CO - Gannon Stauch, 11, found deceased, Colorado Springs, El Paso County, 27 Jan 2020 *Arrest* #59

[iamshadow21]

Friday maybe?

Could have been. To be frank, I'm on GMT+10 here, and nocturnal, too, right now, so everything is nearly a day behind "my" time and it's all blurring together. And Bethel was on the stand a while. All I know was that it was shown AFTER the hugely long station interview.

MOO

 

[10ofRods]

Could have been. To be frank, I'm on GMT+10 here, and nocturnal, too, right now, so everything is nearly a day behind "my" time and it's all blurring together. And Bethel was on the stand a while. All I know was that it was shown AFTER the hugely long station interview.

MOO

Glad you're still here!

 

[Erutan]

Am never going to catch up with this case, but have been reading these latest threads and some of the article links.
Disgusting, vicious, and nasty behavior towards this young boy, and prob. his sister shared in some of the abuse -- imo !

Cannot imagine having to defend LS.
Would be the hardest job ever.
Poor boy having to live with that manipulative cold woman in fear of his life.
Not all that happy with his dad, either.
He must have known how she acted when he was away.
Did she hurt Gannon and his little sister when he was home as well ?
My .02.

 

[10ofRods]

Prosecution struck the question, I understand it wasn't answered.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1648091725053964288

I don't love your post because of its content, but because this point needed to be drawn out.

IMO. Thank you.

 

[iamshadow21]

Glad you're still here!

I shouldn't be, I should have been asleep two hours ago. Trial starts again in a bit over twelve hours and I haven't slept yet! Future me is going to hate present me tomorrow. I'm a grouchy bear if I get under eight hours, and take at least an hour awake before I can form sentences. If I'm not present and correct at 9am like Judge Warner, you'll all know I overslept.

MOO

 

[kaen]

I can believe that LS didn’t usually show outward signs of “extra” angst against Gannon. It sounds like she was horrible to everyone. Plus at H’s age (teen) she may not have been home that much to see everything. School, plus working.

When you live with a person like LS, there are many things that just are not clear or known. Adult victims of parents who psychologically and physically abused them often think that they were the worst treated but if you talk to their siblings, each sibling usually has a belief that they suffered more egregiously. When you are trying to survive you don't notice the horrible things that your sibling experience at the time.

In the parenting style of LS and AS, it appears that AS was the more lenient one with the kids but was hard on LS about her actions. HH knew better than to question her mom. We could see how LS was wearing down Gannon on the candle video so he was probably getting it worse at that point in time because he was less compliant and had physical issues like the toileting stuff. And, Gannon's sister was probably always trying to be "good" as that is a where the baby of the family often falls. If you didn't do what LS wanted, you were sure to be on the hook. In that sense none of these kids would think that anyone was singled out because LS seemed to equally apply her discipline. I can believe that HH thought there was equal treatment. Usually the unequal treatment issue is dissected and understood when the kids are adults and begin to detail the abuse they suffered--- then it is more easily seen what was experienced, and, yes, usually there is one child who gets abused more but all would claim the difficulty and feel that their treatment was harsher or, worse yet, done because of family values or out of love. It is clear that LS was seeing Gannon as a problem that blocked independence and he probably represented AS in her eyes.

 

[10ofRods]

I can believe that LS didn’t usually show outward signs of “extra” angst against Gannon. It sounds like she was horrible to everyone. Plus at H’s age (teen) she may not have been home that much to see everything. School, plus working.

Certain people are equal opportunity con artists/abusers.

They transfer their abuse and rage around the family. Makes it harder for the others to work together. It's a known strategy of grifters and malingerers. AKA "evil" here on this forum, at times.

It's entirely possible that Tee showed equal affection to HH (there are some affectionate videos of them somewhere), and to AS (he clearly thought she was safe to leave his kids with and also to Gannon and LS).

That doesn't mean she's not an abuser. Or a con. AS walks on tiptoes around her in his phone calls (and she acts like that's normal behavior from him - in fact, IMO, she relies upon him believing her).

IMO.

 

[Love Never Fails]

Friday 1:17.00

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube.

www.youtube.com

Thanks so much.

