year old can "exasperate" a parent into violence, certainly a teenage boy could do so. JMO

You are right. It's not a child's fault, ever. What I should have said is that I can not think of a reason that MR would become angry enough at Dylan to harm him.

 

[Dee10]

I find violent or volatile people have poor coping skills. They seem to let things build up & then blow at an easy target. It is never their fault though; everyone else is to blame for their problems. Funny, that once to have been with an abuser, you can spot one a mile away.

 

[cluciano63]

You are right. It's not a child's fault, ever. What I should have said is that I can not think of a reason that MR would become angry enough at Dylan to harm him.

Several little children have been killed by a parent due to potty training issues. I imagine a teen boy could unwittingly provoke a parent prone to violence in many ways. Teens can be very provoking on many levels, just being themselves. JMO

 

[Deleted member 39678]

You are right. It's not a child's fault, ever. What I should have said is that I can not think of a reason that MR would become angry enough at Dylan to harm him.

I'm not seeing a clear or obvious motive either.

 

[azgrandma]

Children who are killed by their parents are not responsible for "stirring" anger of the parent, yet it still happens, far too often. If a two-year old can "exasperate" a parent into violence, certainly a teenage boy could do so. JMO

Exactly! How many times do you hear that the parent killed the child because they wet their pants, or because they were crying, or because.................

That upsets me, I understand that people need or want to know the why. But the "why" isn't because the child cried, it's because the parent has serious anger and control issues. So many times people blame the victim without really knowing that they are doing just that.

Why didn't your report the abuse/sexual assualt?
Did anyone ever see him/her strike you before?
She was walking alone at night down an alley, when she was attacked.
The intruder entered through her unlocked back door.
The child wouldn't stop crying so he/she shook him/her.

 

[aust amateur slueth]

Exactly! So many times people blame the victim without really knowing that they are doing just that.

Why didn't your report the abuse/sexual assualt?
Did anyone ever see him/her strike you before?
She was walking alone at night down an alley, when she was attacked.
The intruder entered through her unlocked back door.
The child wouldn't stop crying so he/she shook him/her.

when people question the victims behaviour they minimise the responsibility of the abuser/attacker/murderers who committed the crime.

victims are revictimised when people suggest that their actions led to the crime being committed against them.

 

[La Louve]

You are right. It's not a child's fault, ever. What I should have said is that I can not think of a reason that MR would become angry enough at Dylan to harm him.

What if MR was angry not at Dylan but because of Dylan? We know Dylan had been moved six hours away from his father, we know that custody was changed to MR's disadvantage, we know that child support was changed to MR's disadvantage, <modsnip>, we know that Dylan spoke to the family court Judge in private, with sealed records. All of that paints a picture to me of an MR whose world is crumbling, and there before him is the one person who represents all of that - Dylan himself. Not Dylan's mom, not the attorneys, not the judge, not Cory, not MH, but Dylan.

And then Dylan is a day late getting there, cutting into MR's time with his son. Dylan's tired, he's probably cranky and hungry, he's distracted texting all his friends, he's frustrated with the poor cell reception, his dad won't let him visit his friends that night..........

Add that in to MR's obvious (to me) lack of emotional maturity and I can see a lot of reasons why anger might have been a factor in whatever happened to Dylan. And that could have been expressed in either some premeditated act of abduction/hiding, or impulsive physical violence/harm to Dylan.

 

[asyousay]

IMO, Dylan left his father's house under his own power. He either met someone by design, stumbled into the wrong person, or was involved in an accident.

But that never explains away with him just not communicating with the world AFTER 9-30PM Sunday night. I believe there is a reason for that unexplained silence MOO