CO - Gannon Stauch, 11, found deceased, Colorado Springs, El Paso County, 27 Jan 2020 *Arrest* #68

[Megnut]

Maybe they want the report from Lewis because they want to get a feel for how her son writes.

 

[squareandrabbet]

IIRC, it was stated during trial to be of an opinion. moo

True... but a lot goes past, and you have to concentrate very hard, as I was told at one of the trials I juried... people get confused and tired.

sometimes they need a reminder.

 

[iamshadow21]

How many days' actual testimony were there, does anyone know?

Conventional trial wisdom says a jury will deliberate for one hour for every day of testimony, for whatever that is worth.

Oh, gosh, I have no idea, numbers aren't my thing. Every calendar week, we had four days on, three days off.

MOO

 

[SandyQLS]

I agree that the truly mentally ill generally never leave the mental institution.

The first Colorado NGRI defense case I ever followed was James Holmes (Aurora Theater shooter), and I've long said that if Holmes did not meet criminal insanity, little chance for other defendants.

Not only was Holmes a schizophrenic with a long history of mental treatment right up to the murders, but at his arraignment, the defense requested the Court delay Holmes entering a plea, granted by the Court, and Holmes was soon after sent to CMHP for treatment, and entered a plea about 90 days later.

Holmes's trial was also delayed several times because he was in treatment. Once competent to stand trial, the jurors found the state proved him sane, the Court sentenced him to multiple life sentences in the DOC.

To be clear, nobody doubted that Holmes wasn't crazy (mentally ill), but argued he was not criminally insane pursuant to the law.

I'm not questioning the jurors' verdict --Holmes told doctors how and why his actions were wrong, and my point is that there are truly mentally ill defendants-- bordering insanity, that commit crimes-- and are nothing like LS and her faked disorders.

In this case, Holmes only spent about a month in prison (Department of Corrections) before being sent to the mental ward (CMHP) for treatment where he's remained ever since -- about 8 years now (2015).

https://www.cnn.com/2015/06/05/us/james-holmes-theater-shooting-trial/index.html

I am quoting Seattle's excellent post re: if James Holmes was not NGRI then who would be. Have hope, everybody. IMO the jury asking for the Index of exhibits means they are visual thinkers who want to review the trial in order of exhibits, recapture their evolving thought processes and feelings, find and discuss some specific points. Asking for Dr Lewis's report tells me that they were confused by her vague, circular testimony. IMO Dr Grimmet and Dr Torres were quite clear about their diagnoses.

Did any of the reporters notice if the jurors took notes?

 

[Chelly]

I can only imagine the anguish Dannon's family is experiencing while this jury is deliberating.

 

[Megnut]

FWIW I think this jury is set to find her guilty but wanted to give the defense's case fair time. Devil's advocacy. Study her report, try to give it weight.

Due diligence.

Hoping for the guilty verdict this morning.

Shackle the beast and escort her to LWOP.

 

[Kiranerys]

Not sure I like 2nd question

Why do they want Lewis’ report? It’s not worth the paper it’s printed on. I’m getting such a bad feeling. Please don’t let them be hung or NGRI.

I'm wondering if it was just to look for inconsistencies, to look and see if the reports were compiled by the same person maybe?, it was basically implied that Mr Tolini wrote the final report that was submitted to the court, and I may have missed it, but i didnt hear the witness commit to an actual diagnosis of DID, orention BPD, she basically just did " well, you'd have to be, wouldn't you?". They aye also want clarification as to when Dr Lewis thinks she was insane, because in closing Mr Tolini said that she dissociated AFTER she killed Gannon as a result of not being able to face what she has done, and if she dissociated afterwards then she was sane when she killed him, but maybe they can't decide if she was sane when she tampered with evidence, or when she drove across country to throw him over a bridge.

I don't think they believe she is or was insane. I think they are just being thorough.

 

[BadRx]

How many days' actual testimony were there, does anyone know?

Conventional trial wisdom says a jury will deliberate for one hour for every day of testimony, for whatever that is worth.

I *think* 19. Just getting because Recovery Addict labels his sessions with the day. Today is day 21.

 

[arielilane]

I thought her google searches alone would seal the deal into the verdict coming in as guilty on all counts.

The google searches were damning. In addition, what about the attorney's and Letecia's disregard for Gannon's family and the court. The jury noticed.

Imo, for an Officer of the Court to act that way was beyond belief. I expected no less from the "actress" at the defense table as she is trying her hardest to come across as insane. lol. However, I am going to give the attorney the benefit of the doubt and think that maybe he did that because he does not really care if he loses the case and actually would like to see her incarcerated for life. I know silly me, I've been known to be gullible. moo

Letecia Stauch trial: Investigators found Google searches about body decomposition, avoiding FBI, on Stauch’s phone


District Attorney Michael Allen pointed out that defense attorney Will Cook and Stauch had been looking at the Google searches on a laptop and laughing during much of that testimony.

"I don't know what's so funny over here, judge," Allen said to Judge Gregory Werner, referring to Cook and Stauch laughing at the defense table.

 

[watergirl62]

How many days' actual testimony were there, does anyone know?