 

[LightandReason]

Just watched the autopsy testimony again. 18 sharp force injuries. 4 blunt force injuries. 1 gun shot injury. In light of all the testimony so far, seems like this was the progression: determined to kill him by pushing him off the cliff during the hike. Foiled in that. Too many people and then he had the accident and she had to bring him home. Then, determined to kill him by knocking him out with some drug, and while he slept on the sofa, put an accelerant on the carpet then set it on fire with the candle, thinking she could get out of the house at last minute after fire grew in basement and she could claim it too big to go rescue him. Foiled in that. He woke up and put the fire out himself, seriously burning his arms and maybe other parts of his body as well. She gaslighted him into thinking he somehow caused it by knocking over the candle. Didn't take him to hospital, not in fear of being charged with abuse as she had that covered with the gaslighting and candle story. She didn't take him because her goal was to kill him. Next day, gave him all Al's pain killers and maybe other things, put him in the car and drove to Petco, thinking he'd die of the overdose in the car. Having already set up his 'drug use' with the bath salts bit, her plan was to drop his body somewhere he'd be found. She could claim he ran away either ashamed of the fire or to kill himself. Foiled in that. He didn't die of the overdose. So by the time she got him home, she had been foiled in three different attempts to kill him over two days. Narcissists cannot deal with frustration and they certainly can't deal with things not going their way three different times. I think her determination to kill him once and for all - her frustration at the failed attempts, explains even more than her hatred of him and anger at Al, the multiple stabbings, blunt force blows, and finally gun shot. She was not about to suffer another defeat. The level of premeditation, the level of disregard for his life, his feelings, his suffering - it's just beyond all comprehension. She is evil incarnate. I think the Prosecution is building toward a very powerful timeline that shows no sudden outburst of insanity, but rather a very cold, very calculated, very persistent determination to murder an 11 year old boy.

 

[10ofRods]

Wonder what damnable lies L has told attorneys about HH?
Why was there no decomp odor from Gannons body? Too cold outside?

She bought a baking soda based cleaner (well, HH bought it for her mom). She also bought talcum powder and baby oil. If you've ever studied ancient embalming (think Medieval times or the Egyptians) or googled it, you'd know that if you want to preserve a dead body the very first step is rubbing it in fat/oil. (Don't feel bad if you didn't know this - most of us have no reason to; I can remember people questioning my study of ancient embalming techniques - but I'm an anthropologist, we study blood spatter and ancient embalming among other things)

Tee lowered the temp in the basement by opening the windows (Step 1). Then she sent HH to the store to buy certain things including a baking soda (alkaline) powder and an oil (baby oil and I think also baby lotion). It's possible Tee thought that if the products were labeled "baby" and she was ever caught, she could just say that she was attending to Gannon properly.

So, she oils him up (and that action may have delayed rigor - she needs to get him into the suitcase before rigor mortis sets in). She's uneducated, so she doesn't know that some of her actions are contradictory.

She gets him into the suitcase and covers him with the baking soda based cleanser (I think I heard that right). But the suitcase itself is designed to be essentially airtight (people have been murdered simply by being put into one - they are almost airtight in a world where almost nothing is airtight).

Each day must have been hell for Tee, who probably realized that eventually, there would be some smell. But, in the end, that was saved for the workers who discovered the body - but did NOT smell anything until they unzipped the case.

I hate recounting all this and hope no criminals are reading.

IMO.

 

[10ofRods]

Isn't that when T changed her plea to NGRI?

This makes sense and may help make harmony here on WS.

Up until then, T was maintaining her innocence. Then, HH realizes that her mother has admitted guilt to the actual crime!!!

But is claiming to be insane. A pretense and a ruse. A false plea. So HH turns State's witness.

And then we have today's testimony.

IMO.

 

[kaen]

Sounds like LS has always been an unstable nut job. How she managed to land AS is beyond me. She knew if she was caught hurting Gannon she was going to lose the lifestyle she had with AS, and would be back to being a desperate woman, always on the move because she couldn't hold a job or keep a place to live.

HH has got to be so wounded inside. Her own mother doesn't even care how her actions hurt HH. No remorse or tears while listening to her daughter on the stand, she is ice cold. I love that HH is completing her education and appears to be thriving in her personal life right now (source, her IG account). LS can sit in prison and know her daughter is everything that LS wasn't, and wanted to be, beautiful and successful, without having to lie about her education, qualifications, and references.

I think that LS presented as a good mom who had a "very good" daughter that she raised. We saw today how HH was compliant at 17 in the ways that very few 17 year olds might be. If AS was looking for a partner who mirrored his values, I think that LS seemed like she fit that bill-- worked in special education, had high expectations of her daughter being obedient, hyper to obsessive on cleanliness. He was in and out of town so he did not see her "T-ness" until later I think. Initially, he didn't have custody of the kids so any issues that would arise there would not be seen. It was when things were less than ideal with him being away and the neediness of the younger kids that I think the world started to turn upside down.

 

[10ofRods]

He's making me angry.

Many families use code words.

Jmo

For "normal Mom things"?

I respect your views immensely - I assume you mean they have code words for emergencies, not for normal things? I missed a lot of this afternoon's testimony so I apologize for not understanding, but this is definitely something to unpack.

