CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #26 *ARREST*

[heartgoesout]

Marking spot.

 

[Irmese]

Logical thinking leads us to believe that if LE event A happened one day, and then LE event B happened the next day, then event B happened because of what happened on the first day.


So what was the digging for? Did trucks leave with dirt? I don't remember this being reported. It would take time to sort through huge amounts of dirt. But why else would you dig? I can't imagine a body was found there.

What about the large barn on the property? This is a location where PF could deal with a body out of sight. Could there be blood or tissue evidence in the barn? Activity to make sure KB was never found?

From satellite images before the warrant, the dig areas looks like a small ravine and not a septic field. Could cleaning fluids or acids have been dumped into it, maybe with trace evidence of human tissue?

Not sure what my point is, beyond that I think we will may eventually find the search warrant at the ranchette was more important than the condo searches.

They went there looking for something.

I'm thinking maybe they don't have their grey water going into the septic tank, probably only from the toilets or bathrooms. Maybe this ravine is where their grey water drained into, which could be the baths, showers, kitchen and bathroom sinks and their washing machine. But I agree, that wasn't where the septic tank was.

I wondered about the shed off to the left of the house. He would be less likely to be seen by someone there than in the barn if someone drove up to their house/barn unexpectedly.

MOO.

Edited for proper pronoun usage.

 

[Curiousobserver]

I just don't know anymore. If he didn't want a body found, that wouldn't be where to put it. Also, that means he wasn't hoping for any $$ seeing it would take a long while for an insurance co. to pay out. If he DID want a body found, that would be stupid place to put it. It would then have made more sense to put it on the way to ID to shore up his story that she was headed that way with someone to visit her granny and she came to foul play at the hands of someone else along the way. JMT

If they planned this for months why not take her car with her in it on the trip to Idaho and then just drive it into a lake along the way? The final details of this are going to be weird I think.

 

[Deleted member 718]

We already know this, but it's the first time I've seen the CBI comment on Kelsey:

CBI‏Verified account @CBI_Colorado
We've received a number of media calls about the human remains located in Aguilar (near Trinidad). While the coroner has not made official identification, CBI agents do not believe the remains are Kelsey Berreth. https://www.colorado.gov/pacific/cbi/news/%E2%80%8B%E2%80%8Bhuman-remains-found-aguilar …

12:19 PM - 8 Jan 2019

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

I keep thinking about the wording of the conditions concerning who PF can,and can not contact according to the arrest affidavit. Specifically the ( Other than family members). Part.
Can our Verified lawyers explain what this means?
TIA.

 

[otto]

I haven’t read through posts since last night, but in thinking about this case I’m finding it hard to believe that KK’s involvement is innocent. It’s obvious PF planned Kelsey’s demise, and it was not a sudden crime of passion. I don’t know when we’ll find out more about the relationship between PF and KK, but it’s too much of a “coincidence” that KK would be the one who was disposing of Kelsey’s cell phone. I’m almost convinced she sent those texts as requested by PF. Perhaps there is someone else in Idaho that is involved, but again, it’s such a “coincidence” that the phone would end up half an hour from where KK lives. I’m sure LE has detailed tracking on PF and KK through credit cards or cell phone records, and I will look forward to hearing more on that when that information is released. My question about KK is when did LE latch on to her information, and when did she start talking? I’m sure they have lots of eyes on her if she’s not in protective custody.

I think PF is perfectly capable of committing this murder by himself, and I would guess he probably just drove over to Kelsey’s on Thanksgiving Day under the guise of taking her and little K out to dinner, or at the very least picking up little K.

What surprises me most is that on the initial search of Kelsey’s home, LE didn’t notice anything that stood out as a murder scene. Perhaps PF did a great clean up job, but obviously on the second search by LE, they found sufficient evidence to charge PF with murder. Was he able to paint over the evidence so it wasn’t noticed right away? Did someone tip off LE or did they find digital evidence that a murder took place there? I still have questions on all of this, as I know many of you do as well. Whatever happened in Kelsey’s home that day and in the days after must not have triggered suspicion by neighbors, or at least we haven’t heard about it.

All of the above IMHO ...

I think the sequence of events might give us a clue. Wasn't the trailer waste searched, then the acreage searched and then Kelsey's home searched? If Kelsey was removed from her home wrapped in a sheet, and there's a matching sheet at her home, that would be evidence of something - at the very least a good reason to do luminol tests.

 

[MassGuy]

If they planned this for months why not take her car with her in it on the trip to Idaho and then just drive it into a lake along the way? The final details of this are going to be weird I think.

That’s the confusing thing. What exactly PF planned to make this look like, and how and if his plan changed along the way.

The cell phone activity makes sense if he was trying to create a scenario in which Kelsey left on some sort of a road trip.

But it makes no sense if she didn’t have the means to get there.

Chris Watts probably planned to make it look like Shanann left on her own, but his plan was thwarted when his time was cut short by SW’s friend.

He didn’t have a chance to dump her belongings and vehicle.

PF had over a week to make this look the way he wanted it to look, and the way he made it look doesn’t make a lot of sense.

Because of the car.

So one of three things could have occurred:

We are wrong about how he planned to make this look.

Something inhibited him from dumping her car.

He’s a dumbass.

I’m going with the latter.

 

[Jazzy5980]

Marking spot.

Reminded of my little dog every time I see this post.

 

[Curiousobserver]

That’s the confusing thing. What exactly PF planned to make this look like, and how and if his plan changed along the way.