Conventional trial wisdom says a jury will deliberate for one hour for every day of testimony, for whatever that is worth.

20 days of testimony.

 

[kittythehare]

Ok so they're asking for a list of exhibits, do you think that means that they haven't even began to look at the exhibits yet? There's like 700 isn't there?

This could take a long time :/

I feel sick here

i think it's likely to be a long one .
For one thing lewis would have switched them all off, even their notes wouldn't make any sense..
Now they're wedged.
Maybe they should have been made aware they would not be receiving her reports
they would have been dishonest gibberish in any case..

I couldn't tell you a single word she said..
I HATED her as much if not more than I hate Leticia...
My mind will not respond to someone like that.. it goes off somewhere by itself.
(I didn't try either, tho')

 

[arielilane]

So just 2 questions?

Yes, thus far.

 

[Soulmagent]

I thought her google searches alone would seal the deal into the verdict coming in as guilty on all counts.

I'm hoping for a swift GUILTY verdict but if there are some hold out's thinking she truly was insane (I can't even imagine how anyone could buy that!) I hope the worst we get is a hung jury. At least that way we could have her tried again. ???

I dont think they can buy the crazy she is trying to sell but the jury probably thinks she is crazy they are just trying to find the clue that tips them .
We need a hero juror .
Low key been all been worried for weeks over the issue.
So I am praying .
Her brother , Harley..everyone saying she was not crazy. The phone calls..the candle video . WE NEED to see the index ,I think ,that will probably help us relax.

 

[girlhasnoname]

Me too ! Ineed someone to hold me!

{{hugs}} virtual hugs are the best I can do, let's have faith in these jurors.

 

[arielilane]

I've also obtained a copy of the jury questions during Dr. Lewis' testimony late Wednesday. Below are the court reporter's notes from that.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1655595275678027776

 

[10ofRods]

This has been lingering in my mind for a long while. We have all sat here and said that's she's absolutely crazy (not in the legal sense) and then you had nutty Lewis sat up there said oh I think the same as you, all these stories are wacky BUT that means insanity... I am worried that like one juror's view of insanity is uneducated y'know?

I think we are gonna be here a while

I have a good education, and I am opposed from my own ethical stance to allowing character disorders (personality disorders) to be considered legal insanity. I'm also opposed to it from a procedural and legal point of view. However, I still find CO's system and the general NGRI defense puzzling.

But I know that Borderline PD has been used successfully for a NGRI defense (because Borderline PD can include episodes of psychosis, often repeated and on the shorter term side, often snapped back to reality by the other inner demands of the psyche of the Borderline personality).

I think Dr L did say that DID and Borderline resemble each other (yes, indeed they do). Borderlines may have amnesia for the psychotic episodes, but in DID, the amnesia is only experienced by some personalities with the "main personality" often having the amnesia. In DID, the amnesia is explained by disassociation rather than psychosis (usually). Since there are no brain studies (that I know of and I've looked) of someone actively experiencing psychosis during either of these conditions, I don't know what to say about it. We have brain studies of schizophrenics, as a contrast. And bipolars. And depressives.

Since most acts of extreme violence (I would say excepting those committed by ASPD/sociopaths) are conducted in some kind of altered state (my opinion), it's a slippery slope. I think the whole insanity defense should spin around totally involuntary and unwitting mental states, by which the person's brain (through a longterm brain defect) renders them incapable of knowing they are eating someone's face or that they just killed someone they loved (in a paranoid state, thinking that person was a space alien or whatever). Even then, I'm not sure why we need a separate sentencing system for them (most prisons have psych wards, and if a state doesn't have a prison psych ward, they should make/build one if they're going to have this "they can get out when they're better" rubric).

Not all states have that rubric. In California, we still sentence NGRI defendants as required by law, they just serve their time elsewhere than a state prison (a state mental hospital - we have a couple of them). If they get better, they can go to prison (IME, they prefer to stay at the hospital and for good reasons). Also, in California, the determination about sanity is made by either the Court or by the Jury.

But we do not let them out once they get better, they have to serve their allotted time.

IMO.

 

[Smccat]

Hopefully it’s just one juror who has brought up this Lewis report and the rest are just being considerate to him or her.

 

[Cindizzi]

I don’t blame the Jury for wanting to see both reports.

The first one sent to Tolini even Lewis doesn’t call it a report. She called it “ initial impressions “ and did not give an opinion or diagnosis of insanity.

At 6:50:00


Mr Young questions her about it and asked her WHO wrote your final report?!

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[Turkeytrot]

I can understand wanting to see the report. That testimony was a mess and hard to follow. I think that's a great question and also a good reminder hearing that it's not admitted as evidence. Just reinforces for me that it's solely an opinion and not hard facts.

I imagine the written report would be much like a CVS receipt. Long, rambling that really says a whole lot of nothin' and just ends up in the trash.

 

[JusCurious]

Because her testimony was rambling and incoherent and they were hoping to make sense of it with what she (or someone close to her) put on paper? Not permitted, though.

MOO

I agree... I interpret the request as trying to determin if she ever definitively stated a reason for her "diagnosis" so that they can move on and disregard Lewis as credible.