IMO>

 

[10ofRods]

"So you've known your mom you're whole life..."

I think that was a question.

He's just using up his minutes.

I think he was trying to drive home a point about sanity to the jury.

Who knows T better than HH? Signs of abuse, but no actual "insanity" is the point.

He was using his minutes pretty well to drive home the point that the person in this story who has known T the longest...thinks she's sane.

IMO.

 

[10ofRods]

Good Question. I’d love to know what made Harley see the light. I’m just really glad she did.

It was the insanity plea, from everything I've gathered. In Nov, she learned her mom had filed an insanity plea and that complete a loop for her.

She knows her mother is NOT INSANE.

IMO.

Did Tolini just say HH would manipulate truth for her benefit?

Wow and now he’s calling her out for saying she lost her parents.

I want to grab this guy through my screen and slap him.

I misread that as "scalp him." And was sort of wanting to agree (in the non-fatal sense).

Then I looked at who was posting and re-read. I didn't listen, I will do that in the middle of the night when I'm already perturbed by world events. Esp. this one.

IMO.

 

[KooshBall]

<modsnip: Quoted post was removed>
She probably learned at a very young age to shut down her feelings and emotions. Look at who raised her. Expecting anyone that was raised by LS to behave "normal" is ignoring the damage that childhood stress and/or trauma does to the developing brain.

 

[10ofRods]

Bbm.
Doubtful.
But HH could have come forward sooner.
Much sooner.
She may have literally been afraid she could be killed as well, I'll give her that !
Just my take on it.

Surely could have been fear of death.

I'm going to follow Maslow. For a teen, fear of "not belonging to family" is a huge thing. Going up against Mother is even bigger (Freud, Maslow, many others). She had not yet individuated (T knew that and manipulated accordingly).

Even if not consciously or unconsciously fearing death, HH feared the disapproval and abuse of her mother. What would she have come forward about?

HH knew that if things stacked up against her mom, she'd be called to trial - as she has been. And now she's pretty much all alone (do you see her lawyer there? Do we know if she has one? Seems to me she does not). A lot of young people are afraid to speak at all and HH was trained to be afraid of speaking up to her own mother - the one person on Earth who is supposed to be always safe and nurturant.

IMO>

 

[Trooper]

Interesting testimony from HH , a totally different HH from her previous TikTok presence, which was that of a girl filled with confidence, which I hope she regains in full.


Chance. Would she have ?.... Could she have?? ...Did Chance, as husbands are sometimes inclined to do, 'take against her, not believe her?? Much more socially acceptable to be a widow rather than an abandoned wife/partner. Much more attracting of sympathy and assistance. And one doesn't have to deal with them again, about school, visits, etc.

And to me, naming the dog after the dead previous partner and father of HH , and at the same time lying about his manner of death....bizarre, grotesque, ....

Allowing the girl to name the dog, or naming it herself... a little insider joke with herself , perhaps, hearing her daughter call the dog by that name, and calling it herself by that name..... It just cemented in her psychopathy to me, Not mad, but bad. To the bone. HH, L, even Albert were really lucky to be still standing, is how I see it.

 

[10ofRods]

Someone please correct me if I heard wrong:

did HH say it was 11.22 when she was told that her mother had plead NGRI, and that it was explained to her then, what that meant?

I think so, yes. And given that there are many legal definitions of NGRI, I'm pretty sure that a 20 year old would not know.

So..she admits she thought her mother innocent until then. Which is assumed by some to be bizarre, but I didn't get out from under some of my parental indoctrination (which included justification of abuse and other things I now believe are wrong) until I was 18-19 (and moved out of the parental household).

I assume I am not alone in that. Kids mature even later now than in the early 70's, when I launched (got myself out of the parental home at 18 years, 3 months). And my parents weren't *that* bad by comparison. I noticed even back then that the kids with the really abusive parents launched later (or launched very early, with bad consequences).

I hope no one forgets what it is like to be a dependent, abused 17 year old girl. And yes, I am slightly implying that life on the streets or striking out on one's own in a house of peers is a bit more difficult for girls than boys.

IMO. I think the statistics and research support this opinion though.

 

[californiagem]

I just finished watching today testimony. I'm so proud of HH. This must have been hard for her, to testify in front of her. 10 of rods is correct that we don't see things about our parents until we are out from under their influence. I'm old and still look back at my childhood and realize things now. I think maybe it took HH a little longer, but it's got to break your heart to know your mom's a monster and you unwittingly helped her. Cross examine by defense was a wash, a big fat nothing because they truly have nothing. Just a narcissis. Until today though, I never realized what kicked things off was him having the accident while hiking. Imo.