The cell phone activity makes sense if he was trying to create a scenario in which Kelsey left on some sort of a road trip.

Bu... truncated for brevity.

My vote is dumb- he planned for months and then had ten days- this is the best plan he could come up with?

 

[Lmustang89]

Human remains found at Colorado truck stop about 100 miles from area where missing mom Kelsey Berreth was last seen

 

[Kapua]

That’s the confusing thing. What exactly PF planned to make this look like, and how and if his plan changed along the way.

The cell phone activity makes sense if he was trying to create a scenario in which Kelsey left on some sort of a road trip.

But it makes no sense if she didn’t have the means to get there.

Chris Watts probably planned to make it look like Shanann left on her own, but his plan was thwarted when his time was cut short by SW’s friend.

He didn’t have a chance to dump her belongings and vehicle.

PF had over a week to make this look the way he wanted it to look, and the way he made it look doesn’t make a lot of sense.

Because of the car.

So one of three things could have occurred:

We are wrong about how he planned to make this look.

Something inhibited him from dumping her car.

He’s a dumbass.

I’m going with the latter.

The last one is a given. ;-)
There were 3 ways he could have staged Kelsey's disappearance: 1) she committed suicide, 2) she ran off, 3) she was killed by someone else.

I cannot begin to understand why, if he was going for #2, he did not take one of her vehicles somewhere. Yes, there's the problem of getting back, but nobody is going to buy that she went on a road trip without one of her perfectly good vehicles. ETA and without her young daughter. MOO

 

[Hatfield]

That’s the confusing thing. What exactly PF planned to make this look like, and how and if his plan changed along the way.

The cell phone activity makes sense if he was trying to create a scenario in which Kelsey left on some sort of a road trip.

But it makes no sense if she didn’t have the means to get there.

Chris Watts probably planned to make it look like Shanann left on her own, but his plan was thwarted when his time was cut short by SW’s friend.

He didn’t have a chance to dump her belongings and vehicle.

PF had over a week to make this look the way he wanted it to look, and the way he made it look doesn’t make a lot of sense.

Because of the car.

So one of three things could have occurred:

We are wrong about how he planned to make this look.

Something inhibited him from dumping her car.

He’s a dumbass.

I’m going with the latter.

Im going with Door #3 too.

Wouldnt it be something if we find out he dumped her purse and body down a mineshaft and went back to retrieve her car but he had forgotten the keys to her car were in her purse.

 

[Mimi in London]

Im going with Door #3 too.

Wouldnt it be something if we find out he dumped her purse and body down a mineshaft and went back to retrieve her car but he had forgotten the keys to her car were in her purse.

I think you may have hit the nail on the head.

 

[MassGuy]

Im going with Door #3 too.

Wouldnt it be something if we find out he dumped her purse and body down a mineshaft and went back to retrieve her car but he had forgotten the keys to her car were in her purse.

Ha! Wow, that would be poetic justice at its finest.

Poor PF can’t get out of his own way.

 

[Jethro4WS]

I think the sequence of events might give us a clue. Wasn't the trailer waste searched, then the acreage searched and then Kelsey's home searched? If Kelsey was removed from her home wrapped in a sheet, and there's a matching sheet at her home, that would be evidence of something - at the very least a good reason to do luminol tests.

No. The order was KB's home was searched on the 12th of December, PF's (actually SF's) property searched on the 14th and 15th of December, the trash search was on the 17th of December, KB's home searched on the 19th and again on December 20th. I believe that law enforcement returned to KB's home at least one more time after PF's arrest.

 

[Trudie]

I have a bad feeling she will probably never be found

It seems like we often think a body won’t be found. Then, a jogger, dog walker, hiker or hunter stumbles upon remains. Jmo

 

[Seattle1]

Sam Kraemer‏ @SamKraemerTV
Sam Kraemer Retweeted KOAA News5

Other media outlets are reporting these remains could be Kelsey Berreth. @CBI_Colorado told us they don’t believe that’s true. #KelseyBerreth #PatrickFrazee @KOAA

12:55 PM - 8 Jan 2019

 

[Trudie]

From the demeanor I see in court, this is going to trial. JMO.

I can’t draw conclusions after seeing him briefly.
I have no way of knowing his demeanor, prior to KB’s disappearance.

 

[MassGuy]

It seems like we often think a body won’t be found. Then, a jogger, dog walker, hiker or hunter stumbles upon remains. Jmo

Yes. But most people don’t have months to plan what to do with a body, nor do they have several days in which to actually carry out the disposal.

My guess that she wasn’t dumped above ground, or buried in a shallow grave.

 

[MyBelle]

That’s the confusing thing. What exactly PF planned to make this look like, and how and if his plan changed along the way.

The cell phone activity makes sense if he was trying to create a scenario in which Kelsey left on some sort of a road trip.

But it makes no sense if she didn’t have the means to get there.

Chris Watts probably planned to make it look like Shanann left on her own, but his plan was thwarted when his time was cut short by SW’s friend.

He didn’t have a chance to dump her belongings and vehicle.

PF had over a week to make this look the way he wanted it to look, and the way he made it look doesn’t make a lot of sense.

Because of the car.

So one of three things could have occurred:

We are wrong about how he planned to make this look.

Something inhibited him from dumping her car.

He’s a dumbass.

I’m going with the latter.

I think after he killed KB he realized that her home is so "exposed" it made it impossible for PF to take her car without being seen doing it. JMO