Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #30

[katydid23]

It is a unconstitutional search and seizure if it is not based on probable cause.

The defenses entire rebuttal was based on the premise that the prosecution did not provide circumstances that amounted to probable cause because their statement of "numerous items of evidence have been collected and are in the process of being sent to the Colorado Bureau of Investigation for testing" is vague.

The implication is they want specific reasons why the evidence from their client is required.

But that is ridiculous, on it's face, that there is no probable cause for the palm prints.

The defendant disposed of three STRANGLED dead bodies. Obviously, there are going to be possible palm prints on the necks of those dead bodies, that the defendant, himself, dumped.

What more probable cause could there be?

 

[gitana1]

Except she was a mother trying to do what is best for her family, she is not a paediatrician a teacher with years of training or a social worker.
Many, many families have the time out thing, or go to your room.
For people to point out these tiny little things as evidence that she could have killed them is ridiculous to me.
We have a father who dumped the same little girls in crude oil and lied his head off about it, and people are thinking that she may have killed them because she put them in time out, she made them sit on their fathers knee dressed as santa.
He did nothing but sit there like a big log when they were scared.
Why didn't he comfort them? They were on his knee.

I believe that if any of us was to observe the parenting of every single person on here insisting SW was a terrible parent, we would find a ton of things they did or do wrong.

I believe every last person criticizing this poor woman has ignored their crying child, yelled at them, swatted them, lost their cool, or did other things - repeatedly - that many other people could criticize.

No parent is perfect no matter how judgmental they may act.

The difference here is SW was under pressure to generate a lot of footage for social media. It was part of her business.

So not knowing there would be multitudes picking apart her every move, she didn't edit much. She didn't think about how things might look to a few, if she and her babies were murdered by her lying husband who then tried to blame her.

But as I think Katydid said, the people who knew her and interacted with the family a lot, with the exception of one anonymous insider who believes CW, they ALL state this was a good mom who lived for her kids and adored them.

I just keep going back to her own birthday video. (Not linked here). In which she stares in total adoration at her little girls who are trying to sing happy birthday to her, which they apparently are just learning.

Her eyes are just full of tender love. It's her day but all she cares about is how cute and adorable her babies are.

This is a bad mom?

Shanann Watts

 

[PommyMommy]

YES, I have been hoping for this case to be divided into two different threads. Is this something WS would consider?

Personally, I don't mind seeing the opposing views if they are based on facts and evidence, but I think that's what is missing here. And we apparently have posters with actual theories that SW killed her babies, but they're keeping those theories secret. So, it's literally impossible to understand.
MOO

 

[Medstudies]

'Absolutely No Evidence' Shan'ann Watts Killed Her Daughters: Police Source

A source close to the investigation tells PEOPLE that Chris’ alleged defense is not plausible.

“There is absolutely no evidence that she killed her children,” the source tells PEOPLE in this week’s issue. “None at all. And there is physical evidence to tie him to their murders. Strangulation is a very personal way to kill someone, with a lot of physical contact. Just based on the preliminary evidence, everything is consistent with him killing them all.”

Not looking good for him. The police sources are saying that because there was so much ‘physical contact’ during the strangulation, they were left with a lot of physical evidence, which ties HIM to the murders.

I think that means that there are ‘handprint’ bruises visible on those little necks. And those hands are big male hands, not smaller female hands. Which is why his defense team is trying so hard to scramble out of the way, to avoid giving his prints over.

They are even calling up his ‘constitutional rights’ to avoid handing over his prints. Talk about a stretch. CW is pathetic, IMO.

“lot of physical evidence, which ties HIM to the murders.”

so assuming this statement is true, it would definitely eliminate SW.

Which makes me wonder what his Plan B defense is? That some deranged hippie on LSD broke in and killed them? Or that the bossy, mean, bitter wife made him do it?

 

[Jenni]

I don't know, but 50 lbs is a lot of weight. There may be a post on her FB where she talks about him starting the burn patch, but I also could have imagined that. LOL

MOO

There was a post she made about him starting the patch but I can't recall where.

 

[Layla123]

Well, we all know that you took that video to taunt and humiliate your grandson, right?

Funny is funny, but sometimes you would have to have been there to get the joke.

 

[MyBelle]

Honestly the defense filed a motion accusing the state of leaks. If I were the prosecutor I'd want a motion sealing the autopsy before it was released from the ME to even my office since the defense has already accused my office of leaking information and requested an "investigation" into it. If the defense is so worried about leaks, it should want as much as possible sealed.

When does the defense start to receive discovery? I guess I'm baffled over the fact the defense hasn't received the autopsy reports. It's been over a month.

 

[mtnlites]

Taunting=
1. To reproach in a mocking, insulting, or contemptuous manner: taunted her for wearing hand-me-down clothes. SeeSynonyms at ridicule.



So you are saying that the purpose for the picture of Bella, having a timeout, was to 'mock, and insult her in a contemptuous manner' ?

SW would have to hate her child to have that as the purpose. Do you believe that SW hated Bella?

It makes no sense to me that SW's parenting skills continue to be questioned.

 

[Backstroke10]

I believe SW loved her family more than anything in the world. There is no manual on parenting and I believe SW was striving to be the best mother she could despite having an extremely passive and seemingly apathetic husband. Whether I agree or not that every picture/video should be shared with SM doesn't matter because she was doing what she thought was best for her family. Bella and Cece look like normal, happy, well-adjusted kids and I believe that's because SW loved them with all her heart and they felt that love. I've messed up as a parent and I'm sure most of us have but if we love our kids and they know it, I think we've succeeded. IMO

 

[mtnlites]

Obviously, no one 'needs' to post a picture to SM. But pix of your toddlers getting their first haircuts, first timeouts, first missing front teeth, are all 'traditional' pictures. IMO, it is like a rite of passage.

I have a cute picture of my son at 3, sitting calmly in the timeout chair. And then my daughter at 3, sitting with her arms crossed, and yelling at us, from the chair, saying she was glad she was sitting there because she liked it, lol...

I didn't take those pictures to 'taunt' my children. I took them because they are cute and I was proud of them.

It is like a rite of passage for a child to grow to the age where they are starting to be accountable and responsible for grabbing a toy from their sibling or running into the street when they knew it was not safe. There is nothing wrong with being told to sit down for 2 minutes and think about what just happened. And then to apologize and get a big hug.

It really bothers me that some here are trying to make it out to be cruel or unusual punishment for a mom to give a 3 yr old a timeout.

When we were sent into homes for parenting skills, we were trained to teach parents to give timeouts, even to toddlers. It is a perfectly appropriate punishment. The number of minutes corresponded to their age.

 

[PommyMommy]

There was a post she made about him starting the patch but I can't recall where.

I thought I remembered seeing that. Thank you for confirming. Always nice to hear that my memory is not as far gone as I think sometimes.
MOO

 

[Alethea]

When does the defense start to receive discovery? I guess I'm baffled over the fact the defense hasn't received the autopsy reports. It's been over a month.

When the tests are complete and the coroner signs off on the final report. It can take months. They have to perform toxicology tests, particularly since the conduct of one of the deceased has been questioned. There may or may not be one glaring cause of death. The defendant could have sped this process up by not dumping the bodies in vats of crude oil but that's not here nor there.

 

[Charlot123]

Someone mentioned on a previous thread (I'm sorry I can't find the post and I'm paraphrasing here) about how possibly their relationship began to deteriorate after they began selling Thrive and doing all the videos. IMO this may be true. This is by no means an excuse for what CW did and I'm not blaming SW at all. In fact, I think they were both equal participants. Despite CW passiveness, he could have, at any time said "lets put the camera/video away". As far as the Santa video, he could have easily said something like "lets get someone else to dress up as Santa because I want to be there as Dad, the girls will be confused wondering where I am and I don't want to do that". IMO his extreme passiveness and inability to speak up led to some of their marital problems. JMO

I said the relationship started to deteriorate post-Thrive. I think they were in debt, even before Thrive, and SW was "hooked" by the prospect of making money (this is why I don't view her as too astute - making a lot in a pyramid scheme is as unrealistic as getting rich by gambling, unless you have started the pyramid). And he probably went along with her plans because it gave him the time to stray. But the anger was accruing.

 

[katydid23]

It makes no sense to me that SW's parenting skills continue to be questioned.

Not only questioned, but denounced and berated. She is being accused of taunting her children and publicly humiliating them.

 

[Alethea]

I hope nothing bad ever happens to me because all people will talk about is how I'm bossy and spent thousands of hours of my life as a "verified poster" on a true crime board.

 

[mtnlites]

Someone said, she lacked self-awareness. Maybe she did not understand how it sounded?

She was not the most thoughtful person. When she told about him courting her when she was ill, she said "I took him to my colonoscopy". Of course we know that we always are asked to bring someone for minor procedures needing anesthesia, so, no biggie, he was not there during the procedure. But to me the whole phrase sounded weird, it has nothing to do with education or anything else to understand that you should not get into such details.

So all I'd say, she was not too wise, and it constantly spilled out on her SM. If they argued, she might have said something that vexed him.

Between these two, I can imagine how things got wrong, I can even imagine someone snapping. The children, however, are beyond snapping, because I don't buy his version.

Not sure how the fact that she stated he went to her colonoscopy relates to this case at all or demonstrates her lack of intelligence. Welcome to 2018, the age of over-sharing on social media. I was Facebook living from my hospital bed last week. I have a FB friend who live tweets during her chemo sessions. I kept a very popular blog, with more than 1 million readers, that chronicled every detail of my brain surgery. My kids' favorite You Tube channel is Dr Pimple Popper. It literally documents patients getting cysts and pimples dug out.

IMO, the complaints about SW are bordering on petty. She has done no more than what millions of others do on SM.

 

[Charlot123]

Could be, but if he has a passive personality it would probably leak into all of his relationships, not just with SW.

Only if other APs were of SW's type, emotionally. Then, yes.

 

[Backstroke10]

I said the relationship started to deteriorate post-Thrive. I think they were in debt, even before Thrive, and SW was "hooked" by the prospect of making money (this is why I don't view her as too astute - making a lot in a pyramid scheme is as unrealistic as getting rich by gambling, unless you have started the pyramid). And he probably went along with her plans because it gave him the time to stray. But the anger was accruing.

Thanks Charlot123 I kept searching but couldn’t find your post. Thanks!

 

[Alethea]

Not sure how the fact that she stated he went to her colonoscopy relates to this case at all or demonstrates her lack of intelligence. Welcome to 2018, the age of over-sharing on social media. I was Facebook living from my hospital bed last week. I have a FB friend who live tweets during her chemo sessions. I kept a very popular blog, with more than 1 million readers, that chronicled every detail of my brain surgery. My kids' favorite You Tube channel is Dr Pimple Popper. It literally documents patients getting cysts and pimples dug out.

IMO, the complaints about SW are bordering on petty. She has done no more than what millions of others do on SM.

And it's not just personal use. More and more businesses are using social media to reach customers. One of my business contacts LOVES Facebook Live. He is on once a week answering questions about professional marketing. I have "appeared" on his show to talk about a Supreme Court case relevant to his clients. Social media advisors will tell you to sell "yourself" on social media and the business will follow. And I don't mean MLMs, this is advice to lawyers, doctors, accountants. My new dentist has an instagram account for his practice. My clients routinely request to add me as a friend on Facebook and then seem surprised when I post about my pets and hobbies instead of the law. It is really becoming all-consuming even if you don't want it to be.

I think whether we personally think this whole phenomenon is good and healthy is different and irrelevant to the fact that one person used social media as it is commonly used - a place to share every mundane detail of your life.

 

[PommyMommy]

When the tests are complete and the coroner signs off on the final report. It can take months. They have to perform toxicology tests, particularly since the conduct of one of the deceased has been questioned. There may or may not be one glaring cause of death. The defendant could have sped this process up by not dumping the bodies in vats of crude oil but that's not here nor there.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't know that the prosecution even has the coroner reports yet. Nothing in their motion indicates that to me, and obviously they can't turn over something to the defense that they don't have. It seems to me that they are requesting it to be sealed regardless of what it says, not because of what it says. Am I reading it wrong?
https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/19th_Judicial_District/caseofinterest/2018CR2003/[L] MOTION TO DENY DISCLOSURE OF PUBLIC RECORD PURSUANT TO CRS 24-72-204(6)(A).pdf
MOO

 

[human]

I wonder if there’s a possibility Shannan didn’t know about the delinquent HOA fees and maybe Chris told her it was paid. Perhaps he had a lot of debt she didn’t know about (mistresses ain’t free) and he felt the walls were closing in on him. Just another motive to consider.

I am guessing since she is home and gets the mail, she would